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About Clan Puls Lasers


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#101 justcallme A S H

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Posted 07 March 2020 - 06:49 PM

View PostSniper09121986, on 07 March 2020 - 05:15 AM, said:

Did you just confess in public that you... have used 4*LRM20?


In public?

I've done it live on stream many times you buffoon. Especially during the super buffs of 2018. They are ridiculous.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 07 March 2020 - 09:22 PM.


#102 justcallme A S H

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Posted 07 March 2020 - 06:54 PM

As for Snub PPC.

They don't need range adjustment. They need HEAT adjustment.

Lower the heat generated and it'll be viable. Thus a rather simple fix to make the weapon. It doesn't need any alterations to range because range is not it's issue.



#103 PhoenixFire55

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Posted 08 March 2020 - 06:48 AM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 07 March 2020 - 01:03 PM, said:


cLPL
  • 6 tons, 2 slots
  • HSL +2
  • 12 dmg
  • 10 heat
  • 600/840 range
SnPPC
  • 6 tons, 2 slots
  • HSL +2
  • 10 dmg
  • 10 heat
  • 270/630 range
And you think your ClanTech's trash?

^ Gotta love the clueless. One is instant pinpoint dmg, other has 1.1s duration. But sure, lets only compare stats that we want to.

#104 B0oN

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Posted 08 March 2020 - 07:04 AM

My ER-strawberries taste way longer than my standard bananas !
HALP !!1!11
PGI PLS FIX !

*popcorns away on all flavours*

#105 Kubernetes

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Posted 08 March 2020 - 07:31 AM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 07 March 2020 - 03:03 PM, said:


Taking the Snub to 540-780m wouldn't displace the Std.


tf are you smoking?

#106 VonBruinwald

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Posted 08 March 2020 - 11:48 AM

View PostKubernetes, on 08 March 2020 - 07:31 AM, said:


tf are you smoking?


Salt.

Literally sticks of rock salt...

#107 Aidan Crenshaw

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Posted 08 March 2020 - 11:07 PM

So, dehydration is a thing.

#108 MisterSomaru

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Posted 22 March 2020 - 02:45 PM

why am I getting *** cancer with some of these responses?

#109 VonBruinwald

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Posted 22 March 2020 - 03:30 PM

View PostPhoenixFire55, on 08 March 2020 - 06:48 AM, said:

One is instant pinpoint dmg, other has 1.1s duration. But sure, lets only compare stats that we want to.


Both are pinpoint.

One is hitscan DoT the other is a front loaded projectile. As to which method is superior, it's situational.

But no matter how you try and dress it down the cLPL is still superior to the SnPPC.

#110 Arnold The Governator

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Posted 22 March 2020 - 04:26 PM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 07 March 2020 - 01:03 PM, said:


cLPL
  • 6 tons, 2 slots
  • HSL +2
  • 12 dmg
  • 10 heat
  • 600/840 range
SnPPC
  • 6 tons, 2 slots
  • HSL +2
  • 10 dmg
  • 10 heat
  • 270/630 range
And you think your ClanTech's trash?


Buff the SnPPC to 630/720 and we'd have the nearest thing to a pair of parallel weapons in the game with the key difference being hitscan vs. ppfld.

Or we could nerf the cLPL to 360/630 and both cry.

I think you are forgetting that snub nosed PPC's have pin point damage and can disable ECM, which is another additional benefit of any PPC class of weaponry. I fail to see what you are attempting to compare here when the two weapon systems are completely different role wise.

#111 T O I L E T

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Posted 22 March 2020 - 04:57 PM

snubs are bad

#112 PhoenixFire55

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 01:18 AM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 22 March 2020 - 03:30 PM, said:

Both are pinpoint.

Ok, ok ... lemme get this straight ... do you really claim that both LPL and SnubPPC are pinpoint?

LOL

Posted Image


View PostVonBruinwald, on 22 March 2020 - 03:30 PM, said:


One is hitscan DoT the other is a front loaded projectile. As to which method is superior, it's situational.

No it isn't. Doing instant full damage is always superior. Unless of course you need hitscan to be able to at least scracth smth with your potatoe aim.

View PostVonBruinwald, on 22 March 2020 - 03:30 PM, said:

But no matter how you try and dress it down the cLPL is still superior to the SnPPC.

No it isn't. The fact that potatoes can't aim and prefer hitscan has no impact on the discussed point. LPL is vastly superior for >500m trades. SnubPPC is vastly superior for <270m trades and brawling.

The only thing I would change in terms of "balance" is remove SnubPPC from the shared ghost heat group and incrase their ghost trigger limit to 4-5. That would definitely create a new class of energy-oriented brawlers not relying on IS MPLs, which are currently way above anything else in that regard.

On a side note. Do us all a favor and refrain from taking part in game balance discussions until you actually manage to obtain a level of understanding of this game that allows you to not be in the bottom half of the population skill wise dear mr.pinpoint-lasers.

#113 FupDup

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 01:52 AM

View PostPhoenixFire55, on 23 March 2020 - 01:18 AM, said:

Ok, ok ... lemme get this straight ... do you really claim that both LPL and SnubPPC are pinpoint?

LOL

I think he's defining "pinpoint" as a weapon that has no random spread or deviation; one that always goes exactly where the crosshair is pointing.

For lasers that definition is technically true, but due to the beam duration mechanic they often spread their damage across multiple body parts due to user error and/or enemy evasion/twisting.

So in summary, it's a disagreement over whether "pinpoint" just means "goes where you point it" or "always allocates damage into a single hitbox." IMO I'd say lasers are kinda half-pinpoint because they in theory CAN dump all the damage into one hitbox even if they do usually spread a bit (because that spread is the result of user/enemy actions rather than random numbers like SRMs or LBX).

#114 PhoenixFire55

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 01:58 AM

View PostFupDup, on 23 March 2020 - 01:52 AM, said:

I think he's defining "pinpoint" as a weapon that has no random spread or deviation; one that always goes exactly where the crosshair is pointing.

And I think I give about zero f**ks about what he randomly redefines. There is no point in a discussion unless you speak the same language and put the same meaning in the same words.

View PostFupDup, on 23 March 2020 - 01:52 AM, said:

For lasers that definition is technically true, but due to the beam duration mechanic they often spread their damage across multiple body parts due to user error and/or enemy evasion/twisting.

Thanks cap.

View PostFupDup, on 23 March 2020 - 01:52 AM, said:

So in summary, it's a disagreement over whether "pinpoint" just means "goes where you point it" or "always allocates damage into a single hitbox." IMO I'd say lasers are kinda half-pinpoint because they in theory CAN dump all the damage into one hitbox even if they do usually spread a bit (because that spread is the result of user/enemy actions rather than random numbers like SRMs or LBX).

Following the same logic I can define SRMs as pinpoint as well. Because I can very much put them into the same component at 50m range. LBXs is even easier, 100m range for LBX20 etc. See now how great this game becomes? Every weapon is pinpoint! Praise the RNGJesus.

#115 DrtyDshSoap

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 04:22 AM

Lasers have a duration. Do you really think any weapon that has a duration or burn time would be considered pinpoint?

Pinpoint would fall into ballistics with the exception of LBX (It's a ****** shotgun), and PPCs, except PPC's spread from the point of impact to adjacent parts. (I hit your CT, minute damage spread to side torsos. Can't quite remember if the full 10 damage is going to that spot, and then additional damage spreads to the side torsos, or if say, 8 damage hits with 1 damage spreading. For all intents and purposes though, PPC's would be considered pinpoint since it's 1 projectile and no burn time).

SRMs, LRMs, and ATM's are not pinpoint. They're a ballistic but they spread unless, just like a shotgun/LBX, you're blasting away point blank range. But you'd look like an uber potato if you did that with LRMs and ATMs. Da Moar Ya Knooooooooooooow.

Not sure how this is suddenly new information for people but okay, whatever.

#116 Aidan Crenshaw

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 04:50 AM

View PostMichelle Branch, on 23 March 2020 - 04:22 AM, said:

and PPCs, except PPC's spread from the point of impact to adjacent parts.


That is true only for C-ER PPCs they do 10 dmg on the impact component and 2.5 dmg to it's two adjacent components for a max total of 15 dmg. All other PPC-type weapons do pinpoint damage to the component they hit.
Not sure how this is suddenly new information for people but okay, whatever.

Are you folks arguing over definitions, again?

#117 VonBruinwald

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 05:30 AM

View PostPhoenixFire55, on 23 March 2020 - 01:18 AM, said:

Do us all a favor and refrain from taking part in game balance discussions until you actually manage to obtain a level of understanding of this game that allows you to not be in the bottom half of the population skill wise dear mr.pinpoint-lasers.


View PostPhoenixFire55, on 23 March 2020 - 01:58 AM, said:

There is no point in a discussion unless you speak the same language and put the same meaning in the same words.


Try and curb your elitism and learn the meaning of "bottom half" while you're at it Posted Image

With regards to pinpoint, Lasers are pinpoint, all their damage goes exactly where you are aiming. FupDup's post covers your discrepancy with the term pretty well. What they are not is PPFLD (Pinpoint front loaded damage), which is what SnPPCs are.

View PostPhoenixFire55, on 23 March 2020 - 01:18 AM, said:

The only thing I would change in terms of "balance" is remove SnubPPC from the shared ghost heat group and incrase their ghost trigger limit to 4-5. That would definitely create a new class of energy-oriented brawlers not relying on IS MPLs, which are currently way above anything else in that regard.


4-5 SnPPC that's 24+ tons of weapons vs. 12 for MPLs. I'm assuming you meant LPL since there's a comparable tonnage. As much as I want a Quad PPC IS 'Mech the tonnage required is rather restricting.

#118 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 06:16 AM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 23 March 2020 - 05:30 AM, said:

4-5 SnPPC that's 24+ tons of weapons vs. 12 for MPLs. I'm assuming you meant LPL since there's a comparable tonnage. As much as I want a Quad PPC IS 'Mech the tonnage required is rather restricting.


I think he means IS MPLs 'cause they rock compared to most laser vomit that IS can throw out in a brawling situation, i.e., ~250m range and under. My 9 MPLs Black Knight running an XL360 can move at 83 kph and dish out so much damage and so quickly that it's evil.

So, if Snubs are to be used at their optimal range, then 10 damage for 10 heat is far too much to give up, given their tonnage. Either reduce Heat like Ash suggested or give them their own HSL limit like PhoenixFire said.

#119 Sniper09121986

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 07:20 AM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 23 March 2020 - 06:16 AM, said:


I think he means IS MPLs 'cause they rock compared to most laser vomit that IS can throw out in a brawling situation, i.e., ~250m range and under. My 9 MPLs Black Knight running an XL360 can move at 83 kph and dish out so much damage and so quickly that it's evil.

So, if Snubs are to be used at their optimal range, then 10 damage for 10 heat is far too much to give up, given their tonnage. Either reduce Heat like Ash suggested or give them their own HSL limit like PhoenixFire said.


Yeah, heat per second for the snub is insane, only heavy PPC has more than that. Standard PPC looks much better in that regard, and LPL is still better. Hardly any reason to use snubs for brawling, which is kind of their intended purpose.

#120 VonBruinwald

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Posted 23 March 2020 - 07:39 AM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 23 March 2020 - 06:16 AM, said:

I think he means IS MPLs 'cause they rock compared to most laser vomit that IS can throw out in a brawling situation, i.e., ~250m range and under. My 9 MPLs Black Knight running an XL360 can move at 83 kph and dish out so much damage and so quickly that it's evil.

So, if Snubs are to be used at their optimal range, then 10 damage for 10 heat is far too much to give up, given their tonnage. Either reduce Heat like Ash suggested or give them their own HSL limit like PhoenixFire said.


The problem with increasing the HSL to 4 is it only helps Assaults, you've got to shave 5 tons of that Black Knight to take advantage of the HSL increase, that's quite a compromise.

At least if you reduce heat those smaller 'mechs aren't neglected.





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