44 replies to this topic

[Zigmund Freud]

I took a long break before this whole cauldron patches started, so I'm thinking if I should wait until they're done "refreshing" the game, so how long do you thing it will take? IIRC there were plans for a round of weapons changes, mobility, quirks and scale changes. Is it still the roadmap?

And in general, do you feel it's better or worse than ~1y ago?

[Cerebus23]

mobilty pass 2 updates ago?

quirk pass ongoing? partially done.


scale refactor, maybe? the issue is as i understand it, the bolt ons are all over the place scale, fitting and etc and if the just resize the mechs it buggers them all up to the point that last i heard they were mulling scrapping bolt on entirely. not sure where they landed or if.


i half jokingly suggest they scale the maps up 20%ish and call it a day.

the general consensus is they should port this to unreal since some features in mw5 are lacking here due to the cryengine being a million years old and all their coders having left.

[Zigmund Freud]

Cerebus23, on 04 January 2022 - 11:31 AM, said:

I half jokingly suggest they scale the maps up 20%ish and call it a day.

the general consensus is they should port this to unreal since some features in mw5 are lacking here due to the cryengine being a million years old and all their coders having left.

Scale up? I thought the idea was to make them slightly less stupid huge, with weapon buffs across the board.

Engine change is too unreal^tu-dum-tss to hope for, I just with they finish juggling the xml numbers before it's too late

[JediPanther]

The last time a reSCALE was done very many mechs got wrecked for it as it simply made their already easy to hit/kill mech geometry BIGER. There is a youtube video comparision of before and after. The lights particually got nerfed hard from it and only getting scaled back to their original size or smaller would they benefit from another RE-re-scale. Around 2016 I think it was. I quit playing the game due to it wrecking the mechs I loved to use.

[w0qj]

+1
Make maps +20% bigger (including the rocks that hide the mechs)?
That's a brilliant idea!

https://mwomercs.com...-mark-nicholson
MWO designer in recent above post discussed the airplane wing bolt-on for the upcoming Shadow Cat SHC-D Predator Booster Pack, there's no hint of any rescaling at all. In fact, the discussion seem to assume that mech sizes remain the same going forward.

In fact, MWO had never promised any mech rescaling thus far (since Daeron came aboard Sept 2021).

I feel that making maps +20% bigger is a brilliant idea, so that bigger mechs can hide behind rocks again!

Cerebus23, on 04 January 2022 - 11:31 AM, said:

...scale refactor, maybe? the issue is as i understand it, the bolt ons are all over the place scale, fitting and etc and if the just resize the mechs it buggers them all up to the point that last i heard they were mulling scrapping bolt on entirely. not sure where they landed or if.

i half jokingly suggest they scale the maps up 20%ish and call it a day. ...

[knight-of-ni]

My Griffins make a sad face whenever the topic of scale comes up.

[KaptinOrk]

knight-of-ni, on 04 January 2022 - 06:25 PM, said:

My Griffins make a sad face whenever the topic of scale comes up.

You mean you don't like being taller than a Shadowhawk and bulkier than a Wolverine?

[justcallme A S H]

Zigmund Freud, on 04 January 2022 - 10:40 AM, said:

I took a long break before this whole cauldron patches started, so I'm thinking if I should wait until they're done "refreshing" the game, so how long do you thing it will take? IIRC there were plans for a round of weapons changes, mobility, quirks and scale changes. Is it still the roadmap?

And in general, do you feel it's better or worse than ~1y ago?

They are still ongoing.

Weapons and Mobilty, mostly done.
Mech Quirks/Chassis, still in progress, about 5-6 chassis a month and still a number to go yet.

After that it is over to PGI and they need to make the roadmap... I can say it's been discussed with Cauldron, I cannot say what. Gotta wait for PGI to post all that up.

[GoodTry]

Zigmund Freud, on 04 January 2022 - 10:40 AM, said:

I took a long break before this whole cauldron patches started, so I'm thinking if I should wait until they're done "refreshing" the game, so how long do you thing it will take? IIRC there were plans for a round of weapons changes, mobility, quirks and scale changes. Is it still the roadmap?

And in general, do you feel it's better or worse than ~1y ago?

I don't see any reason to wait. The game is lots of fun right now IMO.

Things like rescale will definitely help a bit, but if you don't like the core game now I doubt you'll like it better with rescale.

[ThreeStooges]

GoodTry, on 05 January 2022 - 07:02 AM, said:

I don't see any reason to wait. The game is lots of fun right now IMO.

Things like rescale will definitely help a bit, but if you don't like the core game now I doubt you'll like it better with rescale.

Indeed. See my post above and watch that video on just how bad pgi can do a re-scale. Pgi has not given any offical post on a second re-scale to be done or anything along the lines of rescale planned for x-x-xx. Six years since the first one.

[PocketYoda]

I for one would love to see a catalyst Battletech rescaling.

[Kotis77]

Zigmund Freud, on 04 January 2022 - 10:40 AM, said:

I took a long break before this whole cauldron patches started, so I'm thinking if I should wait until they're done "refreshing" the game, so how long do you thing it will take? IIRC there were plans for a round of weapons changes, mobility, quirks and scale changes. Is it still the roadmap?

And in general, do you feel it's better or worse than ~1y ago?

Cauldron has done outstanding job balancing the game. Everything feels good now. There is some mechs overbuffed and some mechs are garbage, but nobody can balance everything to same level. They should get more credit from it. Of course longrange is too strong but its compies doing balance...

Its just current state of QP that is messing up good balance ATM. Games are just garbage. Im not that invested in QP so i have been watching "from outside" it decline for couple years now. Back in days soloque you did have impact on games by yourself. Now its just coinflip what gonna happen in match.

No matter how you balance mechs/weapons/rescale/skilltree/etc.... isnt gonna make matches better if you dont do something about quality of QP. We should try to find a way to fix current state of soupque before adding more stuff to it. So what is the main problem and how to fix it?

I would like to see soft PSR reset every couple months. Sure it would make matches messy for week or something but at least what ive seen on other FPS games its just works. Hope someone has better ideas.

[LordBraxton]

Personally I think the armor quirks and mobility changes have not been enough to make up for the huge PPFLD increases the cauldron has implemented.

I would have preferred all buffs to be defensive except for extremely underperforming mechs.

The more things that counter the high alpha meta, the better.

[PocketYoda]

Zigmund Freud, on 04 January 2022 - 10:40 AM, said:

I took a long break before this whole cauldron patches started, so I'm thinking if I should wait until they're done "refreshing" the game, so how long do you thing it will take? IIRC there were plans for a round of weapons changes, mobility, quirks and scale changes. Is it still the roadmap? And in general, do you feel it's better or worse than ~1y ago?

For me as a primarily Assault and Heavy pilot i'd say its much worse.

The constant nerfs on Armour and the boosts to lights and poking weapons have made playing those mechs far far harder and far slower.. The early nerfs on looking up and down years ago really destroyed mobility and now with the power creep from the cauldron didn't help.

Honestly lights and mediums have it way better these days. Not saying you cannot play them and have good matches but its way less chances these days.

Edited by Nomad Tech, 07 January 2022 - 07:34 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Nomad Tech, on 07 January 2022 - 07:31 PM, said:

The constant nerfs on Armour

Can you please point out the Heavy/Assaults that have had armour nerfs please?

Nomad Tech, on 07 January 2022 - 07:31 PM, said:

Honestly lights and mediums have it way better these days. Not saying you cannot play them and have good matches but its way less chances these days.

If that were remotely true, and it isn't, how are Assaults still the best performing weight class in MWO?

The data & stats show your words to be nothing other than misinformation.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 07 January 2022 - 07:42 PM.

[PocketYoda]

justcallme A S H, on 07 January 2022 - 07:40 PM, said:

Can you please point out the Heavy/Assaults that have had armour nerfs please?



If that were remotely true, and it isn't, how are Assaults still the best performing weight class in MWO?

The data & stats show your words to be nothing other than misinformation.

https://mwomercs.com...-december-2021/
Mostly light buffs and Clan super buffs
<p style="">

JagerMech
All Variants:

• Removed Armor boosts from LT, CT, RT <massive Nerf
  
• Removed structure boosts from LA, RA <massive Nerf
  
• Added +14 Armor to LA, RA

https://mwomercs.com...-november-2021/
More light and Clan Buffs..

https://mwomercs.com...9-october-2021/
More Massive buffs to lights.. Some Assault buffs

Nightstar
NSR-9P:

• Removed ballistic velocity
  
• Reduced UAC jam chance to -10% (from 25%) Massive Nerfs on a poor mech.

King Crab
KGC-001:

• Added ERPPC HSL +2 Should have Been +3

Marauder II
MAD-4A:

• Added large laser HSL +1
  
• Added -10% laser heat
  
• Removed PPC Family HSL < Why?

STK-4N:

• Removed energy cooldown <Nerf
  
• Removed energy range <Nerf
  
• Removed large laser range <Nerf
  
• Added Laser HSL +1
  
• Added Large laser HSL +1

https://mwomercs.com...september-2021/

Clan Guass buff Clan LRM buffs,

Massive Light Buffs.

Some much needed medium buffs but too few.. Nerfed Hellspawns really..

More Clan buffs

Piranha and Flea Buffs really!!!..

https://mwomercs.com...24-august-2021/

More Light Buffs (Seeing a theme)

Some needed Medium buffs.. Not enough.

Mauler
All Variants:

• Added +17 Structure to CT on all variants <Structure is useless
  
• Increased structure on both LT and RT from +10 to +14 on all variants
  
• Added -30% Crit chance receiving

https://mwomercs.com...0-20-july-2021/

The poking Buff Patch

Edited by Nomad Tech, 07 January 2022 - 08:45 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Nomad Tech, on 07 January 2022 - 08:43 PM, said:

Spoiler

JagerMech
All Variants:

Removed Armor boosts from LT, CT, RT <massive Nerf
Removed structure boosts from LA, RA <massive Nerf
Added +14 Armor to LA, RA

Not a nerf at all.

That is a nett buff to the Jager as its key weapons are in the arms which were easily blown off and now, due to buffs, are not.

Nomad Tech, on 07 January 2022 - 08:43 PM, said:

Spoiler

Nightstar

NSR-9P:

Removed ballistic velocity
Reduced UAC jam chance to -10% (from 25%) Massive Nerfs on a poor mech.

King Crab
KGC-001:

Added ERPPC HSL +2 Should have Been +3

Marauder II

MAD-4A:

Added large laser HSL +1
Added -10% laser heat
Removed PPC Family HSL < Why?
STK-4N:

Removed energy cooldown <Nerf
Removed energy range <Nerf
Removed large laser range <Nerf
Added Laser HSL +1
Added Large laser HSL +1

None of these are armour nerfs.

Nomad Tech, on 07 January 2022 - 08:43 PM, said:

Spoiler

Mauler

All Variants:

Added +17 Structure to CT on all variants <Structure is useless
Increased structure on both LT and RT from +10 to +14 on all variants
Added -30% Crit chance receiving

That is a buff? Why are you listing it?


In summary you have found a grand total of one IS Heavy that you believe was nerfed but wasn’t.

Sorry Samial – once again you have been unable to substantiate your claim that Heavys and Assaults have had constant armour nerfs. Your lengthy post does not contain even one example.

You have just confirmed you are unable to prove your claim or that you don’t understand the difference between weapon and survival quirks. Please stop misleading users with false claims.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 07 January 2022 - 09:19 PM.

[Davegt27]

Nerf=


verb
informal•US
verb: nerf; 3rd person present: nerfs; past tense: nerfed; past participle: nerfing; gerund or present participle: nerfing

cause to be weak or ineffective.



Whats a Nerf meaning?


(lowercase)Slang. (in a video game) to reconfigure (an existing character or weapon), making it less powerful: The game development team nerfed several guns in the recent update.

or you might say if I give you something that you did not previously have that could be considered a buff

if I take away or lessen something you had that could be considered a nerf

[Weeny Machine]

The 30-35t lights got really wrecked by the re-scale.

The problem at the time was not the size of lights but the bad hitreg. This got re-worked as well and lights suddenly took much more damage. Then came the re-sizing. But that was not enough...the new stats with the skill tree and re-quirking. Suddenly 35t mechs were fast but not agile anymore.
I mean, try to get into the back of an average assault (no Annihilator) for a meaningful amount of time with e.g. a Wolfhound.

Actually, there is no reason why you shouldn't play in casual mode a fast medium instead of a 35t. Heck, Assassins are more agile than any Wolfhound...or a Dragon or Linebacker as well, and they are heavies.

If you do not believe me, ask yourself: would you rather use an Oxide or an Assassin with missiles?

Edited by Weeny Machine, 08 January 2022 - 08:51 AM.

[TheCaptainJZ]

I wouldn't count on rescaling. If they did have the necessary resources, it would still take months to implement for even a few chassis. With that said, quirks can get changed as needed to compensate a bit and those are far easier to implement.

Nerfs are a necessary part of balance. You can't only buff because that leads directly to power creep. Personally, I'd like to see all weapons nerfed by 10% or so, either to damage, how often they fire, or the like. When you add base stats with quirks and skill tree, everything is too overpowered imo. I'd love to see base stats pushed back so adding quirks and skill tree is more in line with the current base stats now. Increasing TTK would be better for the game overall. It's more forgiving which is more fun to me. I enjoyed MWO the most in the earlier years. Then we got more and more mechs that could boat more and more weapons, introduced Clans, and more longer ranged weapons, outclassing many of the earlier weapons. Attempts have been made to make everything viable, which is great, but still. Natural power creep after 9 years.