165 replies to this topic

[A Shoddy Rental Mech]

Mystere, on 21 January 2018 - 10:28 AM, said:

I am still waiting for a solid reason for the CERPPC nerf.

Same reason PGI nerfed the clan erLL on December.

The Nerf Bat, on 12 December 2017 - 05:16 AM, said:

People wanted the clan heavy large lasers nerfed.

PGI nerfs Clan ER large instead.

Seems about right.

PGI don't want to address the heavy lasers, so they pick another weapon for a token nerf.

[Khobai]

Quote

So the facts and math came out and all the first 1-3 page posters have gone to ground?

I just math'd this one up as well... Given the mech is tonnage limited.

6MPL LBK
Current
28.5 (10.5%) = 2.9925. Total heat = 25.5057

New
28.5 (8.4%) = 2.394. Total heat = 26.106

Total difference of 0.60 extra heat.

19cDHS is dissipating roughly 3.6 heat a second (off top of my head). That obviously does not include coolrun node buffs either.
So at ~3.6h/ps the 0.60 extra heat means it's taking an extra 0.17 seconds to cool off.

Not sure I'm gonna find .17 seconds to cool, MWO is too fast paced brah

the heat gen quirk effectively gives you both dissipation and heat capacity.

youre only addressing the heat dissipation loss. not the loss of potential heat capacity.

so the nerf is a little bit worse than that.

[MischiefSC]

Khobai, on 21 January 2018 - 06:33 PM, said:

the heat gen quirk effectively gives you both dissipation and heat capacity.

youre only addressing the heat dissipation loss. not the loss of potential heat capacity.

so the nerf is a little bit worse than that.

It's like 2 pts.

[Kin3ticX]

November11th, on 20 January 2018 - 01:39 PM, said:

What i gleaned from those patch notes is that PGI only listen to feedback when it comes from comp players. Also, PGI not only isnt interested in our feedback and but all weapon changes are made based on the whim of one man who doesnt actually play the game. Stop nerfing things ffs. Fix the game breaking issues you introduce with every patch. Quit slapping the **** out of your clan population. Buff IS instead of nerfing. Quit giving mechs and weapons roles with no clear definition on how you wish for them to be used in this "sandbox" of a game. Its iritating as hell.

They tried buffing IS mechs with 50% cooldowns and heat gen and it was stupid silly AF.

Right now Clans are still superior. Most of the mechs used in the 2017 world champ were clan.

As far as talking to comp players go, thats a good place to start since they were using clan mechs almost exclusively.

They were almost exclusively playing Clan despite Heavy Gauss, Heavy PPCs, and that laundry list of fluff IS got that is mostly meh. ("Stealth" Armor LOL)

As far as my own account goes, most of my top performers have been clan mechs and I have twice as many IS mechs. I don't even have the Deathstrike because im not chasing that carrot but that would just be another mech in my top 5.

This is extracted from my own stats


If I whaled and got a Deathstrike, that would easily be one of my top 10 if not the top 5. The Deathstrike will get the same treatment at some point, probably through crippling changes to mobility and yaw.

This also illustrates the history of PGI's foot dragging whack-o-mole based balancing. Most of those mechs have since been nerfed.

Some of those IS mechs only got there with massive quirkenings while the Clan mechs got there just by being Clan.

Granted these are just MY stats but they jive with whats been going on.

Edited by Kin3ticX, 21 January 2018 - 06:38 PM.

[Khobai]

Quote

It's like 2 pts.

the point is it wasnt mentioned

its both a nerf to dissipation AND capacity

[sycocys]

I only browsed through people's math... but it looked like even with say the MPL nerf, that they were still going to end up being at least slightly better than their IS counterpart outside of maybe a few quirked mechs.

Guess I really don't see the reason for the fuss.

[InvictusLee]

Dago Red, on 21 January 2018 - 07:02 AM, said:

Secondly if I my slightly spicy tubery self (I self identify as a radish)

You had me at tubery. Lets be friends!

Also, i work for a couple days and come back to find this thread alive and thriving. Color me tickled!

[visionGT4]

sycocys, on 21 January 2018 - 06:58 PM, said:

Guess I really don't see the reason for the fuss.

Because perceived threat to clam easy mode. Funniest part is that clams needed an IS person to do the maths for them

easy moders gonna easy mode

[Mystere]

sycocys, on 21 January 2018 - 06:58 PM, said:

Guess I really don't see the reason for the fuss.

I don't know about the others, but, the fuss from my end is that if the changes were negligible, then what was the point of spending very limited time, effort, money, and other developer resources on those instead of wisely spending them on something else?

visionGT4, on 21 January 2018 - 07:59 PM, said:

Because perceived threat to clam easy mode. Funniest part is that clams needed an IS person to do the maths for them

easy moders gonna easy mode

Really? Are you sure about all of that?

Edited by Mystere, 21 January 2018 - 08:07 PM.

[InvictusLee]

Mystere, on 21 January 2018 - 08:05 PM, said:

I don't know about the others, but, the fuss from my end is that if the changes were negligible, then what was the point of spending very limited time, effort, money, and other developer resources on those instead of wisely spending them on something else?





Really? Are you sure about all of that?

idk anout clan mechs being OP. Bandito kicks the crap outta me all the time from across the map in his LL Battlemaster, which is generally a meh chassis.

[marcusmaximus55]

pawg game dude , peace out 8)

[Y E O N N E]

November11th, on 21 January 2018 - 08:08 PM, said:

idk anout clan mechs being OP. Bandito kicks the crap outta me all the time from across the map in his LL Battlemaster, which is generally a meh chassis.

Battlemaster is the best ERLL trade 'Mech in the game, though...

[Wil McCullough]

i see we're still at it nerfing entire weapon systems to balance things when we should be looking at chassis-specific changes.

ah pgi. never stop being you.

[justcallme A S H]

Khobai, on 21 January 2018 - 06:33 PM, said:

the heat gen quirk effectively gives you both dissipation and heat capacity.

youre only addressing the heat dissipation loss. not the loss of potential heat capacity.

so the nerf is a little bit worse than that.

I am addressing the raw numbers without even taking heat cap or coolrun into account, which further buff mech heat overall

No quirks to speak of. Tell more absurdity. This is fun

[Vellron2005]

For me, the nerfs to clans seem random and unnecessary.. it's like "oh we gotta nerf something.. let's nerf the clans some more, they are OP anyway.."..

it's like Clans are getting nerfed on the basis of prejudice..

And then again, the Assassin, which is cancer, is getting it's armor quirks turned to structure quirks.. boo bloody hoo..

That mech has the durability of an assault.. just like the Urbanmech.. (also known as mini-atlas).

It's business as usual.. add a new mech, obligatory clan nerf, completely ignore the big game issues...

[Burning2nd]

the game broke the second they introduced the first wave of clan mechs.. and then it broke even harder when they did the weapons release

It was better back in LRMagedddon days

[Khobai]

justcallme A S H, on 21 January 2018 - 10:36 PM, said:

I am addressing the raw numbers without even taking heat cap or coolrun into account, which further buff mech heat overall

No quirks to speak of. Tell more absurdity. This is fun

I understand that. im not talking about cool run or heat containment.

im talking about how the heat gen skill itself effectively raises your heat capacity by lowering the amount of heat your weapons generate

if a laser generates less heat you can fire it more times before overheating, which has the same effect as increasing the heat capacity.

so nerfing the heat gen skill results in both a loss of dissipation as well as heat capacity.

[justcallme A S H]

Heat dissipation rate stays the same.

It just means there is more heat to dissipate... All 0.20 seconds of it.

Increased heat and heat capacity use, is the same thing. Literally changing the name for the same thing.
Overall heat capacity remains unchanged and, as we've proven to you many times, an increase of weapon heat is less than 1pt of total heat, almost half.

So if you wait that 0.20 extra seconds after firing there is zero impact to heat capacity overall.

Next?

Edited by justcallme A S H, 22 January 2018 - 01:29 AM.

[sceii]

Cmpl are a bit closer to is medium lasers then to medium pulses.
you bascly get a better version of isml with 40% more damage, close to same duration, close to same heat efficiency and close to same maximum range.
It will still be best clan energy weapon for close to medium range.

[Lily from animove]

tker 669, on 20 January 2018 - 02:17 PM, said:

4. business stat? you mean strat as in strategy? well gees MLB, NBA, NHL, and NFL seem to being doing ok catering to the elite....

Thats becasue with fans and such this "Elite" is what generates the money. I doubt the Elite in MWO is doing the major payment for the game and PGI to keep going. So catering the Elite may be a not so good idea.
the truly bad taste about this "nerf" is that it is again an all across the board nerf which counts the same for all clan chassis, and some clan chassis care still bad. So how does balance justify these nerfs? it doesn't because balance affecting multiple chassis even the bad ones does not create more balance at all, it just balances some top2top chassis. Thats why listening to only the comps is a bad idea because amongst the comps there is anyways an accepted "dead" amount of things they don't even care about anymore. But all thats at the bottomg of ablance being crap should be brought up, instead of being nerfed further downward by across the board changes.

Edited by Lily from animove, 23 January 2018 - 01:49 AM.