25 replies to this topic

[Moadebe]

Please direct any discussion you may have about the Feb 2025 Patch Leaks post in this one.


The Feb 2025 Patch Leaks post can be found here -------> https://mwomercs.com...25-patch-leaks/



Please....PLEASE keep things civil. We ALL love this game. We ALL are here to play it and enjoy it. We ALL want this game to do well despite its obvious recent decline. Lets work on solutions to problems instead of exacerbating them.
Cheers yall. May your Jump Jets be full, and your Lasers be cool

Edited by Moadebe, Yesterday, 04:33 PM.

[LordNothing]

glad the roughneck came up. mostly so i could obtain the hero at half price in the science sale. idk if they are going to halfprice the bsk-m this soon, but il grab that one too if they do. if only i could convince the cauldron that the fang and the tempest are bad then i can finish collecting hero mechs and have mc left over to start collecting the legendaries i didnt feel were worth 15 bucks despite the goodies.

bloody headshots are also going to be fun.

also decked conquest is back.

Edited by LordNothing, Yesterday, 05:04 PM.

[Valdarion Silarius]

I wonder why the Cauldron hates the Stone Rhino so much. Did it really need another nerf?

Clan ERLL's are a odd one as it seems like they are trying to make cERLL's run cooler while giving more overheat penalties, when the issues are still the heat efficiency of clan double heatsinks. Seems like a band aid fix tbh.

I like the main clan/IS gauss rifle changes, but gauss rifle charge up time still needs to be removed completely and reverted back to it's old longer charge up time.

We also need the 1st penalty for being dropped out of matches during QP matches to be removed as well. Change the penalty for the second disconnection. Seeing more and more people being disconnected at the start of QP matches, myself included.

[w0qj]

Many thanks for the Feb patch preview, and especially for the Fire Moth quirks preview!!

[GreyNovember]

Why isn't the Firemoth allowed the same level of acceleration, but top speed is fine?

Was there an actual problem if it started to move back and forth too often?

[TheMadTypist]

I'm intrigued by the activity with Conquest, and I'm pleased that they're testing in event queues. Perhaps game-mode research for a potential MWO-2 default game-mode?

[Moadebe]

GreyNovember, on 03 February 2025 - 09:07 PM, said:

Why isn't the Firemoth allowed the same level of acceleration, but top speed is fine?

Was there an actual problem if it started to move back and forth too often?

This was actually addressed almost two months ago. I will post here what I edited into the Leaks post. I simply forgot to add it since this info was released in December.

Dated 12/13/2024 Via Leaks channel in the Cauldron Feedback Discord
Posted by Tiyos

Since this question will be asked a million times.
"In the past you said the Fire Moth would break MWO, why are you releasing it now PGIMan?"

You might remember the week of super speed event queues we did around 4 months back. This was operating as a test to see exactly where things started to break down. One thing we learned was that the real offender against hitreg was more acceleration and deceleration rather than just top speed. The Fire Moth will move 209 kph with full skills + MASC engaged, but it won't have the full mobility you would expect of a 20 tonner(more akin to a Mist Lynx rather than a Locust or Flea). The Fire Moth will also gain a reduced acceleration/deceleration bonus from its MASC. This doesn't mean the mech has no maneuverability, just slightly less than your average 20 tonner. Instead, it will make up for it with its massive top speed.

Sorry about forgetting that bit of info.

TLDR: accel/decel causes game to go wonky if its too much. Not top speed. So has to be reigned in to prevent problems with spaghetti code.

TheMadTypist, on 03 February 2025 - 09:57 PM, said:

I'm intrigued by the activity with Conquest, and I'm pleased that they're testing in event queues. Perhaps game-mode research for a potential MWO-2 default game-mode?

Nothing to do with MWO2.

If you have a conquest match with drop decks it usually ends before you get through half of your drop deck. At least thats been my experience in the past.

Edited by Moadebe, Yesterday, 10:18 PM.

[w0qj]

+1
Increasing the engine top speed also increases the acceleration/deceleration of the mech as well.
The Fire Moth massive top speed will give it great acceleration/deceleration already, even without the MASC kicking in.

Also, This is one of the few mechs with MASC and ECM for some of its variants

[BlueDevilspawn]

Top speed wasn't the issue. The unannounced light mechs/speed boost EQ was cauldron testing specific builds on live servers to test and mimic Fire Moth movement profiles. We were basically sync dropping against each other. This includes members who were on Oceanic servers to test higher ping.

Accel/decel with MASC active (standard stats) of a fully skilled speed-tweaked 20 tonner would've been problematic. Hence both the base accel/decel and the MASC itself were specially tuned. The Fire Moth's claim to fame will be speed, not Flea-like stutter stepping agility with MASC.

[aimlessnempty]

Why would they nerf the osiris and the COM-D03?
They didn't need those nerfs??

[1453 R]

I am a little confused over why the Osiris is getting the hammer. It was hardly a Paragon of Bustedness, even the best ones were mostly just decent. Is there something about the "Full Body Structure" quirk language I'm unaware of that compensates for the lost durability on a 'Mech that's already one of the least durable non-Piranhas in the game?

[Ttly]

Firemoth:
More hit point than the MASC Fleas (albeit in structure, generally closer to a Locust, in hit point count), but worse agility, 200kph, seems like large hitbox too.
-Prime: Like the SRM/LRM Locusts (3S and 1M) I guess, mostly the LRM Locust though since it has low hardpoint count/alpha from what I can tell.
-B: Ground-bound (and faster) MLX-A with ECM I guess?
-C: LRM Locust but even worse, bad quirk potency, no t.decay quirk, no energy hardpoint to stick a tag/erml with, etc.
-D: The FLE-17 clone, probably the most offensively powercreep variant in that regard.
-H: Simlar to the D.
-K: Closer to the MLX-G in firepower than the PIR-1 from what I can tell, except unlike the MLX-G, it actually has quirks.
-Aletheia (AL): Ground-bound MLX-C, so it'll probably need to expose (which it can afford to do unnoticed with ECM) aggressively just like how the MLX-C hops around to hit people with its ERLL I guess, though having its mobility comes in ground speed does let it hit people in the rear more than the MLX-C could I'd imagine.

-Conquest removed from QP:
Why? Everyone just plays it like Skirmish/Domination anyway, especially on small maps where capturing points doesn't matter. Unless that is the exact reason why it's getting removed because otherwise it's just free extra c-bills from a match which is a rather petty reason to remove a game mode where those band-aid capture speed quirks on mechs that someone gave up on balancing actually matters.

Weapon changes:
-ERLL rework:
Oh good, less heat, and the duration buff actually increased the laser's damage intensity even if it's in a very tiny amount and the total damage is nerfed, shorter cooldown is nice too.

Quirk changes:

-Clan Flea: Gee, you want to powercreep the R5K even more too?
-MASC Commando: I mean yeah, most people here can't really react to a 0.5s exposure I guess, but that doesn't make it an easy to play variant and seems unfair to nerf it as such when said alphas only do like 20ish damage and it's from a light that even if it can be run with standard engine, is still not *that* durable.
-Clan Commando: What, no missile ammo quirk to make up for it too while at it?
-KFX-G: It's a buff I guess? It's a welcome one, but it doesn't really change much for it.
-ADR-Warthog: Wow, someone complained about the APG Warthogs again or something? RIP L/HMG Warthogs, I guess.
-Osiris armor/structure nerf: Some actually good players figured out this thing is actually good and pulled its metric up, same deal with the MASC Commando, stupid nerf, maybe play with arm-lock off and don't run builds that only has weapons on the STs against these.
-ACW-1: Yeah wow, this thing totally needed to have its armor nerfed, a ground-bound SRMboat that already has no quirks otherwise needs to be nerfed, yep.
-BJ-1X: Not really going to change much, the HBK-4P for comparison runs a slightly hotter loadout already and it's still manageable, this thing runs a colder loadout in the first place compared to it.
-TBT-5J: Ooooh, someone figured out the BLC Kintaro with JJs can bite at stuff really hard I guess.

[1453 R]

The loss of Conquest in quick play is deeply sad. I know people meme on it, but they're idiots because Conquest is far and away the best game mode in MWO at the moment, and losing the ONLY game mode where speed/mobility matters in the slightest the same month the Fire Moth releases is really depressing. I'm a little confused why the ticket count can't be changed for Event Queue specifically?

[w0qj]

I'm looking forward to our Feb Patch!

Let's see the actual play feedback, and I'll trust that MWO will decide if the pendulum need to swung backwards a tad...

[Hawk819]

Any chance of adding hardpoints for the left torso for the Fire Moth?

[1453 R]

I severely doubt they'll bolt hardpoints on the Fire Moth. The 'Mech's already going to be polarizing, and given the existence of the H and K variants it's already got the loadouts everybody wants on small tiny 'Mechs like this.

I will say I'm quite looking forward to the little Fokker. It's sad we've lost the one game mode where its unrivaled ground mobility could've come in truly clutch, but supposedly we'll get it back in March, and even without Conquest to enjoy, Fire Moths will have nigh-unmatched ability to reposition around the map and engage where and as they will. It's honestly a shame single-weapon builds blow so much in MWO, a ghetto Echo variant with a single ATM-6 could've been a super fun harasser if a single ATM-6 was valid/viable in MWO. Eyeballing some HML standoff(ish) designs myself, since the 'Mech isn't really going to be the same kind of knife fighter the Piranha is. Depending on how much max armor is valuable on the design, a kibbitzed Prime could be fun. Drop the c-ERMLs to c-HSLs, bump the c-SRM-4 up to a 6, cut the ammo by half a ton because it gets two and a half missiles per missile, dump the rest into armor. Closer range than I like on a design so light and fragile, but fairly peppy for its size and takes reasonable advantage of the quirks. Hm.

[Moadebe]

For those bemoaning the loss of Conquest. While I agree it WOULD be a blow...please read the whole excerpt. It is purely for a month. Thats it. Its for testing some things out that might be beneficial in the long run.

Granted I was looking forward to being a pain in conquest with the fire moth...there is still assault. And AGAIN....its only for a Month yall. It will be fine.

Short term inconvenience = long term gain

[BlueDevilspawn]

Regarding Conquest being disabled in QP for the February patch (to be re-enabled in March).

As the devs have already leaked, this is specifically to allow for some special Conquest Event Queues to be made. Conquest EQ with drop decks is very unique in that movement is dynamic and fights over cap points are more desperate. This is partly due to the fact that home caps are now better protected by the spawn points and so backcapping becomes far more difficult. Therefore, speed and fighting over the other open points is far more important. Typical gameflow is much more seesaw.

The problem in the past is that EQ game modes are tied to QP values, and 750 tickets runs out quickly in a 4 mech drop deck situation. So, by raising the QP ticket count to 2000 we are able to enable a new format in EQ (and disabling it in QP temporarily).

[1453 R]

I do get that, and you're right - drop deck Conquest is a whole entire new way to play MWO. 2000-ticket Conquest with drop decks would honestly probably be the best choice if we had to do a "SINGLE WAY TO PLAY MWO FOREVER" mode. Some of the best matches I've had in 'modern' MWO were drop deck Event Queue Conquest, and I'm normally pretty sharply opposed to drop decks.

I mostly just worry that all the Domination-humping, light-'Mech-hating grognaks will get a month free of the specter of having to actually pay the penalty for their decision to pilot nothing but STD200 Annihilators and decide they refuse to go back, raise a ruckus until Conquest stays disabled. That and Event Queue is always a rare and ephemeral treat, and one you don't always get to play when it's the event you want to run because of things like work, sleep and life, whereas the QP queue is always there. A reduced Quick Play in favor of improved Event Queue isn't necessarily a win, and losing Conquest permanently due to Fatbro Jocks and their hatred of feet would majorly suck.

[BlueDevilspawn]

The Osiris is designed as the machine pistol / Uzi of mechs.... high max dps but low sustain and little survival. It's suppose to run in, drop a lot of hurt in 5 seconds, and run out or overheat/get zapped. In the hands of a good pilot and high level play (which is what we balance to) it's very strong.
The all body structure means all components get that structure which includes the REAR torsos. So, the net should be slightly higher survival on the torsos (2) but halved on the legs. As I just said the Osiris' survival depends on its agility/speed, you'll want to leg it.