92 replies to this topic

[justcallme A S H]

McGoat, on 13 May 2019 - 09:37 AM, said:

This is the majority of the Div A players currently, as you can see even among them match score varies a bit.

And that shows the difference between SoloQ and GroupQ quite a bit.

You can tell just by looking who the GroupQ centric and SoloQ centric players are. Quite noticeable actually as there is a WLR/KDR and Survival difference.

W / K / S
SoloQ Centric - ~2.5 / ~3 / ~55%
GroupQ Centric - ~3.5+ / 4+ / 65%+

[VonBruinwald]

Vxheous, on 13 May 2019 - 02:22 PM, said:

Since we're talking about 700 matchscore, I hit that yesterday doing the medium event playing a 2015 meta stormcrow (2ERLL + 4ERML)

Nice.

But.

786 should be your peak...

[RJF Volkodav]

justcallme A S H, on 13 May 2019 - 02:24 PM, said:

And that shows the difference between SoloQ and GroupQ quite a bit.

You can tell just by looking who the GroupQ centric and SoloQ centric players are. Quite noticeable actually as there is a WLR/KDR and Survival difference.

W / K / S
SoloQ Centric - ~2.5 / ~3 / ~55%
GroupQ Centric - ~3.5+ / 4+ / 65%+

I would disagree a bit. There are players (i consider a true top) who play different non-meta **** solo playing on streams and getting KDR>5 along with impressive AMS. I think most of top players shall know who do i'm talking about ). Like ok, look at the Proton stats, he play Solo most of the time streaming and i believe (not sure) not playing much in GQ. Like i feel myself potatoe compared to Proton, Bowser, Chimera, Lizzee... But that is also a goal to look forward too so its great ).

VonBruinwald, on 13 May 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:

786 should be your peak...

Some ppl talking here hit 1000+ MS multiple times so i believe its not )

Edited by RJF Volkodav, 13 May 2019 - 02:47 PM.

[Bowelhacker]

It's interesting looking at the first page of rankings on Jarl's list and seeing only a few names I've ever come across in QP.

[justcallme A S H]

Vxheous, on 13 May 2019 - 02:22 PM, said:

Since we're talking about 700 matchscore, I hit that yesterday doing the medium event playing a 2015 meta stormcrow (2ERLL + 4ERML)

That moment when you spend more time shooting than you do rotating and as if by some sorta magic, you get higher damage/match score.

What is this sorcery?

[Tarl Cabot]

Mumuharra, on 13 May 2019 - 01:16 PM, said:

Nice.
Is this a joke or a real hint („down for maintanance“)?

Am able to view Jarl's list it at the time of my post, and the link is your overall average. Jarls pulls the information that the MWO website and has all the seasons (months) except for the current season/month.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

VonBruinwald, on 13 May 2019 - 02:04 PM, said:

But from the average we can make an educated guess at what people are scoring.

Let's put the score around 225 since that's half way between 200-250, where most players lie.

That means for every match score of 0 you need one at 450 to average 225. That's 50 short of the 500 mark. This is the maximum variance possible. Realistically, even potatoes score more than 0 on a regular basis which correspondingly pulls that upper number down putting 500 even further out of reach.

That means the average player needs to, at minimum, double their average match score to hit the 500 mark. Only those with a 250 average are going to hit the requirement and stay within the bracket.

Doing it once is lucky, doing it 5 times is excessive.


Note: Really should have said 700 for your personalised score requirement given the your stats. Good guess on what your target would be if you were the average player.

What the..
No, just no.
The requirement IS NOT average matchscore. Average has NOTHING to do with it.
You need matchscore not average matchscore.

Vxheous, on 13 May 2019 - 02:22 PM, said:

Since we're talking about 700 matchscore, I hit that yesterday doing the medium event playing a 2015 meta stormcrow (2ERLL + 4ERML)

GG
ATM Huntsman with ultra low skill requirements (just some softskills for positioning and ya good).

[justcallme A S H]

RJF Volkodav, on 13 May 2019 - 02:36 PM, said:

I would disagree a bit. There are players (i consider a true top) who play different non-meta **** solo playing on streams and getting KDR>5 along with impressive AMS. I think most of top players shall know who do i'm talking about ). Like ok, look at the Proton stats, he play Solo most of the time streaming and i believe (not sure) not playing much in GQ. Like i feel myself potatoe compared to Proton, Bowser, Chimera, Lizzee... But that is also a goal to look forward too so its great ).

Oh totally agree with your disagrement mate lol - I'm just talking the majority here. Definately some outlier examples among the top, always will be

Plus Jarls also takes into account history going back ~35 seasons only. So if you were a potato and improved that affects overall markedly.
Just looking at my own as an example I've gone from a 1.2 WLR / 2.0 KDR to a regular 3.0 WLR / 4.0 KDR. Averaged out that's 2.2 KDR / 3.3 WLR respetively and the shift essentially started once I started playing Comp and rose even more after playing with EmP which has absolutely bettered my game.

You can see a number of top players actually improve over time as well. Now whether that is them improving or the overall skill of the playerbase dropping... Is a discussion for another time.

[justcallme A S H]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 13 May 2019 - 02:59 PM, said:

GG
ATM Huntsman with ultra low skill requirements (just some softskills for positioning and ya good).

Now upgrade that to ATM VGL-3... I mean I've done similar in other mechs/builds so it's nothing out of the ordinary stats wise.

Pretty sure I've done similar in a XL Atlas of all things

[B L O O D W I T C H]

justcallme A S H, on 13 May 2019 - 03:13 PM, said:

Now upgrade that to ATM VGL-3... I mean I've done similar in other mechs/builds so it's nothing out of the ordinary stats wise.

Pretty sure I've done similar in a XL Atlas of all things

I've not bought any, tbh.
Kind of affraid my whole clan medium lineup will be obsolent after i do.

And, yes, it is really nothing out of the ordinary. Everyone can do that. Thanks for confirming.
800MS in a medium is not quite as common, although i've done that assaults. Kinda testemony of how much powercreep the VGL actually is?

Edited by Toha Heavy Industries, 13 May 2019 - 03:27 PM.

[HenryFA]

Mumuharra, on 13 May 2019 - 01:16 PM, said:

Nice.
Is this a joke or a real hint („down for maintanance“)?

The link is working

https://leaderboard....rch?u=Mumuharra

[Vxheous]

VonBruinwald, on 13 May 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:

Nice.

But.

786 should be your peak...

My peak is somewhere in the 900's, I can't find the screenshot right now. I hit 1166 matchscore as absolute peak on my alt, but that was fighting against Tier 3s, so doesn't count.

[VonBruinwald]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 13 May 2019 - 02:59 PM, said:

What the..
No, just no.
The requirement IS NOT average matchscore. Average has NOTHING to do with it.
You need matchscore not average matchscore.

We're talking about the average player (225MS). Out of curiosity, where do you place the average match player score wise?

With an average match score of 250 and an even bell curve a player peaks at 500, no more.

Looking at the data on Jarls' you can see a bias towards lower scores, extrapolate and it demonstrates why we see sub 250 players hit the 500 mark. Possible, but far outside their normal range of play and certainly not "fairly easy to complete for average players."

[B L O O D W I T C H]

VonBruinwald, on 13 May 2019 - 04:21 PM, said:

With an average match score of 250 and an even bell curve a player peaks at 500, no more.

Jesus christ.
Again, since you obviously haven't caught it the first 2 times.
Average Matchscore DOES NOT MATTER.
Noone has his matchscore hardlocked at 500MS just because his average is 250MS.
Average does not matter.
These two ARE NOT LINKED.
There is no peak.
Everything needed for 500 Matchscore is easy doable ingame.
We're talking about a 800 damage direct fire game. (that is 15 trigger pulls with a MadCat mk2 or 10 with a HG fafnir, not accounting critical damage, not accounting consumables (easy 200-400 damage extra))
1K lrm "hold locks pls" game.
AMS/Spotting/Narcing games (honestly i got 600MS in a support nova with dual peeps).
Listen to the guys who pull 500MS consitently (that and only that is the requirement for the event).
They can and will tell you that is it not difficult. You do NOT need anything above average.
In fact, you do not need anything as you can get 500MS with other means (LRMing for example is stupidly easy, literally autoaim from cover)
Stop using random mechs, stop leveling your mechs, don't derp, buy consumables for once and you have it in the bag.

VonBruinwald, on 13 May 2019 - 04:21 PM, said:

Possible, but far outside their normal range of play and certainly not "fairly easy to complete for average players."

Hence the bar was set to 500MS. What do you want? 200MS one time for a free hero assault?
It's a Challenge, challenge means test of skill, not free participation trophy.
And again, 500MS isn't even a high hurdle. it's fairly low when we consider how easy it is to get 500MS.

Edited by Toha Heavy Industries, 13 May 2019 - 05:11 PM.

[McGoat]

I have 1k+ MS a few times, but it is honest hard carry work in a mode that is sometimes work enough for someone who wants to win without loosing their chit in solo Q.

This is my most recent "high" MS game a few weeks back at 902


In any case, for those that wonder who the real top players are.. Just watch!

Edited by McGoat, 13 May 2019 - 05:02 PM.

[Mumuharra]

Tarl Cabot, on 13 May 2019 - 02:54 PM, said:

Am able to view Jarl's list it at the time of my post, and the link is your overall average. Jarls pulls the information that the MWO website and has all the seasons (months) except for the current season/month.

Thank you and sorry for my replay.
The site was just not online yesterday.
Now she is.
Very interesting.

[Vellron2005]

Curccu, on 13 May 2019 - 03:48 AM, said:

So you think that the best Oceanic team was a lot better than 2nd best US or EU team in 1st MWOWC?

I don't really follow MWOWC, I just think if you got a trophy cockpit item, you probably earned it..

[VonBruinwald]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 14 May 2019 - 01:47 AM, said:

Snip...
I'm not sure you're following the maths.

You also seem to be under the assumption that the average player regularly plays better than the evidence presents. That's understandable, you're better than the average player so you've naturally going to have a skewed perspective on things. Best thing I can suggest is to do the maths yourself. Plot the MS of every game you play and if you can do the same with some who averages 250, I'd bet good money you see a bell curve with a left bias in both cases and those +500 scores for the 250 player are a good distance outside their normal range of play.

[Xiphias]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 13 May 2019 - 04:47 PM, said:

Average Matchscore DOES NOT MATTER.
Noone has his matchscore hardlocked at 500MS just because his average is 250MS.
Average does not matter.
These two ARE NOT LINKED.
There is no peak.

I think you're missing his main point. It's not that player's with an average of 250MS can't get higher than a 500MS, it's that it is significantly less likely to happen. Player's are generally going to have some type of bell curve distribution of MS. If a player has an average 250MS that means the peak of the curve is at/near 250MS. Depending on how wide/narrow the curve is will affect how probably it is that the player will be able to achieve 500MS in a reasonable amount of games.

If a player is averaging 100MS you wouldn't expect them to be able to get 500MS. Certainly it could happen, but it's unlikely that a player playing that poorly would be able to quickly adjust and become good enough to score 500MS. Similarly, for the player that is averaging 250MS, getting 500MS represents a pretty significant improvement in play. While they might occasionally get a game like that, it's not a high probability of them getting that score.

Based purely on probability, the lower a player's average match score, the more matches they will have to play in order to get a match where they are able to score 500MS. My average MS is significantly higher, because of that the deviation from my average to 500MS is significantly smaller and therefore more probable to happen. As a result I will need to player fewer matches to get the required number of games.

At a certain point, the number of games required for an average player to be more likely than not to have achieved the required number of 500MS games becomes unfeasible for the event. I don't think that's a problem, not everyone will be able to achieve the reward, but understand that for some players it really isn't likely to be achievable. Obviously, there are changes to how they play that could increase the odds by padding MS, but even with that you're expecting them to be able to play significantly better than they normally do.

For me the event would have been easy, however if I had to play with/against EMP every match it would be nigh impossible. Similarly, if you are a lower skill player and you are playing with/against better players it's going to be quite hard to hit the numbers required, there's only so much damage to go around and better players are usually going to take more of it, making it harder for weaker players.

[Jiffy]

justcallme A S H, on 13 May 2019 - 02:24 PM, said:

And that shows the difference between SoloQ and GroupQ quite a bit.

You can tell just by looking who the GroupQ centric and SoloQ centric players are. Quite noticeable actually as there is a WLR/KDR and Survival difference.

W / K / S
SoloQ Centric - ~2.5 / ~3 / ~55%
GroupQ Centric - ~3.5+ / 4+ / 65%+

I think this was true a while ago back when there were more players, but I find that it's not hard to maintain about a 3.0 W/L, 6.0+ K/D, and ~60% survival rate in solo these days. Mostly because people will literally just sit and let you shoot them. I play more solo queue than anything else. Not even playing up my own abilities, it's just the state of the game anymore.