572 replies to this topic

[Jonathan8883]

Ok, so...the Nova now has to triple fire its weapons instead of being able to do Arm 1/ Arm 2.
My 2x HLL Ice Ferret is now torched? Lame. It only has a couple of hardpoints; it's not like I can fit 4 mediums on there instead of one of the HLLs, unless I want to take the side torso that's made of kleenex.

I think I'll just have to shelve most of my non-ATM builds until this is rolled back.

Edited by Jonathan8883, 12 May 2018 - 04:11 AM.

[Alvar Von Kenesthor]

I think you all are overreacting, there are totally obviously incredibly OP mechs like the Black Lanner or the Ice Ferret who are not affected by this nerf...
Oh, wait, I think my irony metter just exploded...

On a more serious note, is the responsible of this changes even reading this thread or just as usual pulling of the classic "if you don't read them, there aren't any complains"?

[Chaka Khan]

Alvar Von Kenesthor, on 12 May 2018 - 04:19 AM, said:

I think you all are overreacting, there are totally obviously incredibly OP mechs like the Black Lanner or the Ice Ferret who are not affected by this nerf...
Oh, wait, I think my irony metter just exploded...

On a more serious note, is the responsible of this changes even reading this thread or just as usual pulling of the classic "if you don't read them, there aren't any complains"?

He is probably wanking off in the PGI studio with some other devs cause, they patting themselves so hard on the back, they cant help but suppose we love them now really hard.....

[Aleski]

Ho my gosh what a huge and bad hammering on the clan lasers... You kill almost all of my clan mechs.

I was thinking to buy some heroes with the sale, but well. My wallet is closed. You don't listen to the community : you deserve no money from the community.

Do you think it was to complicated to open the test server and let us give our inputs to adjust those new ghosts heats thresholds ? Don't tell me that was a bad idea.

HLL shouldn't be nerfed at all. ERML and MPL should be 5 max at a time.

Now you have to adjust again the damages, heat or duration of those weapons to make them viable again. Tune back the MPL to 8 damages ?

Ho and by the way, the rule of 30 damages for the ghost heat is completely stupid. What about dual Hgauss then ? What about 36 damages with 6x IS MPL ? What about dual LB20X ? What about dual LRM20 ? ATM ? Do you understand how stupid this statement is ?

Ghost heat is a ****** system, you have implement it in the first place has a bandage to fix some energy boating. It makes no sense at all today, you have to think to something better and more reallistic. What a huge faceplam reading this patch note today, i can't believe you are that bad at balancing your own game, PGI...

[FATA13RR0R]

Why you didn't nerf clan ppc and clan large pulses too? Clans still OP!

[Nema Nabojiv]

Aleski, on 12 May 2018 - 04:38 AM, said:

HLL shouldn't be nerfed at all. ERML and MPL should be 5 max at a time.

Stop that "5 max" bullshіt plz. There are ton of mechs relying on 6 meds or 6 pulses and just a single one of them was slightly overperforming, and that's only thanks to two gauss in addition to lasers.

[Xarchus]

I'm sorry PGI, but that blanket Clan ghost heat threshold nerf is absurd!

[Tarl Cabot]

Ragnar Baron Leiningen, on 12 May 2018 - 04:07 AM, said:

I cannot stress this enough, this limitation of lasers for clans just broke the clans for all but a very few mechs. Pgi you have made a terrible decision for sure. If you are going to continue forward with this, every clan mech 50 tons and above needs armor quirks and structure.

Technically, it is not a hard limitation, ie it is not a hard cap on how many can be fired at once, only firing more than the soft limit generates more heat that is usually approx the same of heat as another weapon without the actual damage of said weapon. Do not forget a heatscale that has absolutely no effect on a mech until it hits/passes 100% mark. Ghost heat setting only makes it more difficult to fire that weapon grouping more than once/twice before going to chain fire....which is not that terrible of an idea....Get in that alpha strike then chain fire.

Essentially, after patch firing 5 cERML will generate heat as if the player was firing 6.x cERML. Right now firing 7 cERML generates an additional heat as if firing 8.x cERML. Increasing heat per weapon would not have the major impact PGI intended, based on their notes, since the damage would still be there.

Aleski said:

Ghost heat is a ****** system, you have implement it in the first place has a bandage to fix some energy boating. It makes no sense at all today, you have to think to something better and more reallistic. What a huge faceplam reading this patch note today, i can't believe you are that bad at balancing your own game, PGI...

Agreed, the Ghost Heat mechanic in its current setup has seen very little updates, usually set to linking weapons or reducing/increase soft limit.

Imho, it should have been micro Ghost Heat, where firing more than one weapon generates micro-ghost heat.

Just one other thing. PGI could have always increased the base armor/structure points per tonnage across the board.

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 12 May 2018 - 04:52 AM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Nema Nabojiv, on 12 May 2018 - 04:45 AM, said:

Stop that "5 max" bullshіt plz. There are ton of mechs relying on 6 meds or 6 pulses and just a single one of them was slightly overperforming, and that's only thanks to two gauss in addition to lasers.

5 is certainly better than 4, though.

the more I think about it, the more I reckon they should have either;

1. Lowered the damage of the lasers, but compensated with shorter burn and/or lower heat.

2. Linked Large & Medium class lasers, Buffed LPL back to 13 damage, buffed MPL back to 8 damage, unlinked Small & Medium class lasers, buffed SPL to 5 damage (but not 6, yet).

[Adarven]

VonBruinwald, on 11 May 2018 - 05:03 PM, said:

All those Hellbringer pilots be mad as Blake now...

I run 4 ERML and 2 HLL at my Hellbringer - can do small Delete Button build like 4 ERML + 1 HLL + 1 LPL

Where I am mad is my regular Delete Button Supernove (4 ERML , 2 HLL, 2 LPL) - still dont know what to do with this

[Hawok79]

Energy Changes:
Clan ER Medium Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 5 (from 7)

Clan Medium Pulse Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 5 (from 7)

Clan Heavy Medium Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 4 (from 5)

Clan Heavy Large Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 2 (from 3)

Clan Laser Design notes:
When heat scale values were initially set for the clan lasers, Many lasers where set to equal the number of lasers fired on the IS side with no mind to the overall damage output of those said lasers. With one of our core focus' being better baseline balance between the Clan and Inner Sphere factions, we have decided that allowing one faction to compound on easily boatable weapons that deal 40% more damage than their IS equivalents while still being able to combine with other weapons has become untenable. We are adjusting the heat scale on the clan weapons to equal the "30 damage" cap that was used to tune all other laser weapons. The clans will still retain their direct range, and 40% or higher damage over similar IS weapons, but maximizing their benefits will have to come with either more staggered fire or diverse weapon payloads.

Just another Proof that you Guys don't know your own Game!!!

[Garran Tana]

Don't get bullied by whiners PGI! This lasers change is what people did ask for and it will stop the silly laser vomit alpha meta. Some want to play in easy mode, adapt and enjoy a better game.

[Navid A1]

InnerSphereNews, on 11 May 2018 - 03:26 PM, said:

Energy Changes:

Clan ER Medium Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 5 (from 7)

Clan Medium Pulse Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 5 (from 7)

Clan Heavy Medium Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 4 (from 5)

Clan Heavy Large Laser

• Minimum Heat Penalty reduced to 2 (from 3)

STOP IT!

Edited by Navid A1, 12 May 2018 - 05:29 AM.

[Natural Predator]

Tarl Cabot, on 12 May 2018 - 04:50 AM, said:

Technically, it is not a hard limitation, ie it is not a hard cap on how many can be fired at once, only firing more than the soft limit generates more heat that is usually approx the same of heat as another weapon without the actual damage of said weapon. Do not forget a heatscale that has absolutely no effect on a mech until it hits/passes 100% mark. Ghost heat setting only makes it more difficult to fire that weapon grouping more than once/twice before going to chain fire....which is not that terrible of an idea....Get in that alpha strike then chain fire.

Essentially, after patch firing 5 cERML will generate heat as if the player was firing 6.x cERML. Right now firing 7 cERML generates an additional heat as if firing 8.x cERML. Increasing heat per weapon would not have the major impact PGI intended, based on their notes, since the damage would still be there.


Agreed, the Ghost Heat mechanic in its current setup has seen very little updates, usually set to linking weapons or reducing/increase soft limit.

Imho, it should have been micro Ghost Heat, where firing more than one weapon generates micro-ghost heat.

Just one other thing. PGI could have always increased the base armor/structure points per tonnage across the board.

You completely missed the point. It’s not about the alpha it’s about the face time. Clan mechs simply cannot take the level of punishment that IS mechs can take. As someone who plays both sides that is painful obvious. By lowering the ability for clan mechs to limit face time, your subjecting them to extra return fire without a cooresponding survivability increase.

[Noguchi-san]

Garran Tana, on 12 May 2018 - 05:25 AM, said:

Don't get bullied by whiners PGI! This lasers change is what people did ask for and it will stop the silly laser vomit alpha meta. Some want to play in easy mode, adapt and enjoy a better game.

Yeah - so i will only bring lrms from now on.
Get yourself rdy for rainy weeks to come!

[Joshua McEvedy]

Might as well take the Clan mechs out of the game then if they are just going to be nerfed into oblivion. What are the energy intensive Supernovas, Hellbringers, War Hawks, Novas, and Nova Cats supposed to do with all the energy hard points that PGI established for them in the first place????

Ridiculous.

Thanks for nothing, Paul.

[Hawok79]

Garran Tana, on 12 May 2018 - 05:25 AM, said:

Don't get bullied by whiners PGI! This lasers change is what people did ask for and it will stop the silly laser vomit alpha meta. Some want to play in easy mode, adapt and enjoy a better game.

If i want to play "easy Mode" i take an IS Mech. No matter which Class or build, I ´ll do twice as much Kills.

[Natural Predator]

Garran Tana, on 12 May 2018 - 05:25 AM, said:

Don't get bullied by whiners PGI! This lasers change is what people did ask for and it will stop the silly laser vomit alpha meta. Some want to play in easy mode, adapt and enjoy a better game.

How much time do you spend in comp or faction play?

[James Wirth]

These reductions in Clan laser loadout and firing triggers for ghost heat are very poorly thought out, and immediately render many energy-focused trial, stock, champion, and hero chassis immediately nonviable upon purchase.

How are we Clan pilots with Cougars, Ice Ferrets, Novas, Stormcrows, Hellbringers, Nova Cats, War Hawks, and Supernovas supposed to fight with these mechs now when the alternative load out options are essentially nil.

This truly is a dezgra patch, PGI, and is not fair to Clan pilots at all, who have repeatedly seen our investments diminish over time in this endless and ultimately futile obsession to achieving some sort of balance between two different technology bases, one being superior to the other from the start.

Edited by James Wirth, 12 May 2018 - 06:24 AM.

[lolbbq]

This is stupid, what else can I mount on the supernova 1 with only 4 laser hardpoints in each arm (only other hardpoint on the mech is AMS), limited slots and a cap on engine size.

If I use "diverse" weapons as encouraged (but still all lasers ?!?!), I'm left with 3-4 tons left over and unable to maximize the damage potential of the mech.

Well, only myself to blame here because I bought it on this sale before reading the patch notes (ended up wondering why I was heating up so much in my first drop).

Anyone who is reading this and considering buying a supernova 1, don't you'll just end up with a white elephant.

If you're trying to nerf clan to the level of IS, maybe clan mechs should cost the same then no?

Another edit to fully express my displeasure : I was actually looking forward to playing this new mech after I came home from work. Guess work, after mucking around in the mechlab trying to find a workaround and then having a drop with stupid convoluted weapon groups. I've decided I'm done. Good thing I didnt spend a single cent. I'm going back to world of tanks.

Edited by lolbbq, 12 May 2018 - 06:16 AM.