34 replies to this topic

[Paul Inouye]

Internal meeting at 4PM to see exactly where we are.

[HammerMaster]

Edited by HammerMaster, 04 April 2019 - 02:51 PM.

[Paul Inouye]

Forget 4PM. (We met at 3:40)

I will update in a new post tomorrow at noon as to when we plan on putting PTS up. As of RIGHT NOW... it looks like it's a go for Friday (tomorrow).

What to expect on the PTS (I'll detail a patch notes type release when we're sure it's a go):

A story is presented, in this particular case it will be between Steiner and Marik. No further spoilers. During this first 'phase' of the story arc, it will be 8 hours of Scouting for intel. At the end of the 8hr window, the story progresses depending on which faction has won the most games. i.e. If Steiner wins, it follows a Steiner won path on the story arc. If Marik wins, it follows a Marik won path on the story arc.

The second phase lasts for 8 hours. At the end of the 8 hours, the story arc branches again depending on who won the most games. This sets up the 3rd and final 8 hour phase.

At the end of the 3rd story phase, the overarching conflict will reset so people from different regions can try it out from the beginning. This will repeat on Saturday, Sunday and Monday. On Monday we will evaluate what's been happening behind the Match Maker curtain and how the story system is progressing. If any changes need to be made, we'll make them and restart the cycle again.

TL;DR: There will be 3 cycles of a 24hr story arch happening over the weekend on PTS. There's loot to be won at the end of the PTS period.

FYI: Things like the length of a story phase will be completely scripted based on future story arcs on the live servers. You could see a conflict last for 3 days like above, or it could last for 3 months.. and the length of each phase in each conflict can be from 1 minute to 90 days or more. It will be all about the story telling and how long it should play out.

[HammerMaster]

Paul Inouye, on 04 April 2019 - 03:03 PM, said:

Forget 4PM. (We met at 3:40)

I will update in a new post tomorrow at noon as to when we plan on putting PTS up. As of RIGHT NOW... it looks like it's a go for Friday (tomorrow).

What to expect on the PTS (I'll detail a patch notes type release when we're sure it's a go):

A story is presented, in this particular case it will be between Steiner and Marik. No further spoilers. During this first 'phase' of the story arc, it will be 8 hours of Scouting for intel. At the end of the 8hr window, the story progresses depending on which faction has won the most games. i.e. If Steiner wins, it follows a Steiner won path on the story arc. If Marik wins, it follows a Marik won path on the story arc.

The second phase lasts for 8 hours. At the end of the 8 hours, the story arc branches again depending on who won the most games. This sets up the 3rd and final 8 hour phase.

At the end of the 3rd story phase, the overarching conflict will reset so people from different regions can try it out from the beginning. This will repeat on Saturday, Sunday and Monday. On Monday we will evaluate what's been happening behind the Match Maker curtain and how the story system is progressing. If any changes need to be made, we'll make them and restart the cycle again.

TL;DR: There will be 3 cycles of a 24hr story arch happening over the weekend on PTS. There's loot to be won at the end of the PTS period.

FYI: Things like the length of a story phase will be completely scripted based on future story arcs on the live servers. You could see a conflict last for 3 days like above, or it could last for 3 months.. and the length of each phase in each conflict can be from 1 minute to 90 days or more. It will be all about the story telling and how long it should play out.

Written out like this the story sounds great. Times. Well. I work so can I devote that much time? Maybe.
My question is what is gonna be done to bring solos to FP rather than Full 12 man drops?
And I'm not talking loot. I'm talking not getting a mudhole stomped in them by our farmers. (Persistent units)

Edited by HammerMaster, 04 April 2019 - 03:42 PM.

[slide]

That is very promising Paul, I was expecting match maker only at this point.

It will be interesting to see what data comes out of the PTS. (will you tell us?)

I was just thinking when I read you earlier post that it might pay to restrict the conflict to just IS v IS to help encourage participation and limit buckets. You've done just that.

Edit. Oh look I'm Steiner already, How convenient.

Edited by slide, 04 April 2019 - 04:20 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Good stuff Paul.

But again - PTS on the weekend I cant play NA timezone. I'm stuck working, even miss my comp matches.

I'll try get on it Oceanic Sat night and get a bunch of viewers in on it as I'll try and stream it. But yeah it'll be rough during Oceanic for me this weekend to test

Edited by justcallme A S H, 04 April 2019 - 07:53 PM.

[Rustyhammer]

Paul Inouye, on 04 April 2019 - 03:03 PM, said:

...
During this first 'phase' of the story arc, it will be 8 hours of Scouting for intel. At the end of the 8hr window, the story progresses depending on which faction has won the most games.
...

Great to hear there is going to be a story behind the conflict. But I guess we need to see on PTS how well it cater for a various type of players.
My oncern is I have no interest in playing scouting for 8 hrs. If the new system enforce a particular gamemode (4v4 or 12v12) I see it as a step backward as there is a bunch of people who prefer to only play 12v12 or 4v4.
Enforcing a particular gamemode for 8 hours is a way to ensure these people won't be playing during that time. I know I'm not interested in scouting so there is 100% chance I skip it on PTS.

[Yondu Udonta]

uh scouting? 8h of scouting is way too much man

[SilentScreamer]

Paul Inouye, on 04 April 2019 - 03:03 PM, said:

What to expect on the PTS (I'll detail a patch notes type release when we're sure it's a go):

A story is presented, in this particular case it will be between Steiner and Marik. No further spoilers. During this first 'phase' of the story arc, it will be 8 hours of Scouting for intel. At the end of the 8hr window, the story progresses depending on which faction has won the most games. i.e. If Steiner wins, it follows a Steiner won path on the story arc. If Marik wins, it follows a Marik won path on the story arc.

The second phase lasts for 8 hours. At the end of the 8 hours, the story arc branches again depending on who won the most games. This sets up the 3rd and final 8 hour phase.

At the end of the 3rd story phase, the overarching conflict will reset so people from different regions can try it out from the beginning. This will repeat on Saturday, Sunday and Monday. On Monday we will evaluate what's been happening behind the Match Maker curtain and how the story system is progressing. If any changes need to be made, we'll make them and restart the cycle again.

FYI: Things like the length of a story phase will be completely scripted based on future story arcs on the live servers. You could see a conflict last for 3 days like above, or it could last for 3 months.. and the length of each phase in each conflict can be from 1 minute to 90 days or more. It will be all about the story telling and how long it should play out.

Sounds like an excellent event system. I'm a bit worried that Faction Play isn't ready for this improvement. The cart put before the horse. Why create a new system to attract players to Faction Play if nothing has changed regarding what makes the players stop joining Faction play. When these events do come up, there is always a flood of posts of players complaining about two issues: Long queue time and stomps.

1) queue time too long - Caused by the players themselves as the population has a tendancy to jump on the currently "winning" side of Faction Play makes queues lopsided. Granted, the waiting period for dropping an allegiance no longer exists so units can change faction mid-event; but how many do?

2) match quality - the learning curve in MWO is harsh, even more so in Faction Play because meta builds differ from Quickplay and even map-to-map. I'll also say, superior team organization can swing a match just as much as having meta builds.

I know Paul has been active in the Developer Outreach section of the forums...(https://mwomercs.com...8/page__st__500)
...but has anything been proposed regarding the two issues above? Or is the theory still "if you like FP you will join a good unit AND once all players are in a good unit there will be no stomps and queue time will be instanteous"?

[Yondu Udonta]

SilentScreamer, on 04 April 2019 - 09:06 PM, said:

Sounds like an excellent event system. I'm a bit worried that Faction Play isn't ready for this improvement. The cart put before the horse. Why create a new system to attract players to Faction Play if nothing has changed regarding what makes the players stop joining Faction play. When these events do come up, there is always a flood of posts of players complaining about two issues: Long queue time and stomps.

1) queue time too long - Caused by the players themselves as the population has a tendancy to jump on the currently "winning" side of Faction Play makes queues lopsided. Granted, the waiting period for dropping an allegiance no longer exists so units can change faction mid-event; but how many do?

2) match quality - the learning curve in MWO is harsh, even more so in Faction Play because meta builds differ from Quickplay and even map-to-map. I'll also say, superior team organization can swing a match just as much as having meta builds.

I know Paul has been active in the Developer Outreach section of the forums...(https://mwomercs.com...8/page__st__500)
...but has anything been proposed regarding the two issues above? Or is the theory still "if you like FP you will join a good unit AND once all players are in a good unit there will be no stomps and queue time will be instanteous"?

1. I believe the reason for long queue is not because people want to be on the winning side, rather it is that one side has a particularly stronger group that has been soundly beating enemy teams, resulting in the other side being dejected and not dropping, which is what the MM is trying to do, by trying to match people equally.

2.

[MW Blizzard]

The player base population has to be pretty static or declining.
The added content of Solaris, Competitive play, Faction, Quickplay is a lot of buckets to drop into that limited # of players. Back in 2014-2015, we could have filled those game modes more easily.

Without creating a lot of work for the devs, could we adjust which buckets the players go into for daily gameplay, to help boost online players/ reduce wait times?

Maybe when the total number of players in Faction queue is less than 48, it could merge those in line into matchmaker created teams, aligned along faction lines (not just IS vs Clan) primarily, and then secondly by pilot rating.

During these low traffic times, you would have to go in as a solo only. and then maybe the ELO score could be used by matchmaker during this time to help balance out the teams somewhat.

If looking to play w/ buddies, you'd have a better chance of being on the same team by being in the same faction; but not guaranteed. In lore, pilots have been know to switch sides when conflicted about a fight...

But would be better than watching the wheel spin for 15 minutes as our available play time slips away, and we have to go back to real life.

Maybe we'll see an upswing when MW5 releases, if that attracts new mechwarriors and then MWO is the large team based multiplayer outlet after they've run through the singe/ co-op play a couple times.

[SilentScreamer]

Yondu Udonta, on 05 April 2019 - 06:28 AM, said:

1. I believe the reason for long queue is not because people want to be on the winning side, rather it is that one side has a particularly stronger group that has been soundly beating enemy teams, resulting in the other side being dejected and not dropping, which is what the MM is trying to do, by trying to match people equally.

2.

PGI may intend for the FactionPlay (Community Warfare) gamemode to be Team-based, but how the player population decides to use it as a single player/ PUG must be addressed eventually. I've read and participated in discussions over what should be done.
- The frequent suggestion of gating FP to unit-team-only would lead to matches only during the highest population times, units players need PUGs to fill spots during most hours of the day.
- I have suggested making all players/units entering Faction Play automatically added to the LFG system. This would give experienced players and Units a better chance to work with the PUGs who are new and don't know what's going on. If a PUG does well with a team/unit. he may stick around and do more drops with them and the unit gets a chance for a new recruit. If a PUG or team does badly, they can go their seperate ways and find a new team for the next drop with through the LFG function.

If there will be a functioning matchmaker in the future that is a good attempt to improve match quality. But what if the matchmaker puts together a team that does similar ELO rankings put completely different playstyles? Example: A 6-player team that loves to gen-rush combined with a 6-player team that loves to hang back and pick at opponents is going to get stomped by a 10 to 12-player team that coordinates a single playstyle well. A matchmaker does not offer the chance for a "meeting of the minds" like the LFG lobby does.

As far as posting a screenshot of the Faction Play Welcome, it really isn't helpful. The warning has been there for years and has not helped remedy the issues with player population or match quality. .

[Yondu Udonta]

Suggestion 1: I think that will be dumb, as the current population ensures that it is unsustainable.
Suggestion 2: I feel that as long as a pug does well enough in solo drops, he will be able to catch the notice of groups in general. Contrary to popular belief, there are actually alot of groups that are always looking for skilled players, me included. If you aren't getting invites then it is probably because you aren't impressing enough. Of course I'm not going to mention which groups have the lowest requirements but there are a few FP groups running that accept applicants as long as you show interest in learning.

This matchmaker is based on skill level and nothing else, anything else such as adding 'preferred playstyle' like roles in MOBAs is not a good idea due to the small population. And as far as I know, no one discusses in group chat whether to gen rush or hang back and fight.

It's a warning. One can proceed on if one thinks he can handle himself but don't go crying upon getting stomped by a premade.

[Paul Inouye]

New update here: https://mwomercs.com...ort-apr-5-2019/

[SilentScreamer]

SilentScreamer, on 05 April 2019 - 08:18 AM, said:

PGI may intend for the FactionPlay (Community Warfare) gamemode to be Team-based, but how the player population decides to use it as a single player/ PUG must be addressed eventually. I've read and participated in discussions over what should be done.

- The frequent suggestion of gating FP to unit-team-only would lead to matches only during the highest population times, units players need PUGs to fill spots during most hours of the day.

- I have suggested making all players/units entering Faction Play automatically added to the LFG system. This would give experienced players and Units a better chance to work with the PUGs who are new and don't know what's going on. If a PUG does well with a team/unit. he may stick around and do more drops with them and the unit gets a chance for a new recruit. If a PUG or team does badly, they can go their seperate ways and find a new team for the next drop with through the LFG function.

As far as posting a screenshot of the Faction Play Welcome, it really isn't helpful. The warning has been there for years and has not helped remedy the issues with player population or match quality. .

Yondu Udonta, on 05 April 2019 - 09:29 AM, said:

Suggestion 1: I think that will be dumb, as the current population ensures that it is unsustainable.
Suggestion 2: I feel that as long as a pug does well enough in solo drops, he will be able to catch the notice of groups in general. Contrary to popular belief, there are actually alot of groups that are always looking for skilled players, me included. If you aren't getting invites then it is probably because you aren't impressing enough. Of course I'm not going to mention which groups have the lowest requirements but there are a few FP groups running that accept applicants as long as you show interest in learning.

This matchmaker is based on skill level and nothing else, anything else such as adding 'preferred playstyle' like roles in MOBAs is not a good idea due to the small population. And as far as I know, no one discusses in group chat whether to gen rush or hang back and fight.

It's a warning. One can proceed on if one thinks he can handle himself but don't go crying upon getting stomped by a premade.

I am interested solutions. The first strategy I listed I discredited in my own post; why bother calling it "dumb" if I already discounted its worth?

As far as invites to join a unit, that's not what the second bullet was about. Also, I don't give a hoot about units. I'm looking for people to play with for a match or two in a hour, not a unit to join for life. I did the whole Join-a-Unit-thing in Community Warfare Phase 1 and Phase 2. Since then my unit moved on to World of Warships. If I want to play with a unit, I play Warships with them. I still play MWO for fun and when I do dust off a drop deck I usually perform between 8th to 4th on my team. If I break top 3 either my team did horrible or I had unusual luck. I take my wins with my losses, that's the PUG life, I'm not one of the pilots that rage quits just because we're 0-12 after the first wave. If you think I'm one of the players who posts crying about it, or blaming players for a loss after a bad match you've got the wrong pilot.

Additionally, a warning screen is not a solution, it is a speed bump which players blow straight over into the Faction Play match queue.

Edited by SilentScreamer, 05 April 2019 - 04:22 PM.