63 replies to this topic

[Yosharian]

Viktor Drake, on 29 March 2018 - 07:31 AM, said:

The reason the Light Gauss Rifle has a bad reputation is because it constantly gets compared to the standard Gauss Rifle. I mean if you sit those two side by side it looks like the standard Gauss Rifle totally outclasses the Light Gauss Rifle. However people are comparing it against the wrong weapon. Instead they need to be looking at it as a direct replacement for the AC/10, especially now that they have reduced the cooldown.

If you compare the LGR to the AC/10, they are the same weight right down to the ammo for ton and use the exact same slots. The AC/10 does 2 more points of damage but unlike the AC/10 the Light Gauss Rifle has nearly zero impact on heat which means you can generally remove a few heat sinks to devote to more firepower, engine size, etc. Also the LGR has a much higher velocity slug which makes it much easier to hit with than the AC/10. Finally because of reduction in weight and slot requirement, the LGR will fit in builds that can't accommodate a full size standard Gauss Rifle.

So honestly, there are a ton of advantages to using the LGR, at least as long as your looking at it as an optional replacement in applications where you would normally select the AC/10. They are absolute not garbage or bad in any way.

AC10 has almost double the DPS of the LGR

fail argument

[ShiverMeRivets]

Yosharian, on 29 March 2018 - 06:34 PM, said:

AC10 has almost double the DPS of the LGR

fail argument

AC10 has a higher full face time DPS on paper, that is true. The difference is much less in practice. If you are going to put 1 ballistic on your mech, the AC10 wins by points.

Now try putting 2 AC10s in your IS mech (clan is different). If your 2 ballistic mounts are in one side torso - you can't! Not with LE/XL engines, and probably not with STD because of tonnage. You CAN put 2LGRs in there. What are the alternatives? The largest alpha would be LBX10+AC5. So 15 vs. 16 per shot, but higher DPS and 5 tons less. I don't know why by this just does not play out as well, especially not at range. The next option is a combination of 2 of the 5s (AC, UAC, LBX). I really do not like the 5s. Too slow for a proper dakka barrage, too weak alpha for peaking/twisting (unless you have 3 or more of them). The 2's series are pure stare down DPS. So 2LGR starts to look as an appealing alternative. There are quite a few IS mechs with 2 ballistic ST mounts. Others that can load AC10 one on each side need not apply.

Reducing the LGR weight would make it a much more appealing option for some IS mechs. LGR could easily lose 1 ton and still be only a "meh" weapon. I'd leave its damage where it is.

[Mole]

Viktor Drake, on 29 March 2018 - 07:31 AM, said:

The reason the Light Gauss Rifle has a bad reputation is because it constantly gets compared to the standard Gauss Rifle. I mean if you sit those two side by side it looks like the standard Gauss Rifle totally outclasses the Light Gauss Rifle. However people are comparing it against the wrong weapon. Instead they need to be looking at it as a direct replacement for the AC/10, especially now that they have reduced the cooldown.

If you compare the LGR to the AC/10, they are the same weight right down to the ammo for ton and use the exact same slots. The AC/10 does 2 more points of damage but unlike the AC/10 the Light Gauss Rifle has nearly zero impact on heat which means you can generally remove a few heat sinks to devote to more firepower, engine size, etc. Also the LGR has a much higher velocity slug which makes it much easier to hit with than the AC/10. Finally because of reduction in weight and slot requirement, the LGR will fit in builds that can't accommodate a full size standard Gauss Rifle.

So honestly, there are a ton of advantages to using the LGR, at least as long as your looking at it as an optional replacement in applications where you would normally select the AC/10. They are absolute not garbage or bad in any way.

I'm going to have to completely disagree with you here. An AC/10 can fire twice in the time it takes a LGR to fire once. And that's not even bringing into the argument the fact that a UAC/10 can double an AC/10s DPS for one ton more so long as you are willing to deal with it firing in two shot bursts and the chance of a jam, which I almost always am. I do not own a single Inner Sphere 'mech that continues to mount an AC/10 and has not switched entirely to UAC/10s. I even have a few 'mechs that mount a single UAC/10 that acts as a poor man's AC/20. When faced with the choice between an AC/10 and a LGR I see little reason to take the LGR and, if I happen to be able to make room for one extra ton, then there is simply zero reason to take a LGR over a UAC/10.

Edited by Mole, 30 March 2018 - 12:15 PM.

[Sjorpha]

Mole, on 30 March 2018 - 12:14 PM, said:

I'm going to have to completely disagree with you here. An AC/10 can fire twice in the time it takes a LGR to fire once. And that's not even bringing into the argument the fact that a UAC/10 can double an AC/10s DPS for one ton more so long as you are willing to deal with it firing in two shot bursts and the chance of a jam, which I almost always am. I do not own a single Inner Sphere 'mech that continues to mount an AC/10 and has not switched entirely to UAC/10s. I even have a few 'mechs that mount a single UAC/10 that acts as a poor man's AC/20. When faced with the choice between an AC/10 and a LGR I see little reason to take the LGR and, if I happen to be able to make room for one extra ton, then there is simply zero reason to take a LGR over a UAC/10.

It's obvious that the AC10 is a better short to mid range DPS weapons than light gauss, but I find that argument a little weird.

The current niche of the Light Gauss is extreme range and 0 heat so it can push the sustained output of complementary energy weapons. The AC10/UAC10 doesn't fill either of those niches, it can't engage at Light gauss ranges and it has it's own heat production to manage, though it can also be effective combined with lasers ot doesn't have the special quality of 0 heat fallback/spiker that gauss rifles are typically used for, and it also doesn't have the velocity of gauss which allows starting or ending a laser burn with the gauss round without having to think much about independent leading, in most cases you'll want to fire the gauss dead on where the lasers are already pointing while and AC would require adjustments, this is one of the reason the gaussvomit meta works so well.

So the typical Light gauss nich would be either combined with ERLL for extreme range or to damage spike midrange laser loadouts without adding heat or clunky aiming.

I'm inclined to agree that the light gauss is slightly too weak as it is, but I really see no strong point in measuring DPS and things like that against weapons that have basically 0 overlap in their optimal application.

I also thing the Match patch cooldown reduction on AC10 put it on equal footing with UAC10 (which didn't get any buff) on a lot of mechs, it's a very significant DPS increase and you already had the pinpoint and weight advantage. It's definitely not a no brainer choice anymore, and mechs that can use 3 or 4 AC10 (Ilya, loyalty Victor and Anni 1A) are also very strong now as a result.