126 replies to this topic

[Aidan Crenshaw]

That's not an A.I., that's a script on a rubberband.

[Mechwarrior1441491]

war thunder uses bots and it's fine.

[L057FUNC710N]

Mechwarrior1441491, on 26 September 2019 - 03:54 PM, said:

war thunder uses bots and it's fine.

This isn't war thunder, it's a completely different game.

[RockmachinE]

I stop playing a game when I see bots in it.

The reason I play multiplayer games is PVP. AI can be coded to be very difficult, but it is never as colorful, unpredictable and fun as players.

If its a multiplayer online game, it needs real players, thats the whole idea.

I'd rather wait longer for MM then have bots. The day bots show up (hypothetically) is when I stop playing.

[Prototelis]

I would rather have bots so I could have reliable teammates...

[General Solo]

As long as we can Farm the bots.
They should get salty too
For immersion

[Davegt27]

game already has bots

try hards call them potatoes

[General Solo]

Then make the bots ezy peezy for them so they can see how the other 1% live and what clubbing is like.



And for the try hards, they get the Beautiful Proton Beep Boop bot Edition Beep Boop Bot.



Another thing match maker may benifit with the (artificial) population boost and maybe function better.
Need to change the skill metric though,
Yes PSR is crap due to upward bias but PSR Rate of change over time could work to better indicate skill levels

Doh I heard long ago on the forums that licence was for PVP only , so bots could be a legal issue
So could be rumors and hearsay

Edit: Added Pix for immersion
2nd Edit: Added bettter Pix

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 05 October 2019 - 12:35 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

Imperius, on 11 September 2019 - 06:57 PM, said:

PGI really didn't have to code AI in for Unreal its baked in the engine and they may have to add parameters but it's already done for the most part for them.

At least the bots would have a decent loadout, heat management, and the ability to not miss.

Incorrect, they would be stock mechs ( far easier to add) with a random hit chance with all weapons maximum hit chance for bots is 95%

[C E Dwyer]

Vellron2005, on 10 September 2019 - 11:34 PM, said:

The point of the post is that PGI is supposed to be much more proficient at coding A.I now that MW5 is near release?

Um yeah...

While your correct it might extend the self life in this I agree, have you watched the in game examples, one mech gets to fight off half the Capellan armed forces, to make up for how dumb the A.I is.

[C E Dwyer]

Mechwarrior1441491, on 26 September 2019 - 03:54 PM, said:

war thunder uses bots and it's fine.

Well that is your opinion, but please narrow down fine, please.

if you mean, they add to make up the numbers so that there are full teams then you right.

Bots on the whole for PvP are incredibly dumb.

Most companies ( maybe not this one ) have a series of A.I options , ranging from Chess grand master to Duh..

Most companies are wise enough to use the Duh, with a few additions, because most of their player base would lose, and quit.

This is not 'fine'

[Siegegun]

OZHomerOZ, on 05 October 2019 - 12:16 PM, said:

Doh I heard long ago on the forums that licence was for PVP only , so bots could be a legal issue
So could be rumors and hearsay

If this were true they wouldn't be able to make MW5. Hard to say what licensing rights they got when they bought out IGP as publishers.

[MadcatX]

Mechwarrior1441491, on 26 September 2019 - 03:54 PM, said:

war thunder uses bots and it's fine.

An important difference between the two is War Thunder and games of it's kind use a ticket respawn system (set # of respawns per team, not per player.) This allows for some leniency if an A.I. does something dumb resulting in it's death (probably something like not being programmed to Nascar, over-extending itself, etc). In MWO, if an A.I. mech did something dumb resulting in it's death, it would have a much more significant impact on the team.

[General Solo]

Siegegun, on 06 October 2019 - 03:29 AM, said:

If this were true they wouldn't be able to make MW5. Hard to say what licensing rights they got when they bought out IGP as publishers.

The games have different licensing arrangements with the license owners.

I was talking about the original licensing arrangement for MWO made years ago.

The MW5 arrangement is more recent and a separate thing to the MWO aggreement.

For example I heard the VIP in dat wont be named game mode ran off a script, not AI for MWO.

The new Licensing arrangement for MW5 would of course include AI because a single player game needs it.
Luckily the game engine for MW5, Unreal 4 comes with AI, which makes the job of tailoring AI to MW5 easier.

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 06 October 2019 - 10:10 AM.

[LordNothing]

i dont really think bots would help the game very much unless they were in the form of non-mech npc units. pretty much serving a 'things to step on' role like the way mw4 used them. an annoyance but not a real threat unless used in large numbers. probibly deployed as some kind of consumables. each one being a squad of four helis/vtols, 2 tanks, a dozen elementals, or four light ground vehicles or a pair of aerotech fighters.

[The pessimistic optimist]

PhoenixFire55, on 09 September 2019 - 11:47 PM, said:

Or instead of being ret@rded we can actually go back to 8v8, i.e. the way this game was always meant to be played.

I am for 8v8

[Siegegun]

OZHomerOZ, on 06 October 2019 - 10:03 AM, said:

The games have different licensing arrangements with the license owners.

I was talking about the original licensing arrangement for MWO made years ago.

The MW5 arrangement is more recent and a separate thing to the MWO aggreement.

For example I heard the VIP in dat wont be named game mode ran off a script, not AI for MWO.

The new Licensing arrangement for MW5 would of course include AI because a single player game needs it.
Luckily the game engine for MW5, Unreal 4 comes with AI, which makes the job of tailoring AI to MW5 easier.

None of us know the licensing agreements nor what they entail. Do you have any actual evidence they are different contracts and/or agreements? Can you quote anyone saying this? AI can be/is a script in a lot of game engines. It depends on the engine and how things are implemented. I have done hobbyist game making for a long time, the AI is scripted into one of the main engines I have played with. Also you can have compiled AI or scripted AI in a few different 3d engines. Sometimes both making a single AI (have somethings compiled into the engine then have scripted hooks tying into the compiled parts). It all depends on the game maker. You wouldn't know the difference between a scripted AI or a compiled into the engine one from your stand point. The "VIP" sucked because PGI is bad at making AI, not because it was "scripted" as opposed to an in engine compiled AI.

[General Solo]

Wut!

Russ wants to make MWO so he talks to microsoft to let him, pre 2012

Russ wants to make MW5 so he talks to microsoft to let him, Some years later

Different contract dude

Wut!

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 07 October 2019 - 07:34 AM.

[Siegegun]

OZHomerOZ, on 07 October 2019 - 07:28 AM, said:

Wut!

I will break it down. You nor I nor other players know what the license says, thus unless you have any actual quotes or evidence you do not know if they are/were multiple contracts. You are guessing without actual evidence.

You seem to think there is a difference between something being "scripted" or an "AI". AI can be scripted or hard coded into the engine or a combination. ALL of them are an AI. Just because something is scripted does not mean it is not an AI. AI is and can be made with nothing but scripts, and as a player you will not know the difference. I.E. it doesn't matter how the "VIP" AI was made, it didn't suck because it was scripted (if it was), it sucked because PGI is bad at implementing AI. Also I hope they do not use some stock AI with unreal, most "stock" AI solutions are super simplistic, to do it right PGI still needs to learn how to make more than a FSM AI.

[Prototelis]

The VIP isn't AI.

Its just a bot following nodes; It doesn't respond, adapt, or exhibit any intelligent action.

Every game in the series has had trash AI, expect MW5 will be no different.