325 replies to this topic

[oldradagast]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 September 2017 - 10:06 AM, said:

See potential concern, YES.

Jump immediately to ZOMG NO MECHLAB?CUSTOMIZATION!?!?!?!?!?!? No.

HBS also is limiting mechs to specific roles and such, by limiting customization... NOT removing it. As I'e said probably a dozen times now... it is possible that indeed they mean none. Or NOT. There is no definitive statement to that effect in the article. Just the usual forum BS of people reading a vague statement and then supplying extra meaning to it that fits their disposition or agenda. You might recall someone doing EXACTLY the same thing over when the Madcat mkII was going to be added.

Has anyone even bothered to PM or tweet Russ for clarification? Anyone?

No idea who got ticked when the MadCat 2 was released, or what that has to do with this, but ok...

The point is that while nobody knows exactly what they intend, NOW is the time to voice concerns - not after the game is released. That, and hoping the game is designed in a very specific, narrow way to "get back" at people for MWO is just silly, yet seems to be a prime motivator for the supporters of little to no customization.

Yes, somebody probably ought to tweet or email somebody at PGI for clarification, but don't get your hopes up about a straight answer.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

oldradagast, on 17 September 2017 - 09:44 AM, said:

Tell me again which part of Battletech is historically accurate to the real world? Are there real-world Lyrans who are going to be offended if their mechs are customized "wrong?"

Now, tell me where I said the game MUST have FULL, "liquid metal" customization or it's junk?

And, finally, tell me why a game written today - in a world of games full of varying levels of customization - MUST have almost NO customization options or it is somehow "impossible to create" or "a grand insult to the true meaning of Battletech... which just so happens to be the one way I like to play the game."

Seriously, guys, just give it up. Nobody has presented a single convincing argument as to why the game must have a single level of customization options - and a very low at that - other than "that's the way *I* like to play Battletech, so everybody else is wrong." Given what can be done with games today, that's just short-sighted and petty.

Battletech does NOT have the number of rabid fans needed to support games that appeal only to one faction; a simple customization level option set at game start would allow this game to appeal to many different people. But, I guess since somebody, somewhere, might be playing the game "wrong," we'll see 100+ more posts as to why there's only one right way to play Battletech.

Ok how about this:

I want a game that represents 3025 era, starter set level, tier 1 battletech.

No customization.

The starter set gives you the initial information on economy and the like, but it doesn't give you enough to hang yourself with. it gives you, exactly what you need, to start a campaign, some light information regarding tech level's, and that's about it.

We have had unfettered, or even limited [see MW4 and MWO] customization. And we've already seen where it goes.

So look at MW5, as a reboot... starting at the most basic of levels... retrain the kiddies with training wheel's [no customization] before you hand them the keys to the superbike [customization]

The issue is, the Mechlab, has never added "depth" to the gameplay, it's only created a crutch that all players lean on unless they enforce limits on themselves.

All Mechwarrior games, to date, that have had single player games, have literally boiled down to. Boat Hard Hitting weapons or Lasers, Aim at legs, Profit.

That's it, that's the way that winning Mechwarrior has been solved since MW2. Boat Mlas[or mpulse], Aim at Legs, Profit. That means, the Mechwarrior formula of having unfettered customization, has been solved since 1995!

This doesn't add "Replayability." this doesn't add "Depth" it's a crutch the average player leans on.

So, instead, let's take away the crutch, which will, of course, change to a new crutch of people finding the optimal stock loadout... BUT, the point is, the crutch that has been in place, for so long [literally since 1995], is being taken away, [or at the very least, severaly limited] and now people are freaking out, because their "EZ"mode is being stripped from them.

It's like, the mechlab is a bloody security blanket to you people, you HAVE to have it for it to be "Mechwarrior."

I don't think you understand, what Mechwarrior really is.

[Koniving]

oldradagast, on 17 September 2017 - 09:51 AM, said:

True - their arguments are all BS anyway. If some level of customization is allowed, you can STILL play the game in stock mode for an extra challenge. This is no different than demanding a game only have a "super-hard" mode just because "stupid noobs suck and shouldn't be allowed to have fun!" except replace "noobs" with "people who like the mechlab."

Seriously, what the hell is wrong with people? We've got no shortage of bitter players who hate what MWO is and that they can't run a stock mech without dying that their think this is there chance for "revenge" so now they can force everyone else to play THEIR way in MW5 - it's nuts. Dividing the game population even further accomplishes nothing, and losing it over how somebody else is playing a SINGLE PLAYER GAME is also nuts. God, people - just grow up!

Kid, it's not "Our way." It's the "Battletech way."
The way Battletech is meant to be.

I mean you could play a wild west game with six shooters and lever action rifles the way it is meant to be played.
Or you can put in laser guns, M16s with bullets that shoot around corners, and pocket rocket launchers about the size of deringers.

Which would you actually buy if the game announced itself as a wild west shooter?

---

Battlefield "1" (World War 1) caught flak because its multiplayer classes had set weapon selections. More specifically not because of that, but because it wasn't historically accurate in that almost every "class" or occupation of soldier in the real world at the time largely preferred standard rifles (edit: but except for Assault class, none of them could use standard rifles). The support guys didn't really want SMGs because they were associated with officers and officers GOT SHOT (unless they were British). Sure, many did carry them. But there was a crapload that didn't want them and preferred the standard M1 rifle.

---

Who is going to want a science fiction mech game where instead of mechs in a dystopian universe about famine, political strife, people struggling to survive and putting your life on the line just to put a goddamn meal on the table, when you have a walking weapons platform that has min/maxed and surpassed everything else in the universe?

Where is challenge of facing an opponent that is equally matched to you, when no one can possibly be your equal since you can put anything in your machine and they can't?

You're basically asking PGI to make a ****** game so you can have your kicks...

...when you can just mod in your giant equine-peen launchers into the game yourself so you can play it your way, rather than forcing the rest of us to play it your way rather than the Battletech way.

While you're at it, throw some zombies into the wild west and blame it on aliens. Or laser guns into World War II and say it's German science because Tesla.

Edited by Koniving, 17 September 2017 - 11:20 AM.

[oldradagast]

Koniving, on 17 September 2017 - 10:42 AM, said:

Kid, it's not "Our way." It's the "Battletech way."
The way Battletech is meant to be.

While you're at it, throw some zombies into the wild west and blame it on aliens. Or laser guns into World War II and say it's German science because Tesla.

So, to be clear, your way of playing the game is the only right way, and swapping an ERPPC onto my Awesome 8Q in place of a PPC, which is the type of customization level I want to see in MW5 - not "liquid metal" customization - is the same as putting laser guns in WW2 and aliens in the old west?

Right, whatever. And then people puzzle why this IP is so much trouble and almost nobody under 50 has hear of it or cares two wits about it. Gee, I can't imagine.

Edited by oldradagast, 17 September 2017 - 10:51 AM.

[oldradagast]

CMDR Sunset Shimmer, on 17 September 2017 - 10:33 AM, said:

Ok how about this:

I want a game that represents 3025 era, starter set level, tier 1 battletech.

No customization.

I don't think you understand, what Mechwarrior really is.

Last I checked, most Mechwarrior franchise computer games had some level of customization. Also, you're talking to a guy who has already made it clear that he likes super-stock builds in MWO and never said he wanted full-on, "liquid metal" customization in MW5.

Finally, just because YOU want something in a game does mean that is the ONLY way the game has to be. Again, should DOOM only have had the hardest difficulty mode because SOME people only play games like that?

For the record, as I've already said before, I'd be fine with "in-theme" modifications. Put an ERPPC on my Awesome 8Q in place of a PPC. Swap out the LRM 20 on my Atlas for an LRM 15 so I can add more ammo and heatsinks. Maybe add some more armor to my Jagermech - you get the idea. Too much is over the type, I agree. But too little is boring and risks the game turning into "playing crap mechs until the one I like drops," which also isn't fun.

Edited by oldradagast, 17 September 2017 - 10:55 AM.

[MischiefSC]

Even beyond the "Battletech Way" stuff, it's a significant balance issue.

Liquid metal player mechs vs stock AI is a whole other balance concept than everyone having stock-ish mechs.

It also dramatically impacts the economy and progression concept as well as weapon and mech balance.

It's the same reason that every single other SP game has real limits on customization. Be that inability to have archer cavalry with elite heavy Roman infantry armor and the best special moves of every unit in Total War to being bale to give the pistol in DOOM BFG firepower and MG ROF to letting players dual wield greatswords while casting mastery spells in Skyrim. It eliminates the players balance with the game and any sense of value to progression.

Some people want that. There's mods for it. However building the game around the idea that the player does all that and no AIs can is a big balance factor both for challenge and experience, plus economy.


I'm expecting some limited customization. Just not current liquid metal level.

[oldradagast]

MischiefSC, on 17 September 2017 - 10:57 AM, said:

I'm expecting some limited customization. Just not current liquid metal level.

And that's all I want, too. But the moment you suggest that, you get:
- People who just want a fight making nutty assumptions, such as the laughable posts above where people accuse me of wanting a god-mech for expecting some level of customization... I play Awesomes, people... come on!
- "My way or the highway" types hoping this game has no customization because "that the real way Mechwarrior and Battletech are supposed to be, if you ignore the computer games and the customization rules in table top."
- Troublemakers who also want the game to have no customization just to "stick it" to the MWO players because that game has - arguably - too much customization.

Edited by oldradagast, 17 September 2017 - 11:03 AM.

[Requiemking]

To be honest, I'm of the opinion that, while there should be some degree of customisation, it should be limited. Common field refits like swapping Singles to Doubles or adding FFA, I'm fine with. I'm also fine with some degree of weapon swapping, such as swapping a Machine Gun for a Flamer(a common field refit as it provides Anit-Infantry capabilities for less risk). However, stuff like adding Endo or putting an AC20 where an AC 10 should be should require a great deal of downtime while the refit is going on.

Edited by Requiemking, 17 September 2017 - 11:03 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

oldradagast, on 17 September 2017 - 11:01 AM, said:

And that's all I want, too. But the moment you suggest that, you get:
- Trolls making nutty assumptions, such as the laughable posts above where people accuse me of wanting a god-mech for expecting some level of customization... I play Awesomes, people... come on!
- Other people hoping this game has no customization because "that the real way Mechwarrior and Battletech are supposed to be, if you ignore the computer games and the customization rules."
- Troublemakers who also want the game to have no customization just to "stick it" to the MWO players because that game has - arguably - too much customization.

or people who are pointing out those things getting called troublemakers...despite ever post they make being about us not knowing what MW5 will have. Oddly...this "troublemaker" has never made a single post in support of no customization in MW5.

Boogeyman much?

[Koniving]

oldradagast, on 17 September 2017 - 10:49 AM, said:

So, to be clear, your way of playing the game, because of table top 30+ years ago, is the only right way, and swapping an ERPPC onto my Awesome 8Q in place of a PPC, which is the type of customization level I want to see in MW5 - not "liquid metal" customization, is the same as putting laser guns in WW2.

Right, whatever.

Well, if it was built to lore, lets be perfectly honest.
Why the **** would you put anything else in there? In terms of single shot damage, there is a reason that PPCs are called SIEGE CANNONS. You know those pesky doors in MWO's silly mode with the gates and the gun? That's where you'd bring in an Awesome to blast into the walls or the gate.

The game has customization. Just not liquid metal customization.

Since they are energy based weapons, nothing really says you couldn't change them out for lasers. It'd take a while I'm sure. The real limitations were:

• Is your technician fluent enough in mech design, because until the Helm Memory Core... most actual Mech knowledge was largely lost. There's a reason (beyond a quip against player fantasies) that the Tech Manual frequently mentions "Contrary to popular belief." It is also a reference to the fact that many technicians who know their ****... don't actually know their ****. Just what they figured out either on their own or in some cases, formal education with closely guarded secrets. And even then, if you were to drag someone from a factory where the **** is made, he probably couldn't explain it to you because even he wouldn't know. "We just turn the machines on when we have the supplies." Very few facilities still had people that knew how to design new machines. Liao cheated and they just took a factory that built parts for different machines and afro-engineered the finishing process to slap parts of Marauders and other mechs together to make the Cataphract.
  
• Whether or not you have the facilities. For basic weapon swapping you didn't need terribly much. But when it was a different size you needed to do a lot of modifications to the mech itself to keep from having "design flaws". For example exposed weapon linkages were often caused by not being able to fit the weapon into the space properly, or being able to close the space around the now smaller weapon system by reshaping both the armor and the frame to suit it. Jamming issues came from redesigning sections to allow the mech to feed ammo through spaces not intended for it. Power draw issues came from when you had overclocked an energy weapon system or several energy weapon systems together that were too much for the machine's fusion engine.
  
• Included for interesting note, as this is likely what MW5: Mercs would draw off of. Battletech lore, circa 2000 (real life AD)+ thanks to Catalyst, actually has a functional "Soft point system" that is loosely referenced around Sarna.net, such as MRM-10 is easily swappable with SRM-4 and LRM-10 launcher systems. LRM-5, SRM-2 and Mortar/1 are easily swapable, etc. When a weapon system is easily swapped, the time to do so is cut down versus normal weapon changes, and the risks do not exist for "partial success". Extreme changes, such as not only different relative size but requiring tonnage and other changes to the mech to accomodate the new weapon, have a higher chance for flaws. (One example would be Koniving's Dire Wolf in Mek Wars, a captured Dire Wolf that's had repairs, parts replaced, weapon swaps, etc. done out of necessity and in doing so, it lost its Omnimech status, and many changes were quite drastic and thus have had design flaws. Two of which has been a bad reputation [so the sell value is ****] and a permanently fused right arm actuator.)

Basically, you could customize. Sometimes it took longer than you really had and you might end up with something worse than what you started with. MW5 sounds like it is going for something of a sized hardpoint/softpoint system and weapon variants to allow for more variety while keeping true to the mechs' individual identity.

So here's my return argument.
I would like you to take a V-10 engine from any given heavy duty truck and cram it into a Volkswagen Beetle, and I don't want to hear "Because of physics and shape, I can't do it."

Because that's how silly your demand is when it comes to PGI aspiring to put out a "Simulator" and your whimsical want to do whatever it is you're thinking of doing. For someone who doesn't want liquid metal customization (your words btw not mine), you're already getting semi-MWO-esque customization, what the **** more do you want?

Edited by Koniving, 17 September 2017 - 11:18 AM.

[Lazor Sharp]

What I want out of MW5....

I want the exact same Mech Lab we have now, with the same amount of customization as we have now.

Anything less would be unacceptable, but the limitation of time line, and availability of weapons as Salvage, and or affiliation to a House, etc... as the limitations to what can be fielded at any given time in the missions......

If you want to play Stock Only, than that should be a option,

Me, I want our full customization mech lab we have now, that will help new players to learn how to build mechs, and play a 4 man coop PvE with their 2-3 friends, (vet's), so they to learn how to play this game, without the Shark Tank mentality, and then come to MWO and be able to compete with the vet's, and be beyond the newbie potato stage........

for ME, MW5 should be the Training Grounds...........

If everything about MW5 PvE, is not a lead the players into MWO PvP in the end, than they have missed a great opportunity to increase the MWO population, and their MWO sale's.....

And this will provide a place for the Uber Casual, only play once a Mo. with my 2-3 friends, a sand box to play in, in AI easy mode, with out the real PPL Try Hard's ruining their fun........

[Cy Mitchell]

oldradagast, on 17 September 2017 - 10:00 AM, said:

Most stock builds are junk, and I'm sure some percentage of the community would at least like SOME ability to customize meaningfully in the mech lab vs. being forced to play junk, mission after mission, hoping for that one good mech they like to show up.

Junk compared to what? Compared to the Frankensteins that we can build in MWO? Yes. But compared to all the other stock type builds that will be roaming MW5? No. You will be on a level playing field with those.

Plying the black market, seeking salvage, making deals with Houses for certain salvage, traveling to planets to obtain Mechs or equipment only available there, changing out one brand of weapon for a slightly better brand of weapon of the same type, repairing damaged Mechs, scrimping on ammo reloads due to lack of funds, making due with what you have got in order to fulfill a contract, improvising, etc., etc. All these things can add great depth and enjoyment to a BattleTech/MechWarrior based single player game. For me, that will easily compensate for limited customization.

Mechs will have character which is, to a great degree, lost when you have an open Mech Lab that allows you to customize almost any Mech to perform much the same task in much the same way. Customization in the Mech Lab is fun and it is a huge part of MWO. But MWO is a shallow FPS game that offers only shooting Mechs and customizing Mechs to the ultimate min-max. If MW5 offers an in game economy based around equipment acquisition from a variety of possible sources along with a progressive campaign and goal oriented task then it will be so much more than MWO could ever be.

I can see how fans of FPS would decry the lack of a full Mech Lab but this game has an opportunity to offer so much more.

There is such a thing as offering players too much freedom. In my opinion, MWO does that to the detriment of the game. I like what I am hearing about MW5 including some limitation on customization.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

oldradagast, on 17 September 2017 - 11:01 AM, said:

And that's all I want, too. But the moment you suggest that, you get:
- People who just want a fight making nutty assumptions, such as the laughable posts above where people accuse me of wanting a god-mech for expecting some level of customization... I play Awesomes, people... come on!
- "My way or the highway" types hoping this game has no customization because "that the real way Mechwarrior and Battletech are supposed to be, if you ignore the computer games and the customization rules in table top."
- Troublemakers who also want the game to have no customization just to "stick it" to the MWO players because that game has - arguably - too much customization.

The reason, Radagast, is because the average person here, wants Unfettered customization, Arguing for ANY customization at this point, puts you as championing "liquid metal" customization.

I, am 100% in favor of the +/- 1 system I mentioned earlier in the thread. I wouldn't mind customization. EXCEPT for the fact, we have already seen what customization leads to... which is a broken *** game.

Your argument about forcing people to play Doom on the hardest difficulty as the only mode [as if that's what I'm arguing for.] Doesn't really stand. because honestly, the Mechlab. has been a constant source of imbalance to the experience.

even if you pump up the difficulty in Mechwarrior games, you can still get through the game, with the same customization, with little to no complications. Because again, MW's gameplay when customization is allowed, has been solved since 1995, load up the laszorz, blast the legz, winzorz.

So again, My argument, is that limiting, or entirely eliminating the customization in a mechwarrior game, is better FOR the game, because it removes a broken mechanic, and allows the game to focus it's difficulty based upon what equipment and chassis you have available to you at a given time.

[Exilyth]

Each of the houses and other factions having their lore & identity reinforced by what mechs they field and sell (e.g. steiner assault lance, liao with ecm and stealth, kurita with iconic designs like the panther and dragon...) will make battles much more diverse than what we have now.

Would be a shame if there was no customization at all though, even mechcommander had a simplified system.

[Koniving]

Requiemking, on 17 September 2017 - 11:03 AM, said:

To be honest, I'm of the opinion that, while there should be some degree of customisation, it should be limited. Common field refits like swapping Singles to Doubles or adding FFA, I'm fine with. I'm also fine with some degree of weapon swapping, such as swapping a Machine Gun for a Flamer(a common field refit as it provides Anit-Infantry capabilities for less risk). However, stuff like adding Endo or putting an AC20 where an AC 10 should be should require a great deal of downtime while the refit is going on.

Pretty much what the article implies we are going to have in terms of weapons. (Possibly not MGs with flamers; though that would make good sense.)

It does imply that ferro, CASE and endo steel are variant specific (and timeline specific), however. The things that in order to change on a mech would require large downtime and a grand facility that this mercenary group is implied to NOT possess or even have the ability to possess in the future. (If you're wondering, "CASE" is actually supposed to be part of the armor design, not a thing to randomly slap in. The crit slot is there so that it could be sabotaged and no longer function with a well placed shot.)

Exilyth, on 17 September 2017 - 11:25 AM, said:

Each of the houses and other factions having their lore & identity reinforced by what mechs they field and sell (e.g. steiner assault lance, liao with ecm and stealth, kurita with iconic designs like the panther and dragon...) will make battles much more diverse than what we have now.

Would be a shame if there was no customization at all though, even mechcommander had a simplified system.

Please enjoy the article.
It does expressly state that there will be "Granular" customization.

....Just not a full on mechlab with unlimited customization.

Edited by Koniving, 17 September 2017 - 11:29 AM.

[Koniving]

The6thMessenger, on 17 September 2017 - 01:59 AM, said:

Any chance for the rest of the article, or the source? I'd like to read the whole thing.

[Bishop Steiner]

Koniving, on 17 September 2017 - 11:27 AM, said:

Pretty much what the article implies we are going to have in terms of weapons. (Possibly not MGs with flamers; though that would make good sense.)

It does imply that ferro, CASE and endo steel are variant specific (and timeline specific), however. The things that in order to change on a mech would require large downtime and a grand facility that this mercenary group is implied to NOT possess or even have the ability to possess in the future. (If you're wondering, "CASE" is actually supposed to be part of the armor design, not a thing to randomly slap in. The crit slot is there so that it could be sabotaged and no longer function with a well placed shot.)


Please enjoy the article.
It does expressly state that there will be "Granular" customization.

....Just not a full on mechlab with unlimited customization.

And let's think about it... since this game lead us from 3015 (Level 1 tech is even in decline, people often can't repair what they have, hence why even the Black Widow Company had permanently damaged mechs on their roster), through the beginnings of the tech renaissance courtesy of the NAIS in the 3020s, through the Helm Memory Core Discovery and unlocking the secrets of the Star League leading up to the Clan Invasion.

During the first part of the Clan Invasion even the Heir Apparents of the 2 most powerful Houses ran pure stock 3025 Battlemechs. Victor Steiner-Davion drove a stock VTR-9B Victor, Hohiro Kurita a DRG-1G Grand Dragon. It wasn't until after teh Dragoon's Summit any of the Scions of the Great Houses ran advanced tech of ANY sort, SLDF era or Clan.

What does that mean? Simple. Ferro, CASE, XL Engines and Endo start as extinct tech when our campaign begins. And it is extremely rare and limited and still somewhat experimental where the Campaign ends. (Mid 3050s most merc units not named Kell Hounds of Wolfs Dragoons, still ran largely level 1 tech).

So it certainly makes perfect sense that we would not have the technical capability to retrofit that tech in this story arc. Most Mercs don't have access to the tech support to swap engines and such, either. We are 3rd Succession War - Beginning of the Clan Invasion Mercs in this campaign. We don't have the facilities of the NAIS or a Mech Factory to make massive customizations, and what's more, it's fiscally inefficient to do so. Why would you buy or salvage a Jagermech, only to spend the time and money needed to try to make it into a Thunderbolt? You wouldn't/couldn't.

Now will we even have HBS level of Customization? We honestly do not know, and probably won't til at least MechCon.

But this is a PvE ONLY game, against an AI that is already going to be meant to be inferior to us, using stock mechs. Having fully minmaxed MetaMechs not only doesn't fit the immersion of the campaign setting, but it totally wrecks any attempt at balance.

Mind you, while I won't cry if there is no customization, I would much prefer to see it handled like int eh HBS game, where it's logically limited, allowing mechs to retain their intended roles.

Koniving, on 17 September 2017 - 11:36 AM, said:

Any chance for the rest of the article, or the source? I'd like to read the whole thing.

https://imgur.com/a/3peQS

Here you go

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 17 September 2017 - 11:48 AM.

[Alan Davion]

Prosperity Park, on 17 September 2017 - 09:12 AM, said:

Forced-stock Mechs will decrease the number of top-tier viable Mechs on the field because only a small handful of stock Mechs have the potential to be Top Tier - you can't Meta-ize a non-meta Mech without a Mechlab.

This...

This right here is what I and a bunch of other people have been saying all along.

People have gotten so God Damned used to all the Min/Maxing of their mechs to the trillionth percentage point and all the constant power creep of this or that new mech that the thought of not being able to customize their mechs causes the heads of those players to explode cause they just can't bloody comprehend it.

They've gotten so used to "meta competitive this, meta effective that", that they can't separate the fact that, FROM A PURELY LORE PERSPECTIVE it makes no f***ing sense, but they just don't f***ing care cause they can't be bothered to rub two brain cells together to come up with tactics that go beyond "load up on lasers and blaze away like a fatass mouth breathing CoD kiddie".

Guess what buttercup, you've seen first hand what unlimited customization has done to 99% of the mechs in MWO. LRM boats like the Archer and Catapult are chastised and derided by the Wolfhound Laser boats and Stormcrow Streak boats and whatever other "meta" combinations there are. LRMs in general have become trash weapons. Lasers, Gauss and PPCs are 9 times out of 10 the only weapons used in the game at all anymore.

Suddenly these people are forced to deal with the fact that, if they're caught out in a bad position against an enemy loaded up for bear with LRMs, they'll get their asses handed to them on a giant silver platter.

And the fact is they can't handle it cause they've let their heads get so bloody swollen with false skill from using nothing but lasers or whatever weapon is the current meta of the month.

And you know what, I'm f***ing having the time of my life laughing my butt off at these dimwits who are scared shitless at something new and different.

Edited by Alan Davion, 17 September 2017 - 11:57 AM.

[Koniving]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 September 2017 - 11:48 AM, said:

https://imgur.com/a/3peQS

Here you go

Exactly. And thank you.

Almost immediately, we're going to have conventional aircraft swarming us. Yay!
(All the more reason to want Battletech-lore ACs versus the one shot wonder Mech Rifle-esque MWO cannons.)

Edited by Koniving, 17 September 2017 - 12:02 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Koniving, on 17 September 2017 - 12:01 PM, said:

Exactly. And thank you.

Almost immediately, we're going to have conventional aircraft swarming us. Yay!
(All the more reason to want Battletech-lore ACs versus the one shot wonder Mech Rifle-esque MWO cannons.)

I want both. Like in the HBS game.

Down side to burst ACs though...will you lightsaber enough damage to actually kill that hard to hit thing?

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 17 September 2017 - 12:12 PM.