322 replies to this topic

[VeeOt Dragon]

yeah wouldn't mind getting in a group but I absolutely hate having to use third party. tried discord a while back and wasn't a fan as for Team Speak I have heard of it but never got any intel on exactly what it is or how to use it. (32 year old here who tends to shun most social media like the plague.) I think if they had a lobby game side it would make it much easier for new players to join with groups.

I plan on sticking to it for now and i'm always experimenting with builds trying to find what works best for me as well as being effective (I always hated the meta- you have to only use this build on this mech mindset, yes certain mechs lean towards certain builds but I find fun in the unexpected (only have one mech with LRM (hunchback) though its rare to get the teamwork for it to be effective a lot of he time. as an ex artilleryman in the US army (13-M missile delivery systems operator) I have a bit of a soft spot for them)

as for bravery nah more boredom with QP more than anything else. that and a love for the lore having played MechWarrior 2 back in the day and the tabletop. glad to see many of my favorite IS mechs in this game.

[ANOM O MECH]

VeeOt Dragon, on 22 January 2018 - 11:21 PM, said:

yeah wouldn't mind getting in a group but I absolutely hate having to use third party. tried discord a while back and wasn't a fan as for Team Speak I have heard of it but never got any intel on exactly what it is or how to use it. (32 year old here who tends to shun most social media like the plague.) I think if they had a lobby game side it would make it much easier for new players to join with groups.

I plan on sticking to it for now and i'm always experimenting with builds trying to find what works best for me as well as being effective (I always hated the meta- you have to only use this build on this mech mindset, yes certain mechs lean towards certain builds but I find fun in the unexpected (only have one mech with LRM (hunchback) though its rare to get the teamwork for it to be effective a lot of he time. as an ex artilleryman in the US army (13-M missile delivery systems operator) I have a bit of a soft spot for them)

as for bravery nah more boredom with QP more than anything else. that and a love for the lore having played MechWarrior 2 back in the day and the tabletop. glad to see many of my favorite IS mechs in this game.

Don't worry about meta. Most important thing with builds is using stuff that complements each other. Lbx naturally sinks up with srms and you see people using heavy lasers with cermed cause they sink up together well.

TS and discord help. I don't like discord myself and don't use it. That isn't a deal breaker though, as there is no harm in asking to join a group even without TS. It just makes it a bit harder and some guys may decline if you aren't in their TS, but hey that's just life right?

I like your stance on social media. I have a facebook account that is only for family and people I know in real life...and I don't use it. I don't even recall when I last checked it. I don't twitter...it has the twit in it ffs. All the other o'grams and such are not something I pay any mind to.

Oh and just in case TS finds its way onto your computer, the first address is the hub my unit uses (BCMC) and we will take anyone who will listen to some very basic stuff (really simple such as not standing behind a friendly mech and spread out and not clump up) along for some drops. We do ask that if a unit member needs a spot, non unit members make room for them but it is not that often we are a full 12 man of BCMC. We usually have guests (Haze for instance).

[Stealthrider]

Quote

on the subject of joining a group its far to much work. you have to spend hours searching (and I have no idea what this Team speak is everyone talks about but because I don't play hardly any online multiplayer games. those I have played already had integrated chat lobbies so you didn't need a third party site to hook up with a group). would love to group up with people but there is no real way to do so efficiently. why spend the hours looking for a group then play one match only to have to spend hours looking for another that is if yo can even find one on when your playing. no thank you. I Solo because I just don't have much of a choice since I have no friends that play this. one time I had the option to join a group for a match they asked how long I had been playing and I was honest about it and they instantly rescinded the offer with no further word (not saying all units are this way).

This. This right here is what I mean when I say that reaching players in-game is so much more important than just having the resources exist out of game. VeeOt is the average player, except even *more* involved as he is actually on the forum posting. If you want to convince new players to get in groups and get better at FP, it has to be through in-game initiatives.They've never heard of Comstar TS. Many of them likely have no idea what TeamSpeak even is. They don't know what builds are meta, they don't know which mechs are good and which aren't, but it's not because they're just bad players. They're uninformed, and most have no idea *how* to get informed and even if they do they're not likely to want to use third party programs and read through dozens of forum threads just to be told they're trash anyway.

You can talk about how easy it is to get on TS and join a drop, but to the average player just starting out in FP the idea is so foreign it may as well be written in Klingon. Hell, the average player won't even see these posts telling them how easy it is to get on TS and join a drop.

Edited by Stealthrider, 22 January 2018 - 11:52 PM.

[MischiefSC]

Phoolan Devi, on 22 January 2018 - 03:37 PM, said:

The problem with your equation is, that you won't do those 2.5-3k damage since there is only a limited amount to go around! There is no possible way everybody on a team is doing 2.5-3k damage and getting those 1.5m c-bills.

Mostly farming also starts with the third wave (of the farmed). So there are only about 24 mechs to ho around 12 ppl. Those are (or should be) lighter mechs wich means you already have dealt your main amount of dmg before farming even starts! Like I said...miniscule!

Depends how many of us are there but the difference in pay between 2 waves and 4 really is 33-50%. Assists, component destruction, in formation, spotting, protection, KMDDs, it all adds up. We can routinely have several people over 2k in damage. Yeah, it works out to about 700k more most the time. Give or take obviously, you're right - not all of us are 2.5 to 3k but who is rotates around. Sometimes you're the guy in front going down in a blaze of glory so your team can roll in to victory, sometimes you're the guy behind him mopping up. We all get our turns at different roles that drive wins.

[MischiefSC]

ApexSun, on 22 January 2018 - 04:54 PM, said:

I don't mean group drops....I have rarely seen a group of players of your skill level all randomly thrown together vs. a competent 12 man. You have been playing far longer than I so maybe I am wrong. I can only say that in the only 300 or so hours of FP that I have been involved in over the last few months, that I have not ever seen it happen.

A problem people have is that you only see the matches that you're in. So most pugs think that all units drop against is pugs; because the only matches they're in are matches where their side is pugs. Since only 4 pugs get pulled to fill an 8mans team out but 12 pugs fill a team that ends up all pugs if you pug drop you will, statistically, see only the matches that are mostly pugs on your side.

In reality teams drop vs teams a lot and small teams + pugs and pug teams beat 12mans periodically. It absolutely happens. If you put the effort into trying to help call every single drop you're in it would significantly increase the odds of that happening in the drops you're in for example.

Pugs beat teams. There are teams that are literally less of a challenge than a pure skittles team is.

[Reza Malin]

VeeOt Dragon, on 22 January 2018 - 10:34 PM, said:

..........the most fun I have had in matches though was when we had a lance (sometimes less) of experienced players from a unit doing shot calls. I think if more of these competitive prefab groups would downgrade from an entire team to just a lance or two there would be more fun over all. I don't mind a loss and I understand the skill gap but getting steamrollered despite the best efforts of a team is no fun.

Another thing I once suggested as an option, again, was again savaged by the TS circlejerk meme groupies. They want 12 man drops, regardless, no exceptions. So don't waste your time.

"but muh fwends"

I think teams comprised of matchmade lances would be much more interesting, and there would be a better chance of pug/veteran balance. It doesn't really matter the reasoning of either side though, or the demographics, there is zero compromise. It is just a dead game mode, appealing only to a select group of people.

Edited by Reza Malin, 23 January 2018 - 12:38 AM.

[sub2000]

Lanisu, on 22 January 2018 - 11:32 AM, said:

I still have a couple of probation matches to do before I can actually start earning loyalty points and have been queuing up for scouting. Most of the games I've played had my pug team going up against a pre made team of novas with flame throwers and we get rolled pretty hard.

The only scary premades in scouting are mpl novas or hbk-iia going for your legs. Or kite fridges, jeenas with 2 erll. First right leg than left, repeat. Or if you don't have ranged weapon farming. Right leg, arms, shoulders, left leg goes last. Very annoying .

Flamers novas are tasty snack. If you are using ssrms they are the easiest target because arms is the first thing which goes away. Dont forget to equip at least one coolshot though. But it is necessary part of any loadout anyway. Of course keeping distance and cover is the must.
Scouting is fun, because if you don't like your team you can yolo and start another round even quicker than in QP.

Quote

What is the point of these probation matches anyway?

No point. Bone to the oldtimers complaining about faction hoppers.

[MischiefSC]

Reza Malin, on 23 January 2018 - 12:34 AM, said:

Another thing I once suggested as an option, again, was again savaged by the TS circlejerk meme groupies. They want 12 man drops, regardless, no exceptions. So don't waste your time.

"but muh fwends"

I think teams comprised of matchmade lances would be much more interesting, and there would be a better chance of pug/veteran balance. It doesn't really matter the reasoning of either side though, or the demographics, there is zero compromise. It is just a dead game mode, appealing only to a select group of people.

Group queue isn't made for pugs either. The attempts to make it more 'pug' friendly, casual and a couple of casual buddies, served only to reduce the population.

All that's been done is compromise, which has served only to make the gameplay worse. 1 bukkit was terrible, voided hundreds and hundreds of players. Certainly didn't bring in hundreds and hundreds of pugs.

Remove pugging from FW, put the FW maps/modes in QP so people who want to derp around can do so.

Also I know that reality is the opposite of what you're interested in but the 'savaged by the ts circlejererk meme groupies' is a funny way of saying 'pointed out how terrible the idea was'.

You just let me know when you get a drop where you're not in a team of 4, 8 or 12. In any queue.

[Reza Malin]

MischiefSC, on 23 January 2018 - 12:48 AM, said:

Remove pugging from FW, put the FW maps/modes in QP so people who want to derp around can do so.

This is one half decent compromise I guess.

Listen, don't misunderstand me. I do not comment about this because I feel cheated or unfairly matched. I have played enough FP, both PUG and grouped to know how it works, and have played MWO since beta. Please do not make the common mistake here of thinking people who don't share an opinion are not competent. I just don't play it anymore, because its just not fun enough for the time investment.

I am simply pointing out that the current way FP works, and some of the attitudes around it, are why it is dead. Whether people choose to admit it or not, they can blame whatever they like. Show as many FW WARNING screenshots as they like. Make as many meme's about people less knowledgeable than them to make their TS pals laugh as they like.

The fact is, there aren't enough players, and that is for a reason. Players make games work, just as much as the developers do. Though in this case, a large portion of the blame has to fall on the devs for their half hearted changes to the FW as time went on.

Edited by Reza Malin, 23 January 2018 - 12:58 AM.

[sub2000]

MischiefSC, on 22 January 2018 - 02:37 PM, said:

DON'T DO IT, IT'S A TRAP!

I have over 220 mechs and over 240 mech bays.

It takes me a truly stupid, stupid long time to load in and out of matches. Everyone with much over 100 mechs is the same.

PGI punishes you for having lots of mechs. The best advice I can give people is quit buying mech packs, stick to 30 or fewer total mechs. Most of my stuff I don't touch anymore anyway because balance is absolute unmitigated **** overall.

Look at how many mechs there are available, look at how few are really useful or viable, then look at how few builds are useful or viable on those few mechs.

30 is probably more than you'll truly ever need, and that's playing IS and Clan.

Quit buying mech packs is the decision I made when the Nightstar was coming out and was clearly going to be ****, as was the Osiris (was that the one coming out with it?) and so I canceled those preorders and realized that the vast majority of mechs and loadouts are **** because game balance is absolute **** overall, tweaked to just a tiny handful.

30, max. More than you'll ever need.

I have 2 accounts. This with 150+ mechs and f2p with 18. There is no difference in loading time, or fps. and I have potato laptop.
Killing Tiles nonsence, getting good antivirus, and unloading or disabling (they keep restarting remote assistance with almost evey patch!!!) plentiful of other Microsoft crap is much more important if you care about any performance. If PGI bothered with linux client they would enjoy significantly bigger audience.

Edited by sub2000, 23 January 2018 - 01:02 AM.

[MischiefSC]

Reza Malin, on 23 January 2018 - 12:54 AM, said:

This is one half decent compromise I guess.

Listen, don't misunderstand me. I do not comment about this because I feel cheated or unfairly matched. I have played enough FP, both PUG and grouped to know how it works, and have played MWO since beta. Please do not make the common mistake here of thinking people who don't share an opinion are not competent. I just don't play it anymore, because its just not fun enough for the time investment.

I am simply pointing out that the current way FP works, and some of the attitudes around it, are why it is dead. Whether people choose to admit it or not, they can blame whatever they like. Show as many FW WARNING screenshots as they like. Make as many meme's about people less knowledgeable than them to make their TS pals laugh as they like.

The fact is, there aren't enough players, and that is for a reason. Players make games work, just as much as the developers do. Though in this case, a large portion of the blame has to fall on the devs for their half hearted changes to the FW as time went on.

Except you routinely insult people who don't share your opinion.

The reason there are no people in FW is not in any way tied to premade teams in FW - teams are what filled FW from the beginning. Thousands of players, many thousands, played FW in teams and units. They didn't quit because other people were playing in teams too.

That whole train of logic is flawed. FW was made for teams and because of respawns hugely doubles down on the value of teamwork. We fought to get pugging allowed in FW and that worked for a long time, until 1 bukkit and the attempt to draw in casual QP players to FW - who keep trying to play FW like it's QP and are accordingly crushed.

FW is never going to be the draw for that sort of player that QP is because in FW no matter what you do respawns, drop decks and more complex match goals will hugely reward teamwork which, in turn, gets the solo yolos destroyed. Trying to cater to solo yolo QP pugs is never, ever going to population FW. It never was going to.

[Fuerchtenichts]

I can only encourage new players to get in contact with the veterans. Most of the premades are simply formed on the friends list feature. So you don't have to join a unit.

1. If you are as a pug by accident in a drop with a premade (one unit or just a faction premade) just ask in game if they would invite you for the next game. (so they can pick you up in the lfg)
2. Join their TS/Discord
3. Socialize with them
4. Add them to your friends list
5. They will see when you are online from that moment on and can invite you much easier the next time

The more "friends" you have, the easier you will find a group to play with in future!

[Reza Malin]

MischiefSC, on 23 January 2018 - 01:20 AM, said:

Except you routinely insult people who don't share your opinion.

The reason there are no people in FW is not in any way tied to premade teams in FW - teams are what filled FW from the beginning. Thousands of players, many thousands, played FW in teams and units. They didn't quit because other people were playing in teams too.

That whole train of logic is flawed. FW was made for teams and because of respawns hugely doubles down on the value of teamwork. We fought to get pugging allowed in FW and that worked for a long time, until 1 bukkit and the attempt to draw in casual QP players to FW - who keep trying to play FW like it's QP and are accordingly crushed.

FW is never going to be the draw for that sort of player that QP is because in FW no matter what you do respawns, drop decks and more complex match goals will hugely reward teamwork which, in turn, gets the solo yolos destroyed. Trying to cater to solo yolo QP pugs is never, ever going to population FW. It never was going to.

Insults are par for the course these days in this section of the forums. I used to try to be laid back and it is not reciprocated so I get it in before the meme brigade turn up. You are an exception usually, I will admit. We have had good discussions elsewhere and agreed on things previously. This is, however, the most polarizing issue on the forums.

Sadly the thinking is not flawed. Yes, yes, I know that it was initially filled with teams I was there too. It was good fun intitally, even with clans being as powerful as they were. Over time it slowly died and nothing was changed to preserve it because of the outcries of the same people who stalk these threads.

The real flaw in FW, forgetting the lore, is that is basically trying to create a competitive environment, without essentially admitting it or enforcing it other than a blue text box. Because casual players can wander in and out, they frequently do.

That is how it is, no matter how the guys who think it should be played a certain way feel about it.

As proved here, you can shout about using TS and joining a unit as much as you want, but most people simply can't be bothered doing all that for what is essentially an FPS. Also adding that the vast majority of MWO players are casual, hence the QP numbers, also increases the catchment of casual players going into FP, or just wanting more depth in their matches.

It is what it is. I would think that after years of shouting about it, people would start to realise most people don't want to do these things. Hence why I have realised the mode is dead and that these discussions are pointless. They all go full circle back to insults and meme generators.

Edited by Reza Malin, 23 January 2018 - 01:50 AM.

[Danjo San]

Reza Malin, on 23 January 2018 - 01:48 AM, said:

Insults are par for the course these days in this section of the forums. I used to try to be laid back and it is not reciprocated so I get it in before the meme brigade turn up. You are an exception usually, I will admit. We have had good discussions elsewhere and agreed on things previously. This is, however, the most polarizing issue on the forums.

Sadly the thinking is not flawed. Yes, yes, I know that it was initially filled with teams I was there too. It was good fun intitally, even with clans being as powerful as they were. Over time it slowly died and nothing was changed to preserve it because of the outcries of the same people who stalk these threads.

The real flaw in FW, forgetting the lore, is that is basically trying to create a competitive environment, without essentially admitting it or enforcing it other than a blue text box. Because casual players can wander in and out, they frequently do.

That is how it is, no matter how the guys who think it should be played a certain way feel about it.

As proved here, you can shout about using TS and joining a unit as much as you want, but most people simply can't be bothered doing all that for what is essentially an FPS. Also adding that the vast majority of MWO players are casual, hence the QP numbers, also increases the catchment of casual players going into FP, or just wanting more depth in their matches.

It is what it is. I would think that after years of shouting about it, people would start to realise most people don't want to do these things. Hence why I have realised the mode is dead and that these discussions are pointless. They all go full circle back to insults and meme generators.

Yes, FP is full of casuals. And that's neither a bad nor a good thing.
Competitive is Competitive, Private Lobby and Leagues are competitive.
FP is and has always also been for the casuals. If it was to be solely for the Competitive 12 man Teams, it would be as dead as the comp queue is.
In fact the majority of players in mw:o are merely casual players.
OP was suggesting a "code of honor" to create a less hostile enviroment. But all you read here on the Forum is:
It's hardcore mode, their own fault for being farmed... or
I waited 3 minutes to find a match so I'ts my PGI given right to farm every last point of DMG and make the match last as long as possible.
The latter is the one that cracks me up the most, especially after being told several times: "We don't want to farm, we are here looking for a good fight."
You wait three minutes for a match, push in in 5mins kill the first wave and have the power to end the match, clearly it's not a good fight. But hey, I will most likely have to wait for 3 minutes again to get another match so lets make this one last as long as possible.

On the receiving end it's even worse: You wait for three minutes, then you have to wait and watch for 15-25 minutes, while you and your teambuddies are farmed before you can even drop into the next match! Yes unlike Quickplay you can't start a new match until the old FP Match has ended.

The next argument usually then is "git gud", Ok. Yes you want to be successful you need to improve. In order to improve you need to know where the mistake was and try to not make it the next time. By prolonging the match you are actually adding time and frustration between the actual mistake and the point where the player can try to make it better. And in this way makeing it much harder for the player to learn from, if he does at all. cause the additional buildup of extra frustration by being farmed masks out the actual problem. "wrong positioning of wave 1" then turns into "Enemy is OP, pls nerf"

[Kroete]

Javin, on 18 January 2018 - 10:20 AM, said:

Or, we can look at PGI and ask why do they no longer care about FP?

Less then 10% of the playerbase is no base for using more resources on it.

Why is the playerbase so small, is the real question.
And there is more then one answer for it.
Some come from pgi, some from the playerbase.

But its anyway too late, the money now goes to solaris.

[naterist]

Maybe people leave fw because regular players give newbs **** all the time?

Like, this ENNNNTTTTIIIIIIIRRRREEE thread, is an example of something that might put off new people, for example.

[Eirik Eriksson]

naterist, on 23 January 2018 - 08:18 AM, said:

Maybe people leave fw because regular players give newbs **** all the time?

Like, this ENNNNTTTTIIIIIIIRRRREEE thread, is an example of something that might put off new people, for example.

But, but..if we remove the threads, the "box" would be the only protection left....how can we then continue living in our box?

Edited by Slow Speed, 23 January 2018 - 08:50 AM.

[MischiefSC]

Reza Malin, on 23 January 2018 - 01:48 AM, said:

Insults are par for the course these days in this section of the forums. I used to try to be laid back and it is not reciprocated so I get it in before the meme brigade turn up. You are an exception usually, I will admit. We have had good discussions elsewhere and agreed on things previously. This is, however, the most polarizing issue on the forums.

Sadly the thinking is not flawed. Yes, yes, I know that it was initially filled with teams I was there too. It was good fun intitally, even with clans being as powerful as they were. Over time it slowly died and nothing was changed to preserve it because of the outcries of the same people who stalk these threads.

The real flaw in FW, forgetting the lore, is that is basically trying to create a competitive environment, without essentially admitting it or enforcing it other than a blue text box. Because casual players can wander in and out, they frequently do.

That is how it is, no matter how the guys who think it should be played a certain way feel about it.

As proved here, you can shout about using TS and joining a unit as much as you want, but most people simply can't be bothered doing all that for what is essentially an FPS. Also adding that the vast majority of MWO players are casual, hence the QP numbers, also increases the catchment of casual players going into FP, or just wanting more depth in their matches.

It is what it is. I would think that after years of shouting about it, people would start to realise most people don't want to do these things. Hence why I have realised the mode is dead and that these discussions are pointless. They all go full circle back to insults and meme generators.

Except most people in FW did those things. Group up, get on TS.

You guys keep trying to gloss over it but for about 18 months there were thousands of players in FW and the great majority grouped up and used TS and played as teams.

You keep trying to imply that teams and units left FW because of... what, other teams and units? That's a lie. Baseless and false. They all made it clear why they left; no depth, no purpose, the promised content was not delivered. Being a loyalist was useless, no logistics, etc.

Wasn't an issue with casuals until after 1 Bukkit and the introduction of QP maps and a small influx of casual pugs - along with the almost complete void of the loyalist units who had been onboarding and recruiting and training the new players up since FW began. 1 Bukkit was the final nail in the coffin of even a glimmer of hope that PGI was going to deliver even a fraction of what they had promised and so a ton more people left.

Now we have casual QP pugs instead of the FW pugs we had before and they get constantly destroyed because they're trying to play FW like it's QP.

You keep dodging the 'you're in a team of 12' thing. Everyone making these same bad arguments does the same thing. You're in a team of 12. If you don't play like that then when the other team does, you lose. Same happens in QP just the matches are over more quickly and pay less so it's less noticeable.

However teamwork dominates even in QP. Look at my stats - for the last 4 months my w/l in QP has been around a 2.0, a bit over or under. That's winning 2 out of 3 matches. It's almost all pug queue. I play group queue a handful of times a month and I lose more in group queue than I do QP. That's not because I'm a great pilot - I'm not. I'm alright but I don't carry on my stats. I just try to call every QP drop I'm in. The result is I win 2x as many matches as normal. Hundreds and hundreds of matches over several months. With the teamwork heavy nature of FW if I did that there in a QP environment (all pugs) it would be even higher and I'd be camping as many spawns as I do playing in a KCom team.

There is nothing you'll do with the matchmaker that will make people playing badly win more often. Not playing to a team is playing badly. The argument that the game is flawed for not dumbing down to try and cater to the lowest common denominator is absolutely flawed; you can't change the skill distribution.

Team of 12. Every drop. Also DHS are better than SHS and IS mechs die on ST loss. Player opinion on those facts are irrelevant. They all directly impact success and survival every match.

[MischiefSC]

Danjo San, on 23 January 2018 - 02:29 AM, said:

Yes, FP is full of casuals. And that's neither a bad nor a good thing.
Competitive is Competitive, Private Lobby and Leagues are competitive.
FP is and has always also been for the casuals. If it was to be solely for the Competitive 12 man Teams, it would be as dead as the comp queue is.
In fact the majority of players in mw:o are merely casual players.
OP was suggesting a "code of honor" to create a less hostile enviroment. But all you read here on the Forum is:
It's hardcore mode, their own fault for being farmed... or
I waited 3 minutes to find a match so I'ts my PGI given right to farm every last point of DMG and make the match last as long as possible.
The latter is the one that cracks me up the most, especially after being told several times: "We don't want to farm, we are here looking for a good fight."
You wait three minutes for a match, push in in 5mins kill the first wave and have the power to end the match, clearly it's not a good fight. But hey, I will most likely have to wait for 3 minutes again to get another match so lets make this one last as long as possible.

On the receiving end it's even worse: You wait for three minutes, then you have to wait and watch for 15-25 minutes, while you and your teambuddies are farmed before you can even drop into the next match! Yes unlike Quickplay you can't start a new match until the old FP Match has ended.

The next argument usually then is "git gud", Ok. Yes you want to be successful you need to improve. In order to improve you need to know where the mistake was and try to not make it the next time. By prolonging the match you are actually adding time and frustration between the actual mistake and the point where the player can try to make it better. And in this way makeing it much harder for the player to learn from, if he does at all. cause the additional buildup of extra frustration by being farmed masks out the actual problem. "wrong positioning of wave 1" then turns into "Enemy is OP, pls nerf"

Except I've tried to tell players 'hey, next time you need to move up. If you stay in or right next to your DZ you're inevitably going to get spawn camped'. The response is not productive.

The problem is that you're trying to make it the responsibility of the players who put in the effort to improve, pay attention and learn, then execute, on what wins to try and fix the people who are unwilling to do any of that. That's not reasonable.

Nobody on the giving end of a stomp installed MWO, logged in and had it all down with a full stable of mechs from day 1. They all put in the effort to be successful. This isn't real life; nobody here was born with an advantage over everyone else. We all started on the exact same footing. There's no inequality here, nobody born with a silver spoon.

The struggle of FW isn't one of people who just play the game and try to improve, put in the effort and reap the rewards of it and people who just want handed the best rewards for showing up and who want the game to change to make them a winner regardless of their effort extended.

That's unfair, unreasonable and unrealistic. It's a terrible game design to boot for a PvP game. Also the suggestion has been repeatedly made to put the content in QP, the maps and modes. If you want the LP rewards you need to earn them like everyone else. The threat of 'well then we'll just leave!' has been universally answered with 'Okay. Bye.' The threat isn't relevant. Nobody cares. It has no teeth. Nobody asked QP style pugs to come fill in FW and refuse to adapt like the many thousands of other players did and have since FW came out.

This isn't a 'Git Gud' scrub thing. Nobody in FW is saying they're comp tier. Just saying that FW requires a tiny, tiny bit more effort than QP, here's how you accomplish that tiny, tiny bit of effort to be successful. If someone doesn't want to put that effort in then okay. Have fun in QP.

The problem is all the people saying 'ZOMG NOES! EFFORTS ARE HARD AND IMPOSSIBLE! MAKE ME WIN BUT NOT HAVE TO EFFORTS!'

lol. No.

[Stealthrider]

Here's a simple thing that might actually help get newer players to hop into TS/join a group drop/join a unit:

What if, after a pug stomping, the group responsible simply posts in all chat something along the lines of, "Hey, we all had to start somewhere. You'll do better with a group. It's easy to do, just download TeamSpeak, hop onto (insert address here) and make a few friends. You'll learn a lot, win more and have more fun. Try it out!"

If it's spread enough through actual in-game chat, it's pretty much guaranteed that more newbies will catch on. And it's a lot better than insults and mockery, that's for sure.