108 replies to this topic

[PFC Carsten]

InnerSphereNews, on 10 November 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

[…]
• Crimson Strait (Domination): Spawn locations have been adjusted to improve balance relative to Domination Beacon location.
[…]
• Rewards: Incursion and Escort Game Modes now provide Objective Victory Rewards.

Thank you, I will most certainly like these changes.

[Navid A1]

Catten Hart, on 11 November 2017 - 12:46 AM, said:

D'awwww, that's cute.

No, your information is biased and incorrect. You're assuming I don't like C-SPLs because they were something that annihilated me regularly, and I never said that. In fact, even in their prime, I only really got even hit by SPL users in either Arctic Cheetahs in QP or SPL+MG Novas in Scouting.

The problem was that the weapon was so blatantly overpowered *Compared to the competition in the same weapon bracket* and yet people willfully ignore that now, saying it's too weak. So let's do some number crunching, because obviously, this bat needs to be swung until the horse is a red mist.

Boating six Clan SPLs, pre-nerf, did a whopping 36 damage in a concentrated salvo. While I can no longer remember the refire rate, I do know it was quite low for having that much damage.

Compared to the IS SPL then and now, that is an 'incredible' 18 damage difference.

Here, I'll put it into something my 6-year-old Nephew could probably understand.

36
-18
18

Double the damage. That's one more point per laser than IS Standard Medium Laser damage, as well, which I will display with another helpful, 6-year-old compliant equation.

36
-30
6

So, in this amazingly simple summary;

6 tons of Clan pre-nerf SPLs does 36 damage, 6 tons of IS SPLs does 18 damage, and 6 tons of IS Medium Lasers does 30 damage. Unless you are completely unable to understand math in any way, shape or form, that is an incredibly blatant imbalance that was a complete necessity to patch.

EDIT; As for the whole '5' damage thing, no. Stop trying to buff anything on the Clan side sheerly for the sake of buffing it so it completely outdoes IS tech. We don't need a Small Pulse Laser doing the same damage in a shorter duration at a similar-but-slightly-shorter range compared the IS standard Medium Laser. It's unnecessary. 4 damage at better range leaves it superior to the IS SPL but only slightly worse damage per shot than the IS Medium Laser (And a better choice at times due to faster refire and lower heat), which is exactly where it should be.

As long as correct information goes, IS-SPLs did 4 damage pre-nerf.... so your little number play is incorrect!

Besides, you really do not understand that weapons have different aspects such as range, cooldown, heat, duration, etc. Alpha damage is just one area. By your analogy, we should buff the gauss rifle?, because it does less damage than AC20 but is 1 ton heavier.
sorry, but you need to better think what you say otherwise you are just embarrassing yourself.

But since you insist on alpha damage, lets compare C-ERSL with C-SPLs
C-ERSL do 1 more damage for half the tonnage compared to the C-SPL and it has way more range. Should we nerf C-ERSLs as well? why would anyone choose C-SPL over C-ERSL?

Everyone agreed that C-SPLs were too over-performing. But the way PGI obliterated it is not how you do balance. They even nerfed the miserable IS-SPL. they reduced its damage to 3 (from 4) and increased it to 3.5 sometime later.

People were suggesting a 4 damage IS-SPL with fast cooldown, and a 5 damage C-SPL with slower cooldown, with all the proposed dps and hps values listed and tabulated. PGI just did not want to listen.


Also, please, don't go down the math alley with me. I do math for a living.
You gave my colleagues a good chuckle with those math comments!

[Felbombling]

Two things struck me as I read the patch notes...

1. "...our first brand-new Map since the release of Grim Plexus in March of last year."

That is just brutal, isn't it? Let's keep PGI's feet to the fire when it comes to new map development in the future.

2. A tip of the hat to PGI for all the little fixes in this patch. Wide ranging in scope.

[RaptorRage]

Todd Lightbringer, on 11 November 2017 - 07:44 AM, said:

These Thanatos quirks, and cockpit items are laughable. This thing needs armor, not structure, and more death themed items.

Seems those hardware and mechanical themed items would be more appropriate for some kind of MiningMech or ConstructionMech like the Roughneck.

[Bonzai VI]

@Navid A1

IS-SPL were actually immediately nerfed to 3.5 dmg, they just tinkered around with cooldown and heat afterwards to try and not make the weapon completely useless.
Yeah, didn't really work that well^^

Edited by Bonzai VI, 11 November 2017 - 11:21 AM.

[Trenchbird]

Navid A1, on 11 November 2017 - 10:16 AM, said:

As long as correct information goes, IS-SPLs did 4 damage pre-nerf.... so your little number play is incorrect!

Man, someone should teach you a lesson in humility. Because you clearly lack it.

"Incorrect". Well, considering I can't view prior patch notes, I can't verify it; But even if it was 4 damage, my point still roughly stands. Clan SPLs dealt 2 more damage per shot, for a ghost heat-compliant six having a total of 12 extra points of damage.

All in all, I'm not really concerned about a 1-point difference in regards to this, and considering yourself better than me for finding a measly six point difference is, for the most part, overly fastidious. It also doesn't matter now that there is only a half-point damage difference between C-SPL and SPLs.

Quote

Besides, you really do not understand that weapons have different aspects such as range, cooldown, heat, duration, etc. Alpha damage is just one area. By your analogy, we should buff the gauss rifle?, because it does less damage than AC20 but is 1 ton heavier.

Of course I understand the difference. I'm not a troglodyte.

All those other statistics are important, as otherwise, why would people ever bring AC/2s? But in terms of two weapons that are nigh-identical* (Such as Clan-to-IS Gauss, Clan-to-IS SPLs), having one clearly better than the other in almost every conceivable way is a problem. Alpha damage is a component of said problem, and in the case of how people used SPLs, it's the majority of the problem.

*I am aware that I brought up IS standard Medium lasers in my argument. While Medium lasers are not the 'same' as SPLs, it did provide a vehicle for a same-ton, same-slot laser weapon with rather similar but inferior performance, especially considering the time frame I was referencing.

Also, nice Strawman. "Hurr durr buff Gauss because AC20 is tougher"? Yeah. No. I'm not falling for that one. Two different weapons excelling in different things.

Quote

But since you insist on alpha damage, lets compare C-ERSL with C-SPLs
C-ERSL do 1 more damage for half the tonnage compared to the C-SPL and it has way more range. Should we nerf C-ERSLs as well? why would anyone choose C-SPL over C-ERSL?

Yes. And people do choose the ERSL more often, because again, Alpha matters more.

Of course, right now, the two weapons do have a difference. The C-SPL fires faster and shorter than the C-ERSL, but the C-ERSL weighs less and does more damage overall, with a higher duration. And there's nothing wrong with that; It's a completely acceptable give-and-take.

Quote

Everyone agreed that C-SPLs were too over-performing. But the way PGI obliterated it is not how you do balance. They even nerfed the miserable IS-SPL. they reduced its damage to 3 (from 4) and increased it to 3.5 sometime later.

Actually, nerfing something that is overperforming is how you do balance. Reducing damage by a third sounds bad, but it was a decent solution; And certainly not an obliteration. (Although, reducing damage on the IS-SPL-if that did happen-was certainly a bad call. Bringing both to four is certainly better.)

Quote

People were suggesting a 4 damage IS-SPL with fast cooldown, and a 5 damage C-SPL with slower cooldown, with all the proposed dps and hps values listed and tabulated. PGI just did not want to listen.

Oh, on paper, I enjoy this idea, in all honesty. But, there's a problem.

In this case, the C-SPL would still leave the C-ERSL inferior by way of performing the same role that the C-ERSL currently does, but better in every way except range. And typically, if you're already at 400 meters, it switches to under 200 very quickly, reducing the point of having the higher range at all, considering both are pseudo-knife fighting weapons.

Quote

Also, please, don't go down the math alley with me. I do math for a living.
You gave my colleagues a good chuckle with those math comments!

Actually, you know what, I'm taking back that second one. Would you rather try discussing this like adults, as opposed to trying to throw juvenile insults at eachother? Because it's rather annoying, and neither of us will be willing to see even an inch of the other's argument if we're being ****** to one another. Plus, it will look better.

(Although, I am keeping the first point about the Cashier thing in. Try to take it with a grain of salt, I at least find it funny.)

1; Congratulations, you can do the same basic thing as a Cashier who graduated High School. Addition, Subtraction, Multiplication, and Division are all not challenging, so I'm not sure what you're trying to brag for.

Edited by Catten Hart, 11 November 2017 - 12:15 PM.

[Bonzai VI]

@Catten Hart

So, you're just ignoring me eh?^^

BTW, if you need infos
http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/equipment

Someone actually made a site in which all infos you search are given.

[Trenchbird]

Bonzai VI, on 11 November 2017 - 12:13 PM, said:

@Catten Hart

So, you're just ignoring me eh?^^

BTW, if you need infos
http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/equipment

Someone actually made a site in which all infos you search are given.

Thank you for the link, and yes. I am just ignoring you. I almost ignored him. Because both of you were choosing to be snide in turn instead of correcting my admittedly ****** attitude of responding the first time, which I apologize for.

Edited by Catten Hart, 11 November 2017 - 12:26 PM.

[Bonzai VI]

@Catten Hart

Wow something is wrong with you.
You go on with "You're all dumb kids" and I am acting snide? Srsly?
I addressed many things you cried about in Navids post, but nah let's not have a discussion.

If you don't want to argue with people, how bout you don't post in a forum?

Edited by Bonzai VI, 11 November 2017 - 12:32 PM.

[Trenchbird]

Bonzai VI, on 11 November 2017 - 12:28 PM, said:

@Catten Hart

Wow something is wrong with you.
You go on with "You're all dumb kids" and I am acting snide? Srsly?
I addressed many things you cried about in Navids post, but nah let's not have a discussion.

If you don't want to argue with people, how bout you don't post in a forum?

... Wow, okay.

So I apologize for being a *****, and you decide to be one in turn. Excellent, exactly what I expected./s.

What, you think I wanted to 'not argue'? Why the hell would I have spent ten minutes writing a response to Navid if I didn't want to argue? No. I want to do it in a civilized manner where I'm not being a *****, and they aren't being a *****, and you aren't being a *****. A discussion, not a pissing match. And judging by your response, with you, that would've been impossible to avoid.

You either can't understand that, or are butthurt because I didn't give you a response that you wanted.

So yeah. No. I'm not following the path that's going to get a mod over here, any more than I already have.

Edited by Catten Hart, 11 November 2017 - 12:42 PM.

[Bonzai VI]

@Catten Hart

*sigh*
Alright last thing I'll say bout this.

You said that you can't watch prior patch notes, in my response I very clearly told you that you can and how.

Navids "Strawman" about you prioritizin alpha was the way he (and coincidentally I) have seen how you see the balance between the weapons. Maybe it could be that you weren't totally clear in what you said before?

Would be nice if you actually would read my response. Don't answer to it w/e but at least read what I had to say before writing something bout the same topic.

Edited by Bonzai VI, 11 November 2017 - 12:55 PM.

[Trenchbird]

Bonzai VI, on 11 November 2017 - 12:54 PM, said:

@Catten Hart

*sigh*
Alright last thing I'll say bout this.

You said that you can't watch prior patch notes, in my response I very clearly told you that you can and how.

Navids "Strawman" about you prioritizin alpha was the way he (and coincidentally I) have seen how you see the balance between the weapons. Maybe it could be that you weren't totally clear in what you said before?

Would be nice if you actually would read my response. Don't answer to it w/e but at least read what I had to say.

I did read your response, after I read Navid's. Honestly, both you and Navid made good points (Albiet layered in dripping condescension) that I didn't think of before. And again, thanks for the response regarding patch notes.

Doesn't excuse the crappy behavior from any side, of course. And, I'm not swayed too far from my opinion, for the most part. But you gave me something to think about.

Side note; If they were to buff C-SPLs, I'd rather they not touch the damage and just touch other stats like heat, and that's it. I'll give it that much.

Edited by Catten Hart, 11 November 2017 - 01:01 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Navid A1, on 10 November 2017 - 08:47 PM, said:

Another patch goes by with PGI completely ignoring the state of small pulse lasers.
Its fine... it will only take 4 more years before they realize that (C)-SPLs are extinct.

Its funny how hard PGI is resisting when a large number of players were asking them to just TRY a 5 damage C-SPL for once...

Nope.
"Do not listen to angry players, because if you do they'll do it all the time" -PGI probably




I'm going to mechcon this year... and I'm gonna look straight into Paul and Chris eyes and just say... Why bro?... WHY?

You rag on the cSPL so much, how about the SPL and SL?

[Uncle Totty]

InnerSphereNews, on 10 November 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

• Comp Play: Fixed an issue where a previously Ready player would still be listed as Ready after switching to an invalid 'Mech, but would still correctly be blocked from launching.
• Cougar COU-H: Fixed an issue where the Set of 8 Quirks included a +5% Cooldown Quirk, rather than the intended -5% Cooldown.


• Faction Play (Conflicts Panel): Fixed an issue where Special Conflicts would not show the associated Faction insignias.
• Faction Play: Removed a redundant warning when viewing Career details.
• Faction Play: Fixed an issue where debug text would briefly appear just prior to the beginning of a match.
• Group: Fixed an issue where Quick Play would appear as an option twice if there were no active Faction Play Conflicts.
• Group: Fixed an issue where players who returned from a match and were viewing a rewards dialog would still be listed as 'Deployed'.
• Group: Fixed an issue where a Group Invite could show the wrong Faction icon for the player.
• Inventory: Fixed an issue where the Sell Item button could remain active but invisible after selling an item.
• Inventory: Fixed an issue where the C-Bill icon would not appear in the dialog when attempting to sell a single item.
• MechLab (Warehouse): Fixed an issue where swapping OmniPods could cause items to display incorrectly in the 32-bit client.
• MechLab: Fixed an issue where equipping Flamers, Laser AMS, or RACs would have an inaccurate impact on your listed Heat Management value. In-game Heat was behaving correctly; this issue only erroneously impacted your listed Heat Management value.
• MechLab: Fixed an issue where the Critical Chance values were being visually rounded in the tooltip for Targeting Computers.
• MechLab: Fixed an issue where Loadout errors for the Head were referring to the component as 'Cockpit'.
• Mech Stats: Fixed an issue where the wrong colour was used for the Arm Angle value.
• MechWarrior Academy: MiniMap and BattleGrid now accurately reflect the distinct layout features of the Academy map, rather than simply using the River City map.
• River City (F5): Fixed an location where 'Mechs could get stuck.
• Special Events: 'Recent Events' tab has been renamed to 'Past Events'.
• Special Events: The 'Current Events' and 'Future Events' tabs will now be visible even when no Events are currently running or announced. Under this circumstance, the tabs will be comprised of text conveying these states.
• Special Events: Fixed an issue where the Victory/Loss Claim Reward would not appear when all Immediate Rewards were already Claimed or unavailable for being Claimed.
• Special Events: Fixed an issue where headers would sometimes not appear above Events.
• Special Events: To address an issue with large numbers not fitting in the available space, Completion states are no longer conveyed with a green checkmark. Once an Objective requirement has been met, the listed value will however continue to turn green to help denote completion.
• Splash Screen: Fixed an issue where skipping the Tutorial in the inital splash screen before the screen was fully loaded could cause the dialog to get stuck on-screen
• Nova Cat: Animations have been cleaned up to address issues with leg behavior.
• Nova Cat: Fixed placement issues with footprints.
• Osiris: Fixed an issue where the arms wouldn't appear to move up and down while in 1PV.
• Settings (Video): Fixed an issue where the lowest resolutions wouldn't appear in the resolution dropdown when first accessed.
• Store: Fixed an issue where the Linebacker LBK-RL was not categorized as a Hero 'Mech.
• Store (Mech Stats): Fixed an issue where the Tooltip could remain on-screen after hovering over a Component.
• Unit (Rank Management): Fixed an issue where the 'View Last Online Time' privilege could not be assigned on its own.
• Unit (Message of the Day): Hitting primary Enter key to set another line will no longer close the window. The NumPad Enter key will still close the window.
• Unit: Fixed an issue where a long Unit name would overrun the Member and Planet Info window.
• UrbanMech UM-K9: Fixed an issue where CT Energy Weapon hitboxes didn't have complete coverage.
• Uziel: Fixed an issue where multiple variants weren't correctly utilizing empty hardpoint caps.
• Uziel (all variants): Fixed an alignment issue with the Center Torso and the hip.
• Uziel (all variants): Animations have been cleaned up to address issues encountered while Torso is turned and the 'Mech is in motion.

Once again, the knew mechs get to cut to the front of the fix-it line as mechs that have been waiting years have been pushed more to the back.

[Koniving]

Hawk819, on 10 November 2017 - 09:49 PM, said:

A unicorn carrying an AR-15 wearing two bandoleers across its chest while smoking a cigar? Seriously, those items are almost laughable.

If it shits rainbows too, can I have it?

[5th Fedcom Rat]

Can we please see a little more preview of the ultimate tier rewards - What does the bag pipe warhorn sound like? Do the horse and wolf animate?

[Carkorak]

does everyone get the playtime reward? 2 mil, mech bay and cake standing item sound realy good right about now

[Gasoline]

So another patch goes by with the Night Owl (Gyr) still handling like a 90t assault mech... I would've expected a fix right when we get the IS counterpart.

[zzoxx]

Really exited for the new map, though it's really been a while. I can't see a circle structure or mountain or empty plains in the middle wich is a good thing. And thank you so much for taking a pass on dynamic day / night cycle this time. Finally starting (i hope so) to rework the domination circle is also very welcome. And btw. thanks for the pretty massive output of MC, mechs and stuff with the events lately. This really motivates a lot of our guys to drop more often. Greedy Bast*#!s......

Edited by zzoxx, 12 November 2017 - 11:32 PM.

[Navid A1]

Yeonne Greene, on 11 November 2017 - 01:40 PM, said:

You rag on the cSPL so much, how about the SPL and SL?

SPL and SL are both in need of buffs.
PGI nerfed both IS-SPL and IS-SL for god knows what reason.

C-SPL case is more extreme, since there is no alternative laser that can replace it effectively. PGI heavily nerfed the C-ERSLs in september