101 replies to this topic

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 07:46 PM, said:

and be at a disadvantage? nah.

Try some of the good IS builds, laugh as you are ridiculously OP. Annihilator can survive being hit by 10 of the current Clan 78 damage alphas simultaneously just by twisting to the side. Or just take 3 and keep on kicking without even twisting.

Alternatively play Dragon, get 2 HPPC, hill peek while having agility similar to 45 ton mechs (about double that of a Hellbringer) and do 30 damage with exposure times under half a second while also having so much durability and great hitboxes that you can just walk out in the open infront of enemy teams whenever you want to by just showing your deadside to them if you find a better position you want to take up.

Really, high alphas are a joke, PPFLD is *STILL* where its at after all this time, aim good and you demolish people and they can't hurt you back since you're able to out twist them and use cover better than them.

[Deathlike]

So... the OP is telling people that spending or not spending their $$$ is wrong.

As much as I'd hope money isn't speech, but what actual effective means is telling a company that they made a mistake? Seriously?

When PGI doesn't respond to feedback, then what is a consumer to do? They are allowed like everyone else to spend or not spend on whatever they desire. It's simple as that. To tell them they are wrong is like saying they are not allowed to play this game. It's wrong and it serves noone when PGI is the one demonstrating fault in the eyes of the consumer. These are the people that PGI wanted to keep around and loyal right? Well, maybe PGI shouldn't be making this arbitrary mistake yes?


Remember, PGI is not holding a gun to everyone for a MC or mechpacks. Just remember that.

Edited by Deathlike, 12 May 2018 - 08:07 PM.

[MechaBattler]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 07:51 PM, said:

Many people did the math on day one, here it is.




IS currently already is superior in its top laser build vs the Clan top laser build in damage per tick, and thus is capable of beating Clan mechs in a laser trading based environment, especially when higher IS durability comes into play and the skill tree nodes mentioned are calculated.

If the changes had gone through Clans would have no chance against IS laser vomit at all.

Has anyone built around firing 5 er medium lasers? The heat gain is only about 7 heat. So something like this

https://mwo.smurfy-n...0eab19ed2259beb

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

MechaBattler, on 12 May 2018 - 08:07 PM, said:

Has anyone built around firing 5 er medium lasers? The heat gain is only about 7 heat. So something like this

https://mwo.smurfy-n...0eab19ed2259beb

5 ERML still causes the ghost heat that is generally better to just avoid anyway and the build you posted has a lower alpha than standard IS laser vomit meaning its totally useless in trades as its worse in everything that matters during a trade. You get higher expose times, lower damage, and lower damage per tick on a mech with lower total health, this means you lose all your trades and die and you have no options to make yourself not die like IS currently does with torso twisting after doing their alpha since they have lower durations.

[Mortalcoil]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 08:00 PM, said:

Try some of the good IS builds, laugh as you are ridiculously OP. Annihilator can survive being hit by 10 of the current Clan 78 damage alphas simultaneously just by twisting to the side. Or just take 3 and keep on kicking without even twisting.

Alternatively play Dragon, get 2 HPPC, hill peek while having agility similar to 45 ton mechs (about double that of a Hellbringer) and do 30 damage with exposure times under half a second while also having so much durability and great hitboxes that you can just walk out in the open infront of enemy teams whenever you want to by just showing your deadside to them if you find a better position you want to take up.

Really, high alphas are a joke, PPFLD is *STILL* where its at after all this time, aim good and you demolish people and they can't hurt you back since you're able to out twist them and use cover better than them.

lol, you put Annihilator and torso twisting together in the same sentence, the Annihilator that is about to be nerfed by 24 armor. See, unlike clan nerfs, the IS nerfs weren't removed due to epic tears.

Also, speaking of the dragon, did you know that the linebacker is 5 extra tons, able to boat lasers, and has better agility than the dragon? I can't help but notice you didn't mention it. I wonder why? That's weird.

Edited by Mortalcoil, 12 May 2018 - 08:56 PM.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 08:54 PM, said:

lol, you put Annihilator and torso twisting together

Also, speaking of the dragon, did you know that the linebacker is 5 extra tons, able to boat lasers, and has better agility than the dragon? I can't help but notice you didn't mention it. I wonder why? That's weird.

Why would I mention the Linebacker when the Dragon is leagues better? Dragon gets PPFLD damage, gets more durability and has better hitboxes. Linebacker has a huge CT that can be hit even at 90 degrees twist, meanwhile Dragon shows no CT at all at a 90 degrees twist.

>peek up over hill with Linebacker
>have to expose down to hip to get shot off while boating lasers
>everyone easily deletes your CT while you hold a beam on someone for 1.55 seconds

10/10 great mech.

Meanwhile with dragon you peek over a hill, expose only cockpit and high shoulder, able to aim and shoot someone and be back behind cover before your HPPCs even hit the target.


Also yeah, try twisting in the Annihilator rather than just relying on its pikenose when under heavy fire, the thing has ungodly potential to take damage. If you're not taking advantage of the CT only taking 40% damage through a destroyed side then you haven't seen durability.

[Mortalcoil]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 09:01 PM, said:

Why would I mention the Linebacker when the Dragon is leagues better? Dragon gets PPFLD damage, gets more durability and has better hitboxes. Linebacker has a huge CT that can be hit even at 90 degrees twist, meanwhile Dragon shows no CT at all at a 90 degrees twist.

>peek up over hill with Linebacker
>have to expose down to hip to get shot off while boating lasers
>everyone easily deletes your CT while you hold a beam on someone for 1.55 seconds

10/10 great mech.

Meanwhile with dragon you peek over a hill, expose only cockpit and high shoulder, able to aim and shoot someone and be back behind cover before your HPPCs even hit the target.


Also yeah, try twisting in the Annihilator rather than just relying on its pikenose when under heavy fire, the thing has ungodly potential to take damage. If you're not taking advantage of the CT only taking 40% damage through a destroyed side then you haven't seen durability.

ahahaa, you are comparing the dragon to the linebacker, and you say the linebacker has the huge CT. You're silly man. Yeah, the dragon's CT is fine. Oh man, you're good for a laugh.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 09:11 PM, said:

ahahaa, you are comparing the dragon to the linebacker, and you say the linebacker has the huge CT. You're silly man. Yeah, the dragon's CT is fine. Oh man, you're good for a laugh.

How far behind the meta are you? Dragon's CT was changed to be TINY like a year ago. Did you even watch last year's WC where Proton used a Dragon which was pretty much immune to dying since he used free look to aim the gun arm he was using (3 UAC2 build for overwatch rather than the peeking build I prefer) so that he could keep his CT hidden and keep on firing.

[Bombast]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 09:11 PM, said:

ahahaa, you are comparing the dragon to the linebacker, and you say the linebacker has the huge CT. You're silly man. Yeah, the dragon's CT is fine. Oh man, you're good for a laugh.

The Dragon, in the right hands, is tough as nails. It requires a bit more skill than your average mech (The arm shielding mentioned by Champion is a tough trick to manage for most), but if you can get it down, you can live forever.

The Linebacker is more fragile by a generous margin. It does some things better than the Dragon, some things worse, but its way worse at taking hits.

[Mortalcoil]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 09:14 PM, said:

How far behind the meta are you? Dragon's CT was changed to be TINY like a year ago. Did you even watch last year's WC where Proton used a Dragon which was pretty much immune to dying since he used free look to aim the gun arm he was using (3 UAC2 build for overwatch rather than the peeking build I prefer) so that he could keep his CT hidden and keep on firing.

nah man, I get the dragon. I just love how you are conveniently ignoring every single weakness IS has. Yeah, IS is OP. We get it. You poor underdog clans. Who cares that IS has never won an FP event. Who cares that 90% of mechs used in tournaments and MRBC are clan. Nah, it's IS that are strong.

but, it's fine, I get your game. I really do. As long as you can complain about IS you can pretend clan isn't OP. See, it's mental gymnastics of the highest order. Cognitive dissonance. As long as you have excuses you don't feel bad about clan being OP, and I really applaud that level of cognitive dissonance. I really do, but sadly I live in reality, but you go enjoy living in your world where you believe the IS is OP so that you can have a reason believe you are skillful for playing clan. Enjoy that. =)

[Lunatic NEo]

I love the Forums, every argument ever gets distracted by "but whatabout?!" Guys...

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 09:22 PM, said:

nah man, I get the dragon. I just love how you are conveniently ignoring every single weakness IS has. Yeah, IS is OP. We get it. You poor underdog clans. Who cares that IS has never won an FP event. Who cares that 90% of mechs used in tournaments and MRBC are clan. Nah, it's IS that are strong.

but, it's fine, I get your game. I really do. As long as you can complain about IS you can pretend clan isn't OP. See, it's mental gymnastics of the highest order. Cognitive dissonance. As long as you have excuses you don't feel bad about clan being OP, and I really applaud that level of cognitive dissonance. I really do, but sadly I live in reality, but you go enjoy living in your world where you believe the IS is OP so that you can have a reason believe you are skillful for playing clan. Enjoy that. =)

I love how EVERY time anyone ever says something is bad and something else is OP people just assuming you use the thing you are calling bad and don't use the thing you are calling OP. Meanwhile I main my Annihilator and Dragon, just recommended my buddy swap from Hellbringer to Dragon with the nerfs announced since he mained Hellbringers and he gets a 1000+ damage match right when he does it, stating how it was so good at the things I told him about.

How delusional do you have to be to believe that just because I see how good IS actually is that I'm just a mad Clanner asking for nerfs to IS and wanting to keep Clans "OP"?

Also you seem to be the one not living in reality. IS has won FP events, take a look at the more recent Tharkad event:
https://mwomercs.com...-tharkad-stats/

IS WL: 1.45, Clan WL: 0.87. IS winning over 66% more than Clans but Clans are totally OP, IS has never won a single FP event, IS is terrible.

Meanwhile in competitive play its totally different than regular gameplay or faction play and has a huge focus towards extreme range maps with the WC being played out entirely on just 3 maps (tourmaline,polar,canyon). Warhawks and Supernovas were some of the more often used overwatch mechs with Warhawks having not recieved the nerf to their cooldowns yet. Also there was a large focus on poptarts, which Summoner and Night Gyr did well. Meanwhile Wolfhound and Assassin dominated in their role of close attack rushers which could dismantle the long range mechs and hunt down open mechs and counter enemy lights.

Note that in all 18 matches of the WC finals 2017 there were only 3 Hellbringers, all 3 were piloted by the same person on polar highlands and the build was the quad ERLL build, not the high alpha build. There's no place for high alpha laser vomit assaults in comp play as it turns out because... what do you know... high durations in mid range get you killed when your enemies are competent and the viable options are both PPFLD poptarts.


But yeah, I'm the guy who isn't living in reality while I'm taking examples from comp play, using math, comparing actual builds, looking at historical statistics.

Edited by Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, 12 May 2018 - 09:50 PM.

[Mortalcoil]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 09:47 PM, said:

I love how EVERY time anyone ever says something is bad and something else is OP people just assuming you use the thing you are calling bad and don't use the thing you are calling OP. Meanwhile I main my Annihilator and Dragon, just recommended my buddy swap from Hellbringer to Dragon with the nerfs announced since he mained Hellbringers and he gets a 1000+ damage match right when he does it, stating how it was so good at the things I told him about.

How delusional do you have to be to believe that just because I see how good IS actually is that I'm just a mad Clanner asking for nerfs to IS and wanting to keep Clans "OP"?

Also you seem to be the one not living in reality. IS has won FP events, take a look at the more recent Tharkad event:
https://mwomercs.com...-tharkad-stats/

IS WL: 1.45, Clan WL: 0.87. IS winning over 66% more than Clans but Clans are totally OP, IS has never won a single FP event, IS is terrible.

Meanwhile in competitive play its totally different than regular gameplay or faction play and has a huge focus towards extreme range maps with the WC being played out entirely on just 3 maps (tourmaline,polar,canyon). Warhawks and Supernovas were some of the more often used overwatch mechs with Warhawks having not recieved the nerf to their cooldowns yet. Also there was a large focus on poptarts, which Summoner and Night Gyr did well. Meanwhile Wolfhound and Assassin dominated in their role of close attack rushers which could dismantle the long range mechs and hunt down open mechs and counter enemy lights.

Note that in all 18 matches of the WC finals 2017 there were only 3 Hellbringers, all 3 were piloted by the same person on polar highlands and the build was the quad ERLL build, not the high alpha build. There's no place for high alpha laser vomit assaults in comp play as it turns out because... what do you know... high durations in mid range get you killed when your enemies are competent and the viable options are both PPFLD poptarts.


But yeah, I'm the guy who isn't living in reality while I'm taking examples from comp play, using math, comparing actual builds, looking at historical statistics.

bwahahaa. Clan won the Battle of Tharkad. I said IS hasn't won any faction play events, and you sent me a link to an even they lost. Man, just...wow.

https://www.reddit.c...ad_victor_clan/

The top comment on your link even says clans won. You really are special.

Also, I never said you wanted to nerf IS, buuut thanks for putting words in my mouth.

and then your answer to why clan mechs are better in tournaments was... Yeah, they are better at long range, which you constantly ignore in all of your posts.

So which is it boyo

You have said range doesn't matter, and then you said range does matter. You get confused easily. It's ok. I undestand

Edited by Mortalcoil, 12 May 2018 - 10:06 PM.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 10:03 PM, said:

bwahahaa. Clan won the Battle of Tharkad. I said IS hasn't won any faction play events, and you sent me a link to an even they lost. Man, just...wow.

https://www.reddit.c...ad_victor_clan/

The top comment on your link even says clans won. You really are special.

Also, I never said you wanted to nerf IS, buuut thanks for putting words in my mouth.

and then your answer to why clan mechs are better in tournaments was... Yeah, they are better at long range, which you constantly ignore in all of your posts.

So which is it boyo

You have said range doesn't matter, and then you said range does matter. You get confused easily. It's ok. I undestand

>Clans won in event where IS had a 66% higher win rate
???

If IS having 66% higher win rates than Clans on events Clan wins are this common then I can see why Clan won every event. Totally makes sense.

I also said that the range difference between IS and Clan laser vomit builds doesn't matter when it comes to trading since its within 100m of eachother anyway, which is trivial to cross over.

[Mortalcoil]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 10:53 PM, said:

>Clans won in event where IS had a 66% higher win rate
???

If IS having 66% higher win rates than Clans on events Clan wins are this common then I can see why Clan won every event. Totally makes sense.

I also said that the range difference between IS and Clan laser vomit builds doesn't matter when it comes to trading since its within 100m of eachother anyway, which is trivial to cross over.

Sorry, boyo, clan won Battle of Tharkad. Not my fault that it doesn't make sense, but they won. You can look it up yourself. Clan won Battle of Tharkad. You say you are the guy who isn't living in reality. I have to agree with you. Maybe, before linking posts to me, you should read them first, lol.

Edited by Mortalcoil, 12 May 2018 - 10:58 PM.

[Mcgral18]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 04:59 PM, said:

Yes, some people find being overpowered fun. I find clan laser vomit to be rather boring.

Yeah, that 5 SPL Fridge was kinda fun to play
A Supercooled Light

Then SPLs took a 33% output nerf, more than a touch too far

So, he went to ERMLs
And then those took a cooldown nerf

And then they wanted to cut THAT firepower by 33%



RIP Fridge


The 6 SPL Fridge may have been a powerhouse, but PGI never let that happen
The 6 ERML Fridge is mediocre, at best
They want to nerf that robot, significantly, again




"Balance"
That isn't to say a slight adjustment shouldn't occur...but see SPLs for what happens when you:
A: Use the worst weapon in the game as a balance baseline (Increase TTK guis!)
B: Blanket Nerf damage output by 33%

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 10:56 PM, said:

Sorry, boyo, clan won Battle of Tharkad. Not my fault that it doesn't make sense, but they won. You can look it up yourself. Clan won Battle of Tharkad. You say you are the guy who isn't living in reality. I have to agree with you. Maybe, before linking posts to me, you should read them first, lol.

So I just join the losing side to win 66% more often. So logical.

[Mortalcoil]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 12 May 2018 - 11:01 PM, said:

So I just join the losing side to win 66% more often. So logical.

I guess you'll have to bring that up with PGI. I'm sorry you don't like the outcome of that event, but the fact remains, IS has never won a single FP event.

[Dungeon 206]

Mortalcoil, on 12 May 2018 - 11:12 PM, said:

mate lord of blood has you on this one.
to say clan is op because they are the majority mechs in comp play is a moot point.
IS and Clan both have their strengths, with IS being OP in more play-styles than Clans.
Comp play sees alot of clan mechs because Comp play focuses around the play-style that Clans are stronger in.
it doesnt mean that clans are more OP than IS.
however as he said, when it comes to fast quick skirmishing brawls, IS is definitely OP. which is why the Wolfhound is a staple in all comp teams.

Edited by Dungeon 206, 12 May 2018 - 11:26 PM.

[Thorqemada]

You dont need to argue with the "other side" as they have longe made up all arguments fit their position and reinforce their views so every step away from the current status quo is actually unbalancing the game and shifting the power unfairly away from parity and that Clans are superior is simply the Lore so live with it or do you want changing the Lore?

And the Events are proof that Clans are Balanced bcs you would not need to pay bigger rewards for playing the better side and make the Mercenaries switch to Clan (which btw is Anti-Lore) but in the end the result is what matters and the Lore says Clans win in a fair Combat Situation all day over IS thus every Combat Situation where Clans dont win is not fair nor fun!!!!!

Edited by Thorqemada, 12 May 2018 - 11:29 PM.