619 replies to this topic

[justcallme A S H]

35T don't all suck though.

WLF very strong.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 13 June 2021 - 12:21 PM.

[pattonesque]

shoot that reminds me, I've been meaning to try an 8-SPL Firestarter after the mobility/weapon changes

it's still too big but it can probably do work again

[justcallme A S H]

FS is great also right now.

[Leone]

Can confirm that that Firestarter does some heavy lifting for me in CW. Still haven't managed to out damage anyone from [EMP] though.

~Leone.

[LordNothing]

justcallme A S H, on 13 June 2021 - 12:20 PM, said:

35T don't all suck though.

WLF very strong.

that's certainly the outlier of the bunch. every light weight class has its goodies and baddies. but i think the 35 ton bracket as a whole is worse off than the others. 30 tonners for example are very strong with urbies and kitfoxen and the less good but still workable arctic cheetah. the 20 ton bracket is very situational to personal skills, but i seem to have those skills, and the 25 ton bracket is sparse, but commando.

[pattonesque]

I actually have been enjoying a 3/4 LPPC Panther quite a bit, but my god, that thing's knuckles drag. I have to jump way higher than I think because even when poptarting half the shots catch lips and ridges

[justcallme A S H]

It was mostly sarcasm, in that the WLF and Firestarter are, very strong.

Rescale, mobility and quirks will make them ever better.



The community just needs to chill / wait - see what comes.

[denAirwalkerrr]

Ah the usual 2 people with 0 experience in the matter besides their butthurt bambling nonsence and Ash wasting his time on them for 15 pages I see.

Edited by denAirwalkerrr, 13 June 2021 - 12:53 PM.

[Nightbird]

ASH had beer and peanuts but ran out of salt.

[Khobai]

dario03, on 13 June 2021 - 09:07 AM, said:

This and your other comments make it sound like you think an assault should just be better in all cases. Do you want assaults to just be flat out better than heavies?

No the opposite in fact. I dont want heavies to be better than assaults. And given the player bases longstanding bias towards heavies over any other weight class I would say thats almost certainly the case.

[FuzzyNZ]

Ah here is proof that Light mechs are NOT OP.

Team 1 stomped Team 2.
Team 2 had more lights.

Lights not OP.

[Xeno Phalcon]

I can't tell if Fuzzy is serious or not. (Especially sense the Commando did more damage than anyone else on the losing team, and blue team had zero assaults curiously enough)

On the flip side I had a match earlier today with TEN lights in play, was kind of trippy kind of felt like a cavalry battle with groups of lights and mediums zipping around.

[Storming Angel]

Xeno Phalcon, on 13 June 2021 - 07:53 PM, said:

I can't tell if Fuzzy is serious or not. (Especially sense the Commando did more damage than anyone else on the losing team, and blue team had zero assaults curiously enough)

On the flip side I had a match earlier today with TEN lights in play, was kind of trippy kind of felt like a cavalry battle with groups of lights and mediums zipping around.

Well if an all light team can't a mixed team or team with a heavier play of assaults then you can't really say they are overpowered (which clearly most people don't even understand the term whatsovever).

The only really strong light is the Piranha, otherwise lights are either nuisance or easy to deal with on their own and only become a problem when 2 or more of them exist and are heading towards you.

[justcallme A S H]

A single screenshot, with the key information blanked out, is completely useless and contributes nothing to the discussion.

[-Mean Machine Angel-]

Fuzzy is saying a team of mostly lights got yeeted into the shadow realm by a team that wasnt mostly lights. Therefore lights NOT OP.Its abit of humour,thats obvious to anyone that didnt want to find a way to be condescending to folk.

[Xeno Phalcon]

Not really adding anything, just thought it was amusing because there were so many lights in QP yesterday.

[Dogstar]

JediPanther, on 13 June 2021 - 11:27 AM, said:

14-15 pages in and no one not a single person has given any reason out of all 127 light mechs in the game exactly which ones and builds are OP OR how to fix those exact variant/build.

SNIP

I'm sure others have plenty to say but here's my personal list of which lights I consider to have an OP feature (not totally OP, just have one feature that is way better than all the other lights). I can't remember the specific variant for some of these so you'll have to look them up.

IS

Flea - superfast, teeny tiny size, and ECM option make it harder to see or hit at range than any other mech, easily fixed by upscaling it a bit to match the Locust in size (they're basically the same mech)

Locust Pirate Bane - superfast, tiny size, and ECM again - not as bad as the Flea though, so maybe borderline okay?

Commando - superfast, tiny size, and ECM yet again (have you spotted a pattern yet) - not as bad as the Flea thanks to chunky thighs, borderline

Note that it's really only the ECM variants that are 'OP' but that combination of speed size and ecm is what makes them hard to notice and hard to hit, especially for tier 5 mechdads like me

Clan

Arctic Cheetah - speed, jump jets, ECM and a bunch of (high mount) weapons. While not as small as the Commando the Cheater is still pretty small and has the benefits of jump jets too

Piranha - tiny size, super fast, ridiculous number of hardpoints. The only non ECM light mech that can be considered 'OP'. Still a one trick pony though


That's pretty much it as far as I'm concerned. A common theme is that all of the mechs I consider to be a bit 'OP' are that they are very small so I suspect that carefully upscaling them a bit would quickly remove their status.

[pattonesque]

those lights have their strengths and are v. playable now but none of them are OP. Most of them are ended or effectively ended by one good alpha -- except for the commando, and while it is very tanky I wouldn't say its firepower is overwhelming

[Vlad Ward]

justcallme A S H, on 13 June 2021 - 12:45 PM, said:

It was mostly sarcasm, in that the WLF and Firestarter are, very strong.

Rescale, mobility and quirks will make them ever better.

The community just needs to chill / wait - see what comes.

I mean, I get what you're saying. I'm just not sure there's been enough visibility into the disconnect between balancing Lights for T1 and balancing Lights for T5.

Lights are unique in that one of their primary balance attributes (size) leverages peer performance rather than pilot performance. When a 'Mech is hard to hit because it's mobile, better pilots become harder to hit. When a 'Mech is hard to hit because it's small, weaker opponents have more trouble hitting them.

Most of the discussion I've seen has focused on buffing underperforming Lights to catch up to their peers and position the class to perform well in Tier 1. Is the performance gradient for Lights across Tiers on the radar?

[Nightbird]

Lights have no firepower, no range, and no agility, which is why they don't accomplish as much as other weight classes.



Jarl's list computes the relative MS earnings between weight classes. If you don't know how to read this, it says that on average, lights only earn 84MS for every 100MS earned by assaults, going up to 88MS for every 100MS earned by mediums.