219 replies to this topic

[Cementi]

DjPush, on 13 December 2017 - 03:30 PM, said:

Most of you didn't read past the title. Which doesn't surprise me in the least. Most of you didn't even read the title properly. Pretty ****** sad.

Oh I read it. I just really enjoy trolling tier one tryhard cryhards who ***** and moan that people do not play the game the way they do.

I might roll my eyes and say "look at this guys build" on a private voice chat like discord with my buddies but I am not such a douche bag that I have to go to broadcast it in game or on the forums.

Let people have fun and play the game the way they want to. It is after all a game. If you want to play comp there is a game mode for that.

Also sometimes those guys do not know any better and if you reach out with some friendly advice, group up with them, teach them, they can become some of the best unit members.

Or you could recruit the guy who stands in the back never sharing armor ride humping with his meta sniper yelling at everyone who was dying so he could get is 1k+ damage.....your call.

Edited by Cementi, 14 December 2017 - 08:37 AM.

[DjPush]

Kroete, on 14 December 2017 - 02:49 AM, said:

100 Armor, thats 1,5 alphas or two enemys firing together once at him ...

Now tell me how tanking 1,5 alphas would do more for a team then doing 1000 damage?

You would have to actually do 1000 damage. Which almost neve happens in an LRM assault turret.

[Cementi]

Kubernetes, on 13 December 2017 - 03:58 PM, said:

Of course they can.

They can also

carry 8 Tags, or

load up on ACs with zero ammo, or

allocate all armor to rear CT and walk backwards.

There's no shortage of ways to help your team lose.

But if someone chooses to play this way, he's got little ground to complain when teammates ***** him out.

It's still a team game. Go join a pickup basketball game and insist on throwing the ball out of bounds at every opportunity, all the while yelling "I wanna play my way! This is my way of having fun!" See where that gets you.

Ah the extreme example guy. You know the one that takes something then compares it to something else but makes the situation so outlandishly stupid that the comparison is no longer relevant.

You could have been reasonable and said something along the lines like the guy who plays basketball but refuses to attempt anything but 3 pointers all game long.

But hey I have been pointing out how retardedly moronic these kinds of comparisons are to one of my brothers for 20 years and he still makes them so I doubt pointing it out to you will accomplish much either.

[Kalimaster]

If you think that only new players use missiles, you are flat wrong. I am a veteran player, I do use LRM assault Mechs, even as stationary once I get into a good position. I get kills, do damage, and help various idiots who don't know how to play win the game. Then I also have a Locust, actually more than one that I use to annoy other players. If you want people to stop using LRM's so much, maybe you should tell people to stop Nerfing weapons that previously worked..

[Xiphias]

Kalimaster, on 14 December 2017 - 08:58 AM, said:

If you think that only new players use missiles, you are flat wrong. I am a veteran player, I do use LRM assault Mechs, even as stationary once I get into a good position. I get kills, do damage, and help various idiots who don't know how to play win the game. Then I also have a Locust, actually more than one that I use to annoy other players. If you want people to stop using LRM's so much, maybe you should tell people to stop Nerfing weapons that previously worked..

I'd say most players who dislike LRMs have more of a problem with veterans playing them than with new players. New players might actually be able to contribute more with LRMs than they would otherwise, but veteran pilots have had the time to learn to be effective with other weapons.

In my experience it's the veteran LRM pilots who have dug their heels into the ground and refused to listen to anyone else about what is good or to make any effort to change or improve. I highly doubt that your LRM assault mech is having a meaningful contribution to winning the vast majority of the time. I don't have a problem with people playing for fun. I have a problem with people claiming their builds are good/effective when they aren't.

[Brain Cancer]

lazorbeamz, on 14 December 2017 - 02:08 AM, said:

lrm are very powerful

I know, look at all these assists and nearly no components destroyed.



Seriously, they've been repeatedly nerfed for fear of traumatizing bottom-of-the-barrel players. It's kinda sad.

[Brain Cancer]

Also, there's some things an assault lurmboat has to do.

It can't be slow. Please, stop trying to lurmboat Dire Wolves or Annihilators.

It has to keep moving. Seriously, even if you're close enough. Keep moving. It's all too easy to get lost in the shooting and find out you're a map square behind your team.

Get closer, you want to hit them with your sword missiles. If you aren't within 600m, you're too slow/not moving enough. If you're within good range of your secondary guns, you're in the right range to drop missiles.

Have secondary guns. Even if it's a few medium lasers. Use them. Saves on ammo, kills weakened targets that got too close, and so on.

Rate of fire matters. If you can keep a steady barrage going, you'll be much better off than the shmuck who alphas his entire tube count and shuts down on the second shot. Also, don't shut down. A shutdown means an almost certain missed shot, so you may as well not have pushed the heat and wasted ammo.

It is very easy to be bad with LRMs, and being bad with LRMs is really frickin' obvious. Learn and you too can take a third-rate weapon system onto the battlefield and actually contribute.

[Kubernetes]

Cementi, on 14 December 2017 - 08:40 AM, said:

Ah the extreme example guy. You know the one that takes something then compares it to something else but makes the situation so outlandishly stupid that the comparison is no longer relevant.

You could have been reasonable and said something along the lines like the guy who plays basketball but refuses to attempt anything but 3 pointers all game long.

But hey I have been pointing out how retardedly moronic these kinds of comparisons are to one of my brothers for 20 years and he still makes them so I doubt pointing it out to you will accomplish much either.

Want a better example? Check out all these baddies claiming that LRMs are good.

Quote

Let people have fun and play the game the way they want to. It is after all a game. If you want to play comp there is a game mode for that.

Let the people have fun and post on the forum the way they want to. It is after all a forum.

If you're going to play with **** builds and insist on continuing to play with **** builds, suck it up and accept that you're going to get called out.

And again, because you dismissed my post while missing the entire point, you're playing on a team with other people. If you just want play badly and contribute to losses, go play a single player game instead of messing with 11 teammates who are trying to win. Yes, it's a game, but most of us aren't five years old. We have no interest in participation trophies. Fun for me involves playing to the best of my abilities, not dicking over the 11 guys who got teamed up with me.

[LowSubmarino]

Ppl staying in the main nascar lanes in slow mechs is prolly the grim reaper of mwo.

[Dark Wooki33 IIC]

Nobody should tell the good people how to play the game they like.

Btw. it would be pretty boring if no one would scream mid match for help/support or curse people at match end.

The best games are the 12-4 matchs anyways, all of opfor and complete charlie lance butchered.

[Khobai]

Quote

It can't be slow. Please, stop trying to lurmboat Dire Wolves or Annihilators.

people can play whatever they want as long as they do like 200+ damage

or in the case of an LRM boat, say 400 damage.

as long as your mech is pulling some weight and isnt just dragging your team down

[Xetelian]

Wolfways, on 13 December 2017 - 06:58 PM, said:

And if you're up front in an assault you're going to die instantly as the enemy drill straight through your ct and you can't torso twist.

The idea, at least in solo queue, is to get all the assaults to push with the entire team, give the enemy many targets and overwhelm them. If you're up against a full 8-12 man and they're calling targets well, then you were probably screwed to begin with.

Knowing when and where to push is important, walking across the middle of Frozen City with a bunch of slow assaults is going to end badly for you. Putting the entire team in the tunnel on Crimson can go poorly for you as you come out of it one or two at a time.

Khobai, on 14 December 2017 - 11:39 AM, said:

people can play whatever they want as long as they do like 200+ damage

or in the case of an LRM boat, say 400 damage.

as long as your mech is pulling some weight and isnt just dragging your team down

200+ damage is fine if you're a light or medium.

If you're in a heavy or assault, I think you might want to do more than 200 damage to help achieve a victory. Whatever is good damage at about 65 tons, should be doubled for an LRM boat. That damage is spread widely and you're going to need to shave a LOT of enemy armor off if you're going to have an impact on the outcome of a game.


You can easily do 200 damage to one assault mech and not take all of its armor off. An 85 ton BLR without the skill tree has 220 armor up front not counting the arms. Then you get to the gooey filling of 100 structure so you're doing 300 damage to kill one mech.

[Khobai]

well I dont have high expectations for potato pugs

if they do 200 damage theyve already exceeded them

[Brain Cancer]

Quote

people can play whatever they want as long as they do like 200+ damage

The last game I had a stellar example of this NOT happening was on Frozen City. Assault match.

I had my ATM Supernova. The rest of Charlie was TWO lurmboat Dire Wolves and a LRM Hero Annihilator.

None of them cleared 200 damage. They parked themselves on the opposite side of the map. They did not move. They plowed a few thousand missiles into buildings at extreme range, and after the other nine members of the team died (up front,of course), the enemy took their virgin lurmboat armor (and they were all 100%) without lube and mulched the lot, because they barely had four fricking medium lasers between three hundred tons of lurmboat. In fact, I could use those three as textbook examples of how NOT to missile boat in an assault, because they pretty much checked off the list as they spewed LRM 20s in dazzling displays of inaccuracy.

Oh, and they sat next to each other "protecting the base" so all of them got the worst possible minrange shots at the enemy to boot once the inevitable feeding frenzy began.

[ANOM O MECH]

I use lrms. Mostly situationally in CW. Most of those times it's more for luls because if you are on a good team and have a really, really skilled narcer (as my unit has more than one of), you can wipe the floor them. Watching a Kodiak or Direwhale eat lrm 7000 by a bunch of guys is hilarious if you are on the team doing it.

Still I get tired when I get into a quick play match and teams for whatever reason have more lurms than usual. I find time of the day playing can have a drastic effect on how many people are playing and running them. I'd get frustrated, or sometimes even angry.

Got to the point where I had to figure out what to do in these situations which may look like the begining of a bad losing streak. For me the best and simpliest answer was not to whine on comms or punch stuff. Instead I put together a narcer raven and arctic cheetah. Same for when I am pugging CW in the afternoon, likely I will be narcing after seeing my team and what they are bringing. I actually tried joining in the lurming first but didn't work for me. Why I think it works as it can be challenging being in a poorly defended light way up front. Probably why ecm is a must.... It also gives me better chances at actually winning due to how much more effective lurms are when the target is narced. Wanna call your match without using comms? Narc only two targets you want focused. It is just so much easier to adjust my behaviour than it is trying to win influence over others. Putting the energy into helping instead of scolding or any other tactic that is useless and won't get folks to stop running lrm 80 supernova's seems to be great at making the game more fun for myself and hopefully those stuck playing with me.

[OmniFail]

Xiphias, on 14 December 2017 - 09:12 AM, said:

I'd say most players who dislike LRMs have more of a problem with veterans playing them than with new players. New players might actually be able to contribute more with LRMs than they would otherwise, but veteran pilots have had the time to learn to be effective with other weapons.

In my experience it's the veteran LRM pilots who have dug their heels into the ground and refused to listen to anyone else about what is good or to make any effort to change or improve. I highly doubt that your LRM assault mech is having a meaningful contribution to winning the vast majority of the time. I don't have a problem with people playing for fun. I have a problem with people claiming their builds are good/effective when they aren't.

Oh so I should listen to you to be good?

[Brain Cancer]

OmniFail, on 14 December 2017 - 08:40 PM, said:

Oh so I should listen to you to be good?

C'mon, now. That's on Polar, which is the defacto "LRM superiority" map where if the enemy isn't able to hide, you can ammodump all match long with the best accuracy on any map in the game. It's a best-case scenario, the reason why any LRM chucker with two brain cells mashes Polar (or Alpine, perhaps Caustic) for a map choice when it pops up.

Note the Annihilator got the same killcount and hit the same targets- but being direct fire. Or the Timber Wolf, who was doing the same thing you were but with fewer launchers and ammo tonnage given the 12-assist game. And zero kills.

Now, show us that performance on, say, Mining or River, where the cover goes from being virtually nil to omnipresent. You won't. You'll have to sweat most of your shots, be lucky to land a full salvo on anyone, and actually getting to hold down the fire button? Nope. I mean, I can pull 1000+ in an assault lurmboat on Frozen City or Forest where the cover isn't near perfect, but performance shoots into the cellar as the opportunity to slip locks and feed missiles to the nearest rock increase.

And it doesn't even take into consideration the fact that everyone could mount some form of AMS, but the vast majority don't because LRMs are that weak. The skies are mostly clear of flak for the lurmbomber right now, but if the weapon system was actually dangerous, maps would have skyboxes resembling the Gulf War over Baghdad.



If you think LRMs degrade with one Kit Fox triple AMSing, imagine twelve+ such systems BRRRRTing your damage out of the air.

Edited by Brain Cancer, 14 December 2017 - 09:19 PM.

[OmniFail]

Brain Cancer, on 14 December 2017 - 09:17 PM, said:

C'mon, now. That's on Polar, which is the defacto "LRM superiority" map where if the enemy isn't able to hide, you can ammodump all match long with the best accuracy on any map in the game. It's a best-case scenario, the reason why any LRM chucker with two brain cells mashes Polar (or Alpine, perhaps Caustic) for a map choice when it pops up.

Note the Annihilator got the same killcount and hit the same targets- but being direct fire. Or the Timber Wolf, who was doing the same thing you were but with fewer launchers and ammo tonnage given the 12-assist game. And zero kills.

Now, show us that performance on, say, Mining or River, where the cover goes from being virtually nil to omnipresent. You won't. You'll have to sweat most of your shots, be lucky to land a full salvo on anyone, and actually getting to hold down the fire button? Nope. I mean, I can pull 1000+ in an assault lurmboat on Frozen City or Forest where the cover isn't near perfect, but performance shoots into the cellar as the opportunity to slip locks and feed missiles to the nearest rock increase.

And it doesn't even take into consideration the fact that everyone could mount some form of AMS, but the vast majority don't because LRMs are that weak. The skies are mostly clear of flak for the lurmbomber right now, but if the weapon system was actually dangerous, maps would have skyboxes resembling the Gulf War over Baghdad.



If you think LRMs degrade with one Kit Fox triple AMSing, imagine twelve+ such systems BRRRRTing your damage out of the air.

I am not a typical lurm chucker. I was born to lurm.

Anyway here is a screeny of my team carrying me on Crimson. Sorry I didn't do better on your brawler map with my fail lurms.

[Kangarad]

The problem is not lurm assaults.
The problem is that unless you boat lurms to assault levels in tonnage they are not worth bringing in the first place.

[OmniFail]

Kangarad, on 14 December 2017 - 09:39 PM, said:

The problem is not lurm assaults. The problem is that unless you boat lurms to assault levels in tonnage they are not worth bringing in the first place.

Not true, maybe for lights, but it can be done in heavy's and mediums.

Timber Wolf


Huntsman (Probably the best medium lurm platform)