1169 replies to this topic

[Sneaky Ohgoorchik]

Xannatharr, on 24 August 2018 - 10:19 AM, said:

I can't tell you how many times (especially during events) that I have taken a moment at the start of the match to explain the Gate, Generator and Omega Cannon mechanics on voip. I've heard others do it too and while it doesn't always help, it does seem to be useful most of the time. (Again, during events like this).

Voip is off by default. No new player can hear you. And people tend to speak only one language by default too.

Also, this game is too complicated to bother giving instructions to noobs. Today ive seen an Atlas moving far left line in QP at Mining Collective. And some guy supported the move in a heavy. When they became dead, the heavy pilot typed: "I supported assault". You need experience to understand the game.

And about base camping: if they can roll all the way to your base - it looks like you screwed anyway. Why even bother fighting this match?

Edited by Sneaky Ohgoorchik, 25 August 2018 - 10:49 AM.

[Horseman]

Kageru Ikazuchi, on 25 August 2018 - 06:27 AM, said:

It will take some pretty significant objective rewards to encourage us to not just finish the match in the most expeditious means available. The CB-per-hour for quick victories will always be better than drawing matches out longer.

Some people look at it in CB-per-match rather than CB-per-hour. Rewarding objective wins more would reward both crowds, really - the problem is dialing it in so that it's better to finish the match by objective vs DZ farming, but not so much that gen rushing becomes the norm.
So eg if on Siege Attack you destroy the gens + omega while the enemy still has mechs left, you'd get rewards at least equal to what you'd have earned by spending 4-5 minutes longer on DZ farming.

[Tier5ForLife]

bronco67coo, on 25 August 2018 - 09:33 AM, said:

I've been the pickup player in a couple of matches. 2 lances were on a team. They kept all the direction on their private discord, didn't share it and left the other lance to die because we didn't know the plan. Guess what? They lost. I specifically asked for direction and they said "we will listen if you say something". That's just stupid. I've gotten great scores on teams that cooperated. Last night we had a team full of potatoes. We got a shot caller that played enough to provide some guidance and we kicked butt, and had fun.

Wait, you are saying that the way to play a team game is to play as a team?

That's crazy talk.

[Horseman]

He's saying that some groups default so hard to out-of-game comms that they do not communicate with anyone who is matched into their team.
So you have an eight-man that doesn't keep the other four players appraised of their plan even when those four are able and willing to follow orders. Or you have three four-mans who go off with completely different - and possibly conflicting - strategies. That's a folly of game-losing proportions

[Roland09]

bronco67coo, on 25 August 2018 - 09:24 AM, said:

Its constructive comments like this one that make this community so great.

Correction: It's players who openly admit to playing 12 vs. 1 in a team-oriented mode, wonder why they are loosing and then broadly claim 'FP sucks' which makes these threads such a joy to behold.

[William Slayer]

Copied from the Skye Rangers website discussion:

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"This could be interesting. Gives some nice options for FW scenarios. It also could be interesting to create some pre3049 scenarios. Like the fourth succession war for example. Like the one they are hosting now."


"LOL, well I have to say I'm excited to hear about more Story driven content. More rewards for us Loyalists sure sounds good too..."


"There are a MILLION different acts of heroism, treachery , villainy, and compassion EVERYDAY in a conflict as big as the one happening in the realm of the Inner Sphere. The story's are ENDLESS!

All you need is some imaginative writers, (and it sounded from the Podcast like Paul fits the bill) to think up a cool story for the month to base the faction warfare around. It could be as simple as the battle for ONE continent on a planet, or as vast as securing an entire sector of space. FW is fun, but it's more fun when you give us a REASON to fight..."

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The Rangers who play FW are excited about this attempt to add to the fun and drive to play this version of the game. Thanks for the effort Paul, and the rest of PGI!

[Nightbird]

Horseman, on 25 August 2018 - 10:32 PM, said:

He's saying that some groups default so hard to out-of-game comms that they do not communicate with anyone who is matched into their team.
So you have an eight-man that doesn't keep the other four players appraised of their plan even when those four are able and willing to follow orders. Or you have three four-mans who go off with completely different - and possibly conflicting - strategies. That's a folly of game-losing proportions

A matter of effort versus reward in my experience. The number of people that listen to strategy is 1 in 4, put it another way 3 in 4 will ignore your efforts. At some point you just run out of energy to try. They also have the option of looking at the initial mech selection and figure out what to bring and looking at the mini map and following the main group.

For solo-ers, it's always a good idea to bring heavies and medium as they are neither too fast or too slow to keep up, with good firepower and range. Assaults and lights can easily end up useless.

Edited by Nightbird, 27 August 2018 - 12:15 PM.

[Horseman]

Nightbird, on 27 August 2018 - 12:14 PM, said:

A matter of effort versus reward in my experience. The number of people that listen to strategy is 1 in 4, put it another way 3 in 4 will ignore your efforts. At some point you just run out of energy to try

Which is not a good reason to do it to someone who outright states he's willing to follow your orders - which is what bronco describes happened there.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Much brings LRM Mechs or lights ...seeing locusts or Ravens with a LPPc...order its come by Attack side the order in hellbore "ignored all and something and only push to the Objectives " was ended in a Disaster ...first wave 4:12 against the blues and most thinking FP ist playing like QP ..

Edited by Old MW4 Ranger, 28 August 2018 - 07:11 AM.

[Tier5ForLife]

Horseman, on 25 August 2018 - 10:32 PM, said:

He's saying that some groups default so hard to out-of-game comms that they do not communicate with anyone who is matched into their team.
So you have an eight-man that doesn't keep the other four players appraised of their plan even when those four are able and willing to follow orders. Or you have three four-mans who go off with completely different - and possibly conflicting - strategies. That's a folly of game-losing proportions

Trust me, I know what he is saying. I've mentioned this before but several times I've been told/ordered not to speak using in-game chat to the non-unit members of our "team".


But hey, TEAMWORK IS OP!

[Tier5ForLife]

PeppaPig, on 25 August 2018 - 01:25 AM, said:

Every now and then, an excellent idea pops up! Well written.

How about locking access to FW UNTIL you have walked all the maps at least once, twice or three times to familiarise the new FP player before being eligible for the FW queue (grey out the FW select button until completed - surely a simple single flag logic check)?

You gave me excuse to pull this post over here. If anyone from PGI is reading these posts, this is directed at you.

I like to ask you a few questions. The first one is something that all players seem to hate but in this, I do not care what anything thinks, I want to know if it is possible. Yes, i understand the idea sucks, i just want to know if it is possible.

First thing is adding NPCs to the game. For one thing, this would add Tanks, Hovercrafts, infantry etc to the game. The NPC units would not have any mechs.

Control over them would be none or a little bit depending on the NPC Unit. I can see some of them having personally of their own. Some are cowards, some are hardcore. Some would be aggressive and would be outside the gates and attacking the team that is attacking. Some will run and even run off the map. Some would be just locals helping out and others would be strong units.

There could be an option to use them or not. But Ghost Drops could be a thing of the past. Because there will be a large NPC unit there.

"Lesser teams" would have NPC support. They can be anything from a local NPC unit to a Merc unit to a Loyalist unit that was brought in to help. And this help could come during the match. After two drops the team that is down 24-3 would see landing ships coming in and quickly unload an NPC unit to help.

This would make it harder for the better teams to win but then they would get more experience, C-Bills and IMO, more fun because it adds so much more to the game. We talk a lot about Lore but where are these vehicles? Where are the tanks and other forces?

I'd also like more things to blow up. For several years in Total War, if a building is in your way, you bring artillery up and flatten it.

Clearly, the biggest problem will simply be money as in most things. I'd offer the players to pay for another "help the game" thing like you already do and more items or whatever that will allow them to earn more XP and C-Bills. But they would know that this money is going towards improving Faction Warfare.

Much like I think you should do the same thing about running some Superbowl ads (I will keep bugging PGI about this until after the Superbowl)

The way I understand it, MechWarrior Online is owned by Microsoft and PGI is leasing it. So let say I won Powerball 3 times and I decided to buy the game and pour money into it. Could you do it?

The 2nd thing is an FW academy. New players would have to walk the maps (with arrows pointing the way) and learn to destroy turrets, lower gates, find the Gens and Omega and learn where to fire at them to destroy them. Some of the better FW Units could also help build this and there would be arrows to show the best way to go. Prompts would come up not to shoot here, but to RUN and do not block the rest of your team.

As the player improves and proves he knows certain things, NPC Mechs start dropping with him. And after a while, there will be an NPC unit on the other side.

The first time through this the players would receive C-Bills etc. But after they have passed all the "training", they could still do it but with no C-Bill bonuses.

The last thing would be text messages for FW games. The 15-20 minute wait itself is not what bothers me. It is the fact that I have to sit here in this chair watching the screen and waiting. Humans are not made to sit in chairs, it is unnatural and one of the things that are killing Americans. And/or Killing our healthcare budget because so much goes to people who ate too much or sat too much. If you look at nations where back pain is low, they squat instead of sitting in chairs.

So I like to get up, stretch and take a short walk, change some sprinklers, water some plants, take some cuttings, mist and check on other cuttings, pick up fallen limbs to make Biochar, to mow part of my yard, rake leaves, chip leaves, turn compost piles etc. There is ALWAYS something to do and almost all of them are better than sitting in a chair and watching the Monitor.

But if PGI could send a text message to those that listed their contact information saying "2 minutes" or even 90 seconds would IMO, be a plus. I've played a lot with teammates who simply get bored waiting and go off to play Quickplay or another game entirely. So now there is me and one other guy instead of 12 of us with others waiting for a spot.

Anyway, I have a Madden franchise game with a guy from Israel so I'm out for a hour or so.

[Davegt27]

is NPC = non player controlled?

if so I get your point

[Marius Evander]

Npc a.i. has been said aint happening repeatedly through these 2 threads buddha.

[Horseman]

Davegt27, on 28 August 2018 - 01:16 PM, said:

is NPC = non player controlled?

if so I get your point

Close. It stands for Non-Player Character.

Cadoazreal, on 28 August 2018 - 01:49 PM, said:

Npc a.i. has been said aint happening repeatedly through these 2 threads buddha.

Unfortunately so. This said, a rudimentary FP tutorial could help a bit - even if it's with basics of gate / generator / omega .

Edited by Horseman, 28 August 2018 - 01:59 PM.

[Xaat Xuun]

a Faction Play Tutorial is a start.
it can show objectives, but it's not going to show a proper drop deck, there would need to be a lot of different examples of drop decks to show what needs to be taken for maps/modes
the trial FP only mech or even full drop deck could help, but how many mechs will be available to choose from ?

there really is not a 'do all', just one drop deck, there are some pilots that can, but were not talking about those players, we're taking new pilots, and showing the basics.
Those that are new to entering Faction Play/War, that want to learn will ask, there are even some willing to learn just shy to asking, and there are already a ton of those 'this is my game I'll do what I want' (that just don't belong in a team competitive server)

part of the tutorial needs to emphasize the use of the "R" key, is more then just getting a target lock for LRM use, it's information which weapons they are using, and if you're knowledge enough, know which engine they are using, how much of a threat they are, stuff like that'
the tutorial would require answering questions of such, to make sure they have understood the need to do what they did, and not just a matter of button pushing to get past the tutorial, Wrong answer, then repeat tutorial portion till you understand

I see a lot of times , players follow some dogmatic path, one that worked well before, but yet to learn it doesn't work every time, no tutorial can fix that

only problem I see the use of FP only trial mechs, some builds require skills from the skill tree, this would limit how/which mechs of choice for a FP only trial mech
there is a reason many say, do not bring unskilled mechs into Faction Play, to level up

[Zangief79]

limit group sizes to 8, so the remaining 4 spots have to be filled by pugs, that hopefully will learn from the experienced group players. Inexperienced players dropping Solo is why they get their butts kicked so much. Put em with a group they can learn from.

[Tier5ForLife]

So adding A.I. is the stumbling block for NPC's.

I'm not asking for them to make smart moves. Some/most can be set in defensive positions until they are destroyed. A few might have a secondary position to move back to.

On offense, they just have to move to the gates and shoot stuff. Having a number of dumb Mechs (I'm thinking now that asking for tanks etc is too much to ask for) go in with the lesser team will help some.

I played a real simple Mechwarrior game some years ago. Those mechs did not have a lot of A.I. You can't do that? Really?

Seriously, give them all of that super A.I. that you give to turrets. That is about all is needed.

Zangief79, on 28 August 2018 - 03:01 PM, said:

limit group sizes to 8, so the remaining 4 spots have to be filled by pugs, that hopefully will learn from the experienced group players. Inexperienced players dropping Solo is why they get their butts kicked so much. Put em with a group they can learn from.

Taking in all of the comments, that just means those 4 pugs will be ignored and used as meat shields.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Paul Innouye say clear ....No AI for MWO ...PGI has no AI and not further plans to create a AI for MWO

Quote

Clarification 1:

AI and PvE will not be coming to MWO. Some people have stated that without it FP is pointless. So why should we bother with anything if that is the stance? And because that's your stance, you think that you speak for everyone trying to see what we can do to enhance the experience?

As you can see by the pages of responses coming into these feedback thread, there is a functioning playerbase wanting to see this new stuff added. There's even a much larger active player base who are remaining silent as per any public forum discussion. If PvE in BT and MW5 are what you're looking for, you have some really cool stuff coming your way. But please stop trying to shoot everyone else down who want to play a PvP experience in MWO's Faction Play game space.

I'm not trying to poo-poo on you specific folks here, I'm just trying to get FP in a position where a lot more people are happy with the feature. It won't be perfect or reach that MMO level of depth, but it will be a lot better than it is right now.

Edited by Old MW4 Ranger, 29 August 2018 - 08:10 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Yep, time to give up requesting anything in the ballpark of the topic.

[Monkey Lover]

LikeUntoBuddha, on 29 August 2018 - 05:09 PM, said:

So adding A.I. is the stumbling block for NPC's.

I'm not asking for them to make smart moves. Some/most can be set in defensive positions until they are destroyed. A few might have a secondary position to move back to.

On offense, they just have to move to the gates and shoot stuff. Having a number of dumb Mechs (I'm thinking now that asking for tanks etc is too much to ask for) go in with the lesser team will help some.

I played a real simple Mechwarrior game some years ago. Those mechs did not have a lot of A.I. You can't do that? Really?

Seriously, give them all of that super A.I. that you give to turrets. That is about all is needed.



Taking in all of the comments, that just means those 4 pugs will be ignored and used as meat shields.

Waiting lobby where we could have played around with our team doing training,1v1,6v6 etc
Basic AI targets when we ghost dropped.

I feel I would still have my first unit if these two things were added to cw years ago.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 30 August 2018 - 01:31 AM.