69 replies to this topic

[Christof Romulus]

From:
https://mwomercs.com...41720-19jun2018

Single Heat Sinks

• Cooling increased to 0.13 (from 0.12)
  
• Added heat threshold increased to 1.3 (from 1.2)
  
• Heat Sink Design notes: We are improving the baseline heat sink values to provide more direct benefit to stock 'Mechs for both newer players and participants in the 2018 MWOWC.

What does that mean?




HERE'S A GRAPH!


From personal experience it is damn hard getting more than 11 (external) double heatsinks onto an Inner Sphere mech while keeping some reasonable level of firepower on it. Odds are that if you have more than 11 Double Heatsinks you would be better served by more weapons.

So with that said, the break point is 18 single heatsinks now - if you can fit 18 or more single heatsinks on your mech, you will out perform the "maximum (11)" number of Double heatsinks.

While in a great many circumstances Double heatsinks are superior, this change will make the edge-cases where Single heatsinks could have been used that much more viable.

Please note, this is for Inner Sphere only - Clan DHS are smaller and thus have a significantly greater maximum number.

[Edit]:
I didn't think it would come up, as per my last sentence about Clan DHS, but I was proven wrong later in the thread by Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood; but there are some cases where Clan mechs can potentially use the new single heatsinks.

[Edit2]:
Clam Graph!

Edited by Christof Romulus, 14 June 2018 - 12:49 PM.

[Nightbird]

Never mind, didn't read graph

Edited by Nightbird, 14 June 2018 - 09:33 AM.

[Rhialto]

Name a build that would take advantage of single heatsink over double now...

[Nightbird]

Nightbird, on 14 June 2018 - 08:42 AM, said:

DHS affects engine dissipation as well. 10 internal engine DHS (0 external), is 2.0 dissipation. You need 10 internal and 5.4 external SHS to break even. Adding in 11 external DHS and the break even point is (if your math is right) 23-24 external SHS.

Nevermind if you already incorporated the engine values, what is the current DHS external dissapation today? Lost track.

[storm0545]

Rhialto, on 14 June 2018 - 08:43 AM, said:

Name a build that would take advantage of single heatsink over double now...

while it's not the greatest build but Fantastic Tuesday's 2LL 5ML 40 shs build would benefit from the changes

[JediPanther]

Say that's as good as a dime pay raise after two years at a job! And why I quit that job the next day. Imagine if we could all get .10 increase of a gallon of free gas at the pump. No one would even notice or care.

[Christof Romulus]

Nightbird, on 14 June 2018 - 08:50 AM, said:

Nevermind if you already incorporated the engine values, what is the current DHS external dissapation today? Lost track.

It's accounted for (hence why DHS starts at 2.0)

Current Inner Sphere DHS values are:
10 "true dubs" or 2.0 dissipation
.15 dissipation per external heatsink

Future Inner Sphere SHS values are:
All heatsinks .13 dissipation per heatsinks (internal and external)

[MrXanthios]

they should let us mix shs and dhs, with the option on bottom left of mechlab changing only the heat sinks from single to double in the engine

[VonBruinwald]

Rhialto, on 14 June 2018 - 08:43 AM, said:

Name a build that would take advantage of single heatsink over double now...

My Crab, drop the laser and a ton of ammo for twins AC10's if you want the Solaris build.

And of course, the obligatory:

[Elizander]

Laservomit BLR-3M can get 21 SHS with 3LL + 5 ERML: BLR-3M

Laservomit BNC-3S can get 25 SHS with 3LL + 4 ERML: BNC-3S

Laservomit Black Knight can get 18 SHS with 3 LL + 6 ERML and LFE280: BL-6B-KNT

The TDR that has LL quirks with 3 LL can get 18 SHS too if it has no other weapons: TDR-5S

6 ER ML HBK-4P can get 18 SHS too: HBK-4P

Triple ER PPC Awesome can get 21 SHS: AWS-8Q

AC/20 + 4 SRM6 Atlas-S on LFE300 can get 18 SHS: AS7-S

5 LL BLR-2C can get 21 SHS. I assume the Stalker can do the same. LFE300: BLR-2C

Edited by Elizander, 14 June 2018 - 10:12 AM.

[FupDup]

Elizander, on 14 June 2018 - 09:47 AM, said:

Laservomit BLR-3M can get 21 SHS with 3LL + 5 ERML: BLR-3M

Laservomit BNC-3S can get 25 SHS with 3LL + 4 ERML: BNC-3S

Laservomit Black Knight can get 18 SHS with 3 LL + 6 ERML and LFE280: BL-6B-KNT

That Black Knight can be directly improved with DHS. You even get a bigger engine and a TC2 out of the exchange: BL-6B-KNT Improved

So can the Thunderbolt, but that's a medium mech build instead of a proper heavy: TDR-5S Improved

Edited by FupDup, 14 June 2018 - 10:03 AM.

[Spheroid]

@Rhialto: An energy boat Awesome-8Q mounting something like 2x LPLAS + 4x mlas basically has three builds options

300 STD, 22 DHS
300 STD, endo, 27-28 SHS
300 LFE, endo, 32 SHS

I still consider the DHS build better because it gives you an untouchable emergency core heat dissipation greater than any of the SHS builds if you suffer a torso loss.

The SHS builds potentially offer some advantage in terms of crit padding and leg heat dissipation while in water. To me this seem too situational however. The DHS build also has a capability for a small TC or BAP if you decline to go full armor.

Edited by Spheroid, 14 June 2018 - 10:08 AM.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

hehehehe, time to use my Supernova some.

Have been running 2 HLL+6ERML and a boatload of single heatsinks in it all this time because it already offered better heat cap and equal/better cooling than doubles could in that chassis.

SNV-1

That feel when it still brings the heat up to 80% stock, though with minus 10% heat gen and that huge boost that heat containment gives its not too bad and with how long the cooldowns are on the lasers it can get 2 or 3 shots off in a row. Now its 8% better.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 12:26 PM.

[Eisenhorne]

I'm gonna pick up an ANH-1E when it goes on sale because of this buff... can get a 52 pt alpha with 3 LL + 5 ERML, with 43 single heatsinks.... should be able to fire forever.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

VonBruinwald, on 14 June 2018 - 09:32 AM, said:

My Crab, drop the laser and a ton of ammo for twins AC10's if you want the Solaris build.

Wait, do you actually seriously use that thing?

[VonBruinwald]

Throe, on 14 June 2018 - 10:03 AM, said:

Sorry, nope. That is not a build that benefits from SHS. There are builds that do, but that isn't one of them.

Care to rebuild it with dubs for me... and the AC10 variant while you're at it.

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 14 June 2018 - 10:18 AM, said:

Wait, do you actually seriously use that thing?

Of course, you seem surprised.

Edited by VonBruinwald, 14 June 2018 - 10:35 AM.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 12:23 PM.

[FupDup]

The issue is that you're trying to build a 50-ton medium with the mobility of an average heavy mech and lots of unused base heat (those 10 free sinks going to waste). It's a flawed concept regardless of which heatsink type you use.

EDIT: And the horribly stripped armor as pointed out by Throe (I missed that).

Edited by FupDup, 14 June 2018 - 10:38 AM.

[VonBruinwald]

Throe, on 14 June 2018 - 10:32 AM, said:

Also, you'd have to be suicidal take those armor values into Solaris. I realize you've falsified the specific values, but you're still missing too much armor for this build to be viable in Solaris.

FupDup, on 14 June 2018 - 10:34 AM, said:

The issue is that you're trying to build a 50-ton medium with the mobility of an average heavy mech and lots of unused base heat (those 10 free sinks going to waste). It's a flawed concept regardless of which heatsink type you use.

Then all I'm going to say is I must be a damn good pilot to maintain a positive k:d in that thing.

Edited by VonBruinwald, 14 June 2018 - 10:43 AM.