127 replies to this topic

[marakesh]

Since you reversed this one.

LRM 5/10/15/20 (Standard and Artemis - Clan and IS)Max trajectory arc in indirect fire mode is increased to 150 meters (from 100m)*

Can you now undo the one that makes missiles leg people put it back to center torso pleas?

Edited by marakesh, 23 February 2024 - 11:23 PM.

[MrMadguy]

At least revert speed nerf, because LRMs are still useless outside of 300m radius. Remember? They're called LONG RANGE for reason. I had match several days ago, where one guy had lost both arms, ALL torso armor (both CT and STs) and had red internals. Other light pilot and my LRM40 weren't able to finish him, so he even survived in this match. Complete nonsense. It was also extremely hard to complete "Components destroyed" part of event due to LRMs being completely useless.

So, LRMs are still overnerfed. As I've already said, rader derp cheat should be removed anyway and no excuses should be used to keep it. LRMs are ok as is. They're about teamwork. They require teamwork for both effective attacking and defending against them. Why don't guys equip ATMs, stay with their teams for ATMs to overlap and sit inside ECM bubble? Because they want to be Rambo lights/snipers, focused on pure damage and not caring about using cover? It's their problem then, that they're being LRM-rained. It's their choice. They choose to focus on offensive skills. Their defense should suffer for sake of balance then.

They should L2P. Same thing, they say about us, when they talk about aiming skill. Providing complete immunity against LRMs is totally unfair. Why don't I have reflective armor skill then, that would reflect 99% of laser damage? M? Reduce dadar derp to something reasonable for just quirk, like 10% max.

Edited by MrMadguy, 24 February 2024 - 04:09 AM.

[Ttly]

Yeah, LRMs are rather underpowered unless you boat lrm120 or something.
They're not even good as "streak MRMs" while direct firing due to their spread+slow velocity, lockon time in general really shafts them too in this purpose since most decent players don't really expose themselves long enough for it (same problem with SSRMs but they're meant to be used at shorter range so meh), and nerfing indirect fire is rather petty as it can be countered by simply just engaging in the maneuver known as "moving behind a tall cover" to counteract the missile, not to mention the existence of AMS carriers shaving 3-7 missiles off a salvo per AMS mounted more often than not.

Edited by Ttly, 24 February 2024 - 01:20 AM.

[Magrowl]

LRMs clump their damage on legs because people back away and they end up landing lower in heir arc, this is not a targeting change…

[TravelingMaster]

MrMadguy, on 24 February 2024 - 12:48 AM, said:

At least revert speed nerf, because LRMs are still useless outside of 300m radius. Remember? They're called LONG RANGE for reason. I had match several days ago, where one guy had lost both arms, ALL torso armor (both CT and STs) and had red internals. Other light pilot and my LRM40 weren't able to finish him, so he even survived in this match. Complete nonsense. It was also extremely hard to complete "Components destroyed" part of event due to LRMs being completely useless.

So, LRMs are still overnerfed. As I've already said, rader derp cheat should be removed anyway and no excuses should be used to keep it. LRMs are ok as is. They're about teamwork. They require teamwork for both effective attacking and defending against them. Why don't guys equip ATMs, stay with their teams for ATMs to overlap and sit inside ECM bubble? Because they want to be Rambo lights/snipers, focused on pure damage and not caring about using cover? It's their problem then, that they're being LRM-rained. It's their choice. They choose to focus on offensive skills. Their defense should suffer for sake of balance then.

They should L2P. Same thing, they say about us, when they talk about aiming skill. Providing complete immunity against LRMs is totally unfair. Why don't I have reflective armor skill then, that would reflect 99% of laser damage? M? Reduce dadar derp to something reasonable for just quirk, like 10% max.

How is radar deprivation a 'cheat' when it's in the game as a skill? Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's a cheat.

[Vonbach]

Your wasting your breath PGI hates LRMs and would remove them from the game if they could.

[MechMaster059]

LOL.

The solution is simple: Don't use standard LRMs. They're a dead weapon except on mechs with large velocity quirks.

[Brom96]

After all these years, I still cannot understand who on Earth gets hammered with LRMs and dies from their fire only... I just came from 2 year pause, and yes, I got destroyed by them once, but that is my fault, for having my mech stuck between objects in one of the new maps released since. Don't get me wrong, it used to happen before, too, but only once in several months (3 to 4 months) of constant daily playing. With ECM, AMS, radar deprivation and common sense of not exposing the mech, or getting too close for LRM boat to shoot at you, they are nuisance in worst case. The best thing about them is that they can be used as a form of suppression.

Piloting LRMs boats was never profitable. I seldom got very high damage, and the only time I did whooping 900+ damage with them was beacuse someone in the team was actualy telling me what targets to shoot via voip. As, in theory, we should do. And no, it was not on Polar.

So why's there hate for a weapon system that is not easy to use effectively, especialy when you ahve no narcer with you or are palying solo... I have no idea.

[MechMaster059]

Brom96, on 25 February 2024 - 01:35 AM, said:

...

So why's there hate for a weapon system that is not easy to use effectively, especialy when you ahve no narcer with you or are palying solo... I have no idea.

The crux of it comes down to a bunch of competitive players thinking the fact that the weapon has auto-tracking to target means it's a low-skill weapon and therefor should "not be a top tier weapon". (I didn't know there was such a thing as weapon tiers...) They have explicitly stated this.

This is also why they don't care that STREAKs suck. It all comes down to bias against auto-tracking weapons.

The end result is a "quirk" weapon, i.e. a weapon that is only viable on heavily quirked mechs.
(velocity quirks for standard LRMs, cooldown quirks for STREAKs)

[Brom96]

Competitve players are not normal people, but small portion of a population. Insignificant to me. I guess they pay PGI more then the rest.

[kalashnikity]

Brom96, on 25 February 2024 - 03:40 PM, said:

Competitve players are not normal people, but small portion of a population. Insignificant to me. I guess they pay PGI more then the rest.

I doubt that. The player base in Quick Play, Tier 3.

There is a hope that Comp will become some kind of famous E-Sport. While I would love that, I don't think it is going to happen, at least not with this game running on this engine.

So the playerbase is made to suffer so the Comp Teams can have fun?

But I don't get to see PGI's books. It's possible comp players do bring in the most money for PGI.

[marakesh]

Yeah competitive players are the bane of any game they suck all the fun out of everything and its all numbers gaming. If ya want prof look at table top 40K used to be a game about having fun now its what does the most damage for the fewest points and stomps everything.

[Curccu]

marakesh, on 25 February 2024 - 10:39 PM, said:

Yeah competitive players are the bane of any game they suck all the fun out of everything and its all numbers gaming. If ya want prof look at table top 40K used to be a game about having fun now its what does the most damage for the fewest points and stomps everything.

There are players who want to win games instead of losing them (No matter what kind of game it is... Chess, Monopoly, MWO, CS and so on.) and then there are who don't care about winning, I don't understand latter.

[marakesh]

Curccu, on 26 February 2024 - 02:41 AM, said:

There are players who want to win games instead of losing them (No matter what kind of game it is... Chess, Monopoly, MWO, CS and so on.) and then there are who don't care about winning, I don't understand latter.

It's is not the people that want to win that make games suck its the people that want to win at all cost that make them suck. These are the type of people that think you should have guns in games like football as long as there team has the better guns.

[Curccu]

marakesh, on 26 February 2024 - 08:43 AM, said:

These are the type of people that think you should have guns in games like football as long as there team has the better guns.

I'm A-tier ex-comp player myself and I have yet to meet person like that in this games comp scene or any other game.

[1453 R]

Brom96, on 25 February 2024 - 01:35 AM, said:

...
So why's there hate for a weapon system that is not easy to use effectively, especialy when you ahve no narcer with you or are palying solo... I have no idea.

Because sKiLc0r3 people cannot abide anything but direct-fire twitch reflex weapons. No other form of skill matters except twitch aim. It's why the only truly successful E-sports - if you want to call them that - are all super fast paced hyperaggressive twitch shooters with no real room for strategy. sKiLc0r3 people don't want to have to think, they just want to slam forty ounces of Mountain Dew, snort a line or six of crack, and win by sheer dint of being twitchier and faster than the other guy instead of more skilled.

Any form of "autoaim" weapon defeats their entire ethos, and so in any game where lock-on weapons show up sKiLc0r3 people kvetch and complain relentlessly until those options are eventually removed. See: the constant, constant, constant nerfs to Winston and Symmetra, back before Overwatch stopped being worth playing, because they had lock-on weapons. The nerfs only stopped (for Sym, at least) when they finally reworked her weapon into a direct-fire twitch gun the same as every other jackhole in that game. See also: the lock-on pistol from Titanfall and players' immense hatred and loathing for it despite it losing outright to any direct-fire gun with decent aim and being used more for harvesting NPCs than dueling other pilots. Players still couldn't stand it and complained until the devs abolished it, despite the devs having put it in the game in the first place to allow older players with slower reflexes to actually play and enjoy Titanfall.

Or, shorter answer: because sKiLc0r3 people ruin everything.

[LordNothing]

with how hard it was to get one counter ecm locked damage over 2 days of game play, in t3, id say that missiles need a buff.

Edited by LordNothing, 26 February 2024 - 12:41 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

1453 R, on 26 February 2024 - 12:06 PM, said:

It's why the only truly successful E-sports - if you want to call them that - are all super fast paced hyperaggressive twitch shooters with no real room for strategy. sKiLc0r3 people don't want to have to think, they just want to slam forty ounces of Mountain Dew, snort a line or six of crack, and win by sheer dint of being twitchier and faster than the other guy instead of more skilled.

I'd say one of the most successful FPS e-sports would be Counterstrike, which you can't just win by being twitchy and faster than the other. People who repeat this non-sense come from a place of ignorance in that they haven't honestly watched it or anything, they just spew the non-sense that has generally been specifically aimed at Call of Duty specifically for years (and CoD rightfully deserves it given they catered to that sort of play for years).

[Ihlrath]

LordNothing, on 26 February 2024 - 12:41 PM, said:

with how hard it was to get one counter ecm locked damage over 2 days of game play, in t3, id say that missiles need a buff.

Sir, suggesting this is blaphemous to the Blue Flashlight Club. According to whom, much like the Waterboy's mom says....

Foozeball (and Buffing Missile Weapons) is the Devil!

[1453 R]

Quicksilver Aberration, on 26 February 2024 - 03:40 PM, said:

I'd say one of the most successful FPS e-sports would be Counterstrike, which you can't just win by being twitchy and faster than the other. People who repeat this non-sense come from a place of ignorance in that they haven't honestly watched it or anything, they just spew the non-sense that has generally been specifically aimed at Call of Duty specifically for years (and CoD rightfully deserves it given they catered to that sort of play for years).

To be fair, there's a difference between sKiLc0r3 people and ultracomps. At least, in my mind. Ultracomps train, build skills deliberately and with intention, and actively seek to master the game with the knowledge that it takes training and perseverance to get to and remain at that level.

sKiLc0r3 people are the yaybos who think they're Kerensky's gift to 'Mech combat, have never trained a day in their life because they figure they're Masters of All Things Robit simply by dint of having played over a thousand hours and through their endless natural talent™, and figure because they hit Tier 1 they're invincible superheros and anyone who ever beats them for any reason is cheating! Like all the "LIGHT MECHS OP" threads, or the constant Haterade aimed at lock-on missiles. They're egotistical finks whose perception of their own greatness and idea of what MWO is like has only the loosest pseudo-connection to reality, and listening to their opinion on literally anything MWO-related is a recipe for disaster. It's why they vaunt and value basic twitch aim over any other form of "skill" - because that's usually the only skill they possess and somewhere in their brain they know it.

Unfortunately, the "E-Sports" scene values that sort of thing too because it's showy and flashy and plays good to an audience. Super fast, hyperaggressive games with constant explosions and kills and just ACTION ACTION ACTTION are the things you always hear about, or at least the things I always hear about. Call of Duty's the big one, yeah, but junk like Overwatch isn't really that far behind. Sad, really. All spectacle, no substance.