239 replies to this topic

[Curccu]

Captn Kirk, on 04 October 2017 - 07:49 PM, said:

I would buy the hero if possible. The rest no thanks.

You can, when this mech is out with MC.

PS. Liking your own post .

[Gasoline]

Genesis23, on 04 October 2017 - 11:35 PM, said:

spiders were the kings of light mechs? they were horribly outgunned from the start, the ecm variant had some use and the 5k had its times with the insane energy quirk, which is no longer existant. spiders have no place or use anymore - unless of course you want yourself to suffer and make your game needlessly difficult.

When the Spider was first released it had one of the most broken hitboxes and hit registration ever. Nearly impossible to kill, could literally fly and was a major pain in the bum. With a competent pilot you could kill pretty much everything.

[Ovion]

Curccu, on 04 October 2017 - 10:54 PM, said:

WTF how the ******* mental are you?
I have been saying all the time, every freaking post that BOTH MECHS HAVE FULL ARMOR! That is how I compare them, that is how most of the players will play them.
Why would you compare mechs without full armor?
I'm pretty sure pretty much EVERYONE else than you agree with the style I'm comparing those mechs available tonnage.

Actually, most people will compare with *optimal* armour.
Meaning the armour you'd actually run.
For example - the Locust, you would rarely, if ever run max armour, because the head and arm armour is almost superflous. Any decent player is going to run it with 107 before quirks / skills, because that gives an optimal spread and tonnage.

People are more likely to run a little under on the MLX (around 153) because you don't need as much on the head and can drop some on the LT, because it gives you that little bit extra tonnage.

For the Piranha, you'll be doing the same as the Locust - it will have a tiny head hitbox (1 armour will be plenty) and the arms will have backup weapons to nothing (5 armour each will be plenty). Doing this will give you that sweet spot of 7.5T to play with on the 180.

Genesis23, on 04 October 2017 - 11:35 PM, said:

my armor numbers where from the mwo wiki where they say 170 something max armor for a locust. i guess theyre not really accurate anymore.

spiders were the kings of light mechs? they were horribly outgunned from the start, the ecm variant had some use and the 5k had its times with the insane energy quirk, which is no longer existant. spiders have no place or use anymore - unless of course you want yourself to suffer and make your game needlessly difficult.

Yeah, the Wiki was barely kept up to date before and is basically abandoned at this point.

Smurfy is going to be your best bet for current numbers, and in game for with-quirks.

What we need, is Smurfy with integrated quirks and skill tree....

[Jay Leon Hart]

Dee Eight, on 04 October 2017 - 05:18 PM, said:

Except...it doesn't. Because in the battletech lore, and every TRO... its defined as tonnage... open any TRO entry for any clan omnimech and look for yourself. under Armament, it will say # tons of pod space available. in the 3050 TRO an uller for example is 16 tons of pod space available.

The only TRO I have (Tactical Operations) mentions it for both slots and weight. Go figure.

[Aethermech]

mmmmm, slot in more salt and free up some tonnage for it. it feels so good. but seriously guys stop whining about what has more space/tonnage and just think aboot what the mech is gonna be, Which is a total blast until everyone refits their pixel toys with ssrm tubes and spend most the match failing to get locks on the swarming packs of light mechs. the piranha-star™ is the one that scares me the most, 15 ersl/micro pulse is nothing to sneeze at, the MG boats will be annoying but the lazers will get you...

[Ovion]

Aethermech, on 05 October 2017 - 01:20 AM, said:

mmmmm, slot in more salt and free up some tonnage for it. it feels so good. but seriously guys stop whining about what has more space/tonnage and just think aboot what the mech is gonna be, Which is a total blast until everyone refits their pixel toys with ssrm tubes and spend most the match failing to get locks on the swarming packs of light mechs. the piranha-star™ is the one that scares me the most, 15 ersl/micro pulse is nothing to sneeze at, the MG boats will be annoying but the lazers will get you...

It's fine, when they switch to SSRM's heavily, you switch to the 4AMS, 8MG variant

[Dungeon 206]

@PGI

YOU GUYS MUST RELEASE A CHAMPION / HERO VARIANT WITH PGI LIVERY!
ABSOLUTE MUST!!

[Ovion]

Dungeon 206, on 05 October 2017 - 01:31 AM, said:

@PGI

YOU GUYS MUST RELEASE A CHAMPION / HERO VARIANT WITH PGI LIVERY!
ABSOLUTE MUST!!

I honestly think it'll be more fitting as an anniversary or event reward.
A Special PIR-GA with PGI livery would be the ideal result I think

[Curccu]

Ovion, on 05 October 2017 - 12:56 AM, said:

Actually, most people will compare with *optimal* armour.
Meaning the armour you'd actually run.
For example - the Locust, you would rarely, if ever run max armour, because the head and arm armour is almost superflous. Any decent player is going to run it with 107 before quirks / skills, because that gives an optimal spread and tonnage.

People are more likely to run a little under on the MLX (around 153) because you don't need as much on the head and can drop some on the LT, because it gives you that little bit extra tonnage.

For the Piranha, you'll be doing the same as the Locust - it will have a tiny head hitbox (1 armour will be plenty) and the arms will have backup weapons to nothing (5 armour each will be plenty). Doing this will give you that sweet spot of 7.5T to play with on the 180.

Yes, true. It really depends on the mech and hardpoints, if there are weapons in arms in a light mech I most likely max armor in them. Same with legs, usually easiest way to take down a light mech is leg it.
In MLX-Prime stock case (which is Dees obsession for some reason) has half the armor in arms and 100% of the weapons in those, I wouldn't strip any armor from arms. And leg armor 10/24, no I would not strip that much from legs either, if any.

Head for sure, If someone is that good that can land solid hit on head of the light mech I will grant that easy kill then. I'm pretty sure I have died once by headshot in a light mech, unless you count oldschool artillery/airstrikes which could 1-shot headshot with full armor.

[Dee Eight]

Jay Leon Hart, on 05 October 2017 - 12:58 AM, said:

The only TRO I have (Tactical Operations) mentions it for both slots and weight. Go figure.

I have the 3050, 3055, 3060 and 3085 next to me. They all say "tons of pod space". Also the Battletech Tech Manual..from Catalyst games, which is where the core construction rules are found, page 58 for the designing of the Gladiator Omni Mech (the 95 ton that was actually the executioner to the clans), refers again to the 26.5 tons left over as "pod space" and even puts those words in quotes. This is CLEARLY how its meant to be referred to.

Edited by Dee Eight, 05 October 2017 - 04:10 AM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Dee Eight, on 05 October 2017 - 04:08 AM, said:

I have the 3050, 3055, 3060 and 3085 next to me. They all say "tons of pod space". Also the Battletech Tech Manual..from Catalyst games, which is where the core construction rules are found, page 58 for the designing of the Gladiator Omni Mech (the 95 ton that was actually the executioner to the clans), refers again to the 26.5 tons left over as "pod space" and even puts those words in quotes. This is CLEARLY how its meant to be referred to.

All from "Tactical Operations" from Catalyst Game Labs

Page 251

Quote

Advanced Support OmniVehicles:

...Because the weight of any fire-control system is directly tied to the weight of the weapons mounted on the advanced Support Vehicle, this weight determines how much pod space may be devoted to weaponry.

Page 257

Quote

For the 120-ton Omni railcars, Frank decides that the remaining 101.5 unspent tons (and all 17 equipment slots) will be sufficient “pod space” for any configuration desired, effectively completing it as a base configuration.

Page 258

Quote

SUPPORT OMNIVEHIClES

...Copies of this Base Configuration Record Sheet (noting all unused tonnage as pod space for the body and the turret separately) can then be used to quickly generate record sheets for the other configurations.

What I have supports weight moreso than slots, but it mentions both, so is ambiguous at best.

As to your discussion with Curccu, I also compare 'mechs with max and/or optimal armour configs.

I I were to compare a Cougar, Shadow Cat and Linebacker, I would say they each have 16-17 free tons to work with.

I would not strip ~120 points of armour from the LBK just to compare it to the SHC, as those extra 3 tons cost a significant amount of armour - both legs nearly stripped, or both arms, the head and some from the legs.

Likewise, stripping ~180 points of armour from the LBK to compare it to the COU is even worse. Those 5 tons I gain come at a massive armour cost and it would be foolish to run the LBK with such little armour.

[John McHobo]

Ovion, on 05 October 2017 - 01:27 AM, said:

It's fine, when they switch to SSRM's heavily, you switch to the 4AMS, 8MG variant

Ammo will become a huge issue if you run 2 ammo-dependant systems on it, heat if you go for LAMS and in my experience SSRM speed is too high and the range on which they are used is too short to make even several AMS effective against being piranhaed by streaks.

[stealthraccoon]

So any verification of battlemech/omnimech status? I can easily see them giving the omnimech a handicap by locking certain weapons to the pod (like locking 8 microlasers on the energy variants, or a few HMG’s).

Edited by stealthraccoon, 05 October 2017 - 06:55 AM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

stealthraccoon, on 05 October 2017 - 06:53 AM, said:

So any verification of battlemech/omnimech status? I can easily see them giving the omnimech a handicap by locking certain weapons to the pod (like locking 8 microlasers on the energy variants, or a few HMG’s).

100% BattleMech.

Compare the Piranha Store page to the Linebacker Store page.
Piranha lists "MAX ENGINE RATING" as it can be changed, Linebacker does not.
Piranha has no items in grey (Engine, Fixed Armor Slot, Fixed Structure Slot) under "WEAPONS AND EQUIPMENT", Linebacker does.
Piranha has just "HARDPOINTS", Linebacker has "OMNIPOD HARDPOINTS".
For the arms, Piranha has "(Actuators: Upper, Lower, Hand)" meaning the can't be altered, Linebacker has "(Available Actuators: Upper, Lower, Hand)" meaning they can be altered.

[Buenaventura]

^ What he said.
As you can read here, the Piranha is just a standard battlemech like those IIC ones, although it is newer than some of the omnimechs.

[Mechwarrior4670152]

stealthraccoon, on 05 October 2017 - 06:53 AM, said:

So any verification of battlemech/omnimech status? I can easily see them giving the omnimech a handicap by locking certain weapons to the pod (like locking 8 microlasers on the energy variants, or a few HMG’s).

In addition to the other two...

One of the Clans (Diamond Shark? Sarna isn't loading right now) decided to make the best pack-hunter mech they could.
Small
Fast
Cheap (Battlemechs are cheaper than omni)

Then when they got it finished, the ideal pack hunter, they realized just how un-clan like that very design was...
So tried selling it to IS markets (like the Mad Cat II)

Diamond Sharks are special that way.

[ERescue]

@Stealthraccoon: Fixed equipment on Omnis is just that, fixed, it exists in ALL configurations of that mech. The table top version rules were actually even stricter than the ones PGI uses, because in MWO some of the endosteel and ferro-fibrous slots are movable, while in TROs they were all locked in.

I do not remember by heart which, but at least one of the very early Omnis had a fixed flamer in all configurations and then pod space for other weapons / equipment.

[Jay Leon Hart]

ERescue, on 05 October 2017 - 10:34 AM, said:

I do not remember by heart which, but at least one of the very early Omnis had a fixed flamer in all configurations and then pod space for other weapons / equipment.

The Adder has a fixed CT Flamer and the MWO version did, too, for a long while. It was thankfully unlocked, eventually, something many people wish would happen to things like the CAP of the MLX.

[BEARDOOM]

GIVE SOMETHING TASTIE TO IS TO!!!! I love CLANS, but I love IS to!

[Jay Leon Hart]

BEARDOOM, on 10 October 2017 - 02:17 AM, said:

GIVE SOMETHING TASTIE TO IS TO!!!! I love CLANS, but I love IS to!

IS got 2 'mechs in a row, now Clans get 2 in a row, then... who knows?

Do we know what won Russ' poll for the 'mech-a-month vs 4 pack?