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TheArisen, on 26 January 2019 - 01:38 PM, said:
Well perhaps you missed the part where profile and mounts came into the discussion as it was an important factor and there was more discussion on which mechs in general to go with in general as we knew that we couldn't just list every single mech ever. I wanted the DFire even before you suggested it so it's not like it was unknown before you mentioned it. I've also had discussions with FLG & others so that PM exchange isn't the only one of it's kind, nor is it the original reason to push for the DFire.
I didn't miss it, that was generic discussion not specific to the DFire. In 2019, the DFire has little going for it over existing 'Mechs and to try to bill it as if it did is being dishonest. Half of the discussion in that PM exchange is now obsolete, since we aren't stuck with XLs, Gauss+PPC is irrelevant, the skill tree is a thing, hardpoint-efficient weapons for IS now exist, lighter 'Mechs often have as much armor as heavier 'Mechs, and the Clans have been nerfed three times over.
As for whether or not this exchange is the only reason for pushing the DFire, who cares? It is the reason you made the first public posting for it, despite annoyingly diluting that thread supposedly focused on being top-meta IS with less-than-meta IS alternatives that we said should not be there.
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Yes at the time the Nightstar was the focus as we didn't anticipate it getting so butchered but the primary focus in general was on it so other mechs just didn't get the same attention.
We hardly focused on the Nightstar, only briefly comparing it to the Saggy and KGC. There was more talk about big dakka assaults like Thunderhawks and Gunslingers, Lights, and useless YouTubers.
Also said in that exchange that there were alternatives to new 'Mechs (in that specific instance, the Dragoon) in variants for existing chassis we don't have. That fact hasn't changed, is relevant now more than ever, and is coming back to haunt this thread.
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Also there are some weapons above the cockpit but the majority of them are almost exactly in line with the cockpit, including the arms. It most certainly has the ability to shoot whatever it can see. The Warhammer on the other hand exclusively has weapons mounted below the cockpit and again the Warhammer 6R doesn't have ECM which affects the ability of an enemy to see you and react before you drop into cover after shooting.
If you can see it in a WHM, you can hit it with the torso mounts, they are that high. The total amount of 'Mech mass exposed is what matters and, looking at all renditions of the DFire, it's not going to expose any less of itself than the WHM.
The fact that you need to leave your arms armored for the firepower is doing more harm to this 'Mech than the Warhammer having a cockpit a little bit over its otherwise superior torso weapon placement.
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I was able to fit X5 er meds and dual gauss with an XL300 on a Warhammer actually, albeit without enough ammo but since the DFire has the extra tonnage it can fit the extra ammo to make the extra laser work. It might be a snug fit but it would fit just fine.
That's an XL, though. There is a reason almost nobody uses an XL in a GaussHammer and those that do are either top 1% clubbing seals or easily killed. I am not going to advocate a 'Mech with long STs running a slow XL just to get a barely-better alpha than an LFE280 Warhammer, to say nothing of the fact that pure lasers are more effective than Gauss+Lasers for both Clans and IS and, for IS, can easily exceed the alpha you get with Gauss+Vomit on the Heavy class in alpha size.
Pure lasers are so much more effective that the mount height doesn't even matter when comparing against Gauss+lasers. IS lasers burn so fast that the exposure time needed to acquire a target and spool a Gauss for it is a hindrance and missing a pre-spool means your lasers-only shot loses the trade.
