83 replies to this topic

[Omigir]

Ok, I know there are going to be some of you who are going to freak out like a dingo just ate your baby, or an arrow just got shot into your knee, but relax and read before you post, or if you flat out don’t like it, just say so in a short one liner instead of trying to explain yourself because you didn’t actually read any of the OP.

Before I jump into it, NO: Mech Assault is not the first Battletech based game to appear on a console.

Mechwarrior 3 Did release on the Playstation as well as other Mechwarrior tittles that appeared on SNES. So this is not some new basterdized idea that was a onetime try resulting in the abortion that we all know as Mech Assault.

The other thing that helps explain where I am coming from is another eve reference, but only a mild one. Eve online is coming out with a FPS called Dust 514 which was designed as a supplement to the already existing Eve online universe. What this means, is the actions you do in Dust 514, do affect and interact with the players of Eve who are on the PC. So it would not be a split community. Originally Dust was meant for Xbox but due to CCP’s constant updates, Xbox ended up dropping the title and it was picked up by Playstation.

On top of this, Final fantasy XI was a single community as well. PC players played with Console gamers on the same servers. This is not an impossible suggestion.

In no way am I suggesting that MW:O come out as an exclusive Xbox only title, nor am I suggesting that it become a Pay to play game.

In no way would an xbox player have any advantage over a pc player, especially since mouse players are still on the PC and they will always have the advantage over Joystick players or controller players.

The advantages of an xbox release would be for those of us who can’t afford a new computer, but own an xbox, would be able to enjoy MW:O without fear of poor performance from our ****** computers. (I own a laptop that regularly over heats and shuts down on me even with a cooling pad. I have had it happen more often than not in EVE during PvP.

The only really bad thing I can see about this, would be the time and effort it would take to port the game, at that point I could see MW:O appearing in the xbox live arcade for download for something like $5 or less to help cover the cost of porting the game. Xbox also has a number of other controllers with a joystick being available for players who like joysticks.

It’s just an idea, Take it or leave it, I don’t really see any bad cons for the community other than someone assuming that xbox live community is immature, but at that same point, all online communities have that section and none are exclusively one way or the other in the gaming world as far as I have seen. People who prefer PC will still have their preferred game as well as their joystick (depending on built in support, I know they can’t take in to account everything.)

[MuffinTop]

Get a rope and grab your pitchforks and join me and the rest of the mob in citysquare !

Edited by MuffinTop, 08 January 2012 - 04:53 PM.

[VYCanis]

not too keen on that idea for the simple reason that the controls and complexity would have to be severely nerfed.

and not in the sensitivity sense, i mean the quantity sense.

off the top of my head..

accelerate, decelerate
turn
twist
fire present group
fire groups 2 to whatever
manage firegroups
jump jet
eject
cycle targets
zoom in
power down
overide shutdown
any sort of order/command functions
dump ammo (if there are ammo explosions)
passive radar/active radar
crouch
potentially a melee function
potential ammo switching
controls managing potential countermeasures
chainfire/groupfire
coolant flush (don't hate me)

Edited by VYCanis, 08 January 2012 - 04:55 PM.

[Omigir]

These things have already been delt with in a port for Mechwarrior 3 from PC to Playstation.

Also: http://www.amazon.co...26071189&sr=8-6

Edited by Omigir, 08 January 2012 - 05:07 PM.

[ItzDean]

VYCanis, on 08 January 2012 - 04:52 PM, said:

controls and complexity would have to be severely nerfed.

Smart man right here. That is also one of the reasons why this kind of series works really well on PC. I honestly can say that I love the ability for all this customization when it comes to controls. Your in control of a mech not a bicycle as fun as that sounds. >.<

[Stahlseele]

It's also why we assemble lynch mobs when this thematic comes up.
Because console compatibility means it's much less fun to play in PC.

[Omigir]

stahlseele, on 08 January 2012 - 05:21 PM, said:

It's also why we assemble lynch mobs when this thematic comes up.
Because console compatibility means it's much less fun to play in PC.

Ok here is something im not getting, clearly. If this is ture, Mechwarrior 3 would have sucked. Yes, Mechwarrior 3 came out on PC first, but mechwarrior 3 was still mechwarrior 3 on the playstation.

Ontop of that, why would they have to nurf anything? They wouldnt, there already is a very good and complicated joystick for the xbox, seein link i posted a post or two up. So where does the nerf come in? For the regular controller? I already use a regular controller on my pc for mech games. Yeah, i have to customize the **** out of my controls but how does that effect any one else?

xbox joystick vs side winder, im betting there are not very many difrances.

[Stahlseele]

Now remember, we got MW3. And Pirates Moon.
And i think some years later they went and made MW3 for the PS3.
So by then it was a no-issue.
But nowadays?
Nowadays, games are coded with this in mind and thus we get nerfed games.
Because back then, renmaking parts of a game was not as bad as it seems to be today somehow . .
Mouse and Keyboard. < = those are the main controller for most PC-Gamers for a reason.
Remapability, 100% customizationable to 111 Buttons on Mouse and Keyboard.
Also, usually the Graphics-Settings get nerfed to hell and back, because consoles can't handle the kind of stuff people like me like to throw at their games and computers . .
Furthermore, the menue-layout usually sucks, because it has to be doable with a controller.

IF these things were NOT the case, then **** yeah, go ahead, give me easy targets to shoot because of their inferior graphics and controls and customization ability.
BUT TODAY nobody DOES code like that anymore, because that's negative cash flow right there.
TODAY PC-Gamers get castrated and dumbed down games so console people can play our games because appearantly, you just can't make any money with PC-Gamers, because 90% of us are going to pirate **** anyway.
Which, in the case of F2P, should never, ever factor into things.
And if it, indeed, does NOT factor into things?
Then making it console compatible first just means saved cash and thus more profit.
Cheap. Fast. Good.
CHOSE TWO!

[Omigir]

PGI seems determined to give all three, Cheep, Fast, and Good.

Side note, not a big issue, but MW3 apeared on the orignal playstation before PS3.

and finaly, games dont get nurfed becuase consoles are incapable, its becuase people let them be. Graphics wise a PS3 can keep up with most PC's, and a PC in the same price range as a PS3 is infioror graphics wise.

There is no reason to nerf a game, esepcialy if its made on PC first then ported to a console. Xbox wont run on max graphics settings as many of your top of the line 2 or 3 thousand dollar custom computers, but that does not mean a PC verson the game is restricted to xbox graphics.

as far as controlls go? I say again, Xbox joystick = pc joystick.
ontop of this I regularly use a game controller for the xbox on my PC because it suites me, i dont need 111 buttons to do the same thing as as sone one with a joystick.

I will agree with one point though, when a game is made for console, they tend to be limited customization, not becuase the machine cant handle it, its becuase that is not what the game has in mind. They plan for one or two difrent controllers because that is all they have to do. So i can see how you would think 'nerfed' but really its not putting more into than they have to.

[Omigir]

In a way to clerify myself I really posted this here to see if there were any real game stoppers.

I think that if it has been done before with little to no issues, that that same 'success' could be replicated. In the case of MW3, it was the same MW3 on pc, it just showed up on PS1 difrent controlls to sutie the PS1 controller. That is why I brought up Dust as well as FFXI becuase of how they made console and pc server interactions possible.

[Volume]

FAQ says that they have no plans to bring this to any other platform.

First off, Steel Battalion was a Xbox exclusive, and it had the most beastly awesome control scheme I've ever seen in a 'Mech game. Look at the controller below (if you want to call a set of 2 joysticks, tons of buttons and rudder pedals a "controller").





Link to actual measurements: http://www.steelbatt...eController.gif

Yes, it is 34.65 inches across, I am not kidding. You used every single one of those buttons. As a matter of fact, if you didn't flip up the glass enclosure and pound on the eject button top right, the game would delete your save if you died before ejecting. At the start of every mission, you booted up your 'Mech by flipping switches and pushing buttons in a specific order, sort of like a flight control start-up. I remember at some point you actually had to turn on the windshield wipers to get rain/water off your 'Mech, lol. Seriously though, all the functions were there, zooming, targeting, everything. It was amazing.

So. Obviously building a controller specifically for a 'Mech game is expensive, and would drive up the price of a game, and would be completely impossible/unfeasible for a free to play, digitally distributed minimum viable product.

That said, if this game works, you'd bet your can of beer that you call a 'Mech that they'd bring MechWarrior back, maybe on multiple platforms, maybe with support for joysticks/pedals/control-consoles. Maybe not something as ridiculous (and awesome) as Steel Battalion, but still.

My point is 1: A console can have the control schemes that a PC has, but 2: It's not coming out on Xbox, lol.

If it was to come out on the Xbox, obviously it can't be packaged with "correct" controllers, but if they managed to adapt the controls to a dual-stick controller, they could at least put it on the XBLA or PSN or something (more likely the PSN considering how content updates work on XBLA, ie, not so well.) Still, the in-game cash shop isn't something Microsoft can make money on, so again, it is highly unlikely that his game will come out on anything but PC, and honestly, the way I see it, it couldn't come out on anything but PC at this point.

Yes, I've played Mechwarrior for the SNES, I've played Battletech for the Genesis, MechAss wasn't the first "Console" battletech game...It's just that 1: against other players, you can't expect a dual-stick player to control/handle the game as well as a keyboard/mouse or USB joystick player (I know on a PS3 and even a 360 you can use a keyboard and mouse, PS3 you can just plug in AFAIK, 360 I think you need an adapter), but you can't expect players to have/purchase these things.

So, to recap, all I mean is the following:
1: Game-specific controllers are possible, or at least use of a Logitech/Saitek flight system
2: Dual-stick controllers are sub-optimal for an in-depth 'Mech game, but I'm sure that it could work, and other controllers could work better
3: MWO is, at this time, planned to be PC-only (source)
4: CryEngine 3 can be scaled down more than the first two, and would work fine on a console, but its true potential for high-fidelity images would only be brought to fruition on a PC.
5: Just because FFXI, Dust514, Shadowrun, Quake 3, whatever, can all be played on a console as well as a PC at the same time doesn't mean that cross-platform works well, or is fair, or balanced, or even feasible.
6: XBLA/PSN/WiiWare (there you go, control 'Mechs with your Wiimote, what has this world come to) do not have much support for Free-to-play games, and if MWO was going to be working with any distributor for this F2P, it would be most likely be Steam, which AFAIK only runs on PC, Mac, and PS3 at the moment.

Edited by Volume, 08 January 2012 - 07:37 PM.

[Gattling Fenn]

Did he just say that the mouse is superior to the joystick for MechWarriors? Uhm... WHAT?!

[MuffinTop]

Gattling Fenn, on 08 January 2012 - 07:56 PM, said:

Did he just say that the mouse is superior to the joystick for MechWarriors? Uhm... WHAT?!

Who is willing to buy a joystick from NASA or the military industrial complex? I'm sure as hell not onboard with that idea!

[Nking]

Please do PC only, Unless of course its possible to make it PC orientated FIRST, then dumb it down for console players for simplified controls.. just don't combine PC and console players on the same server.
Just about every new game I have played feels like I am playing a console game ported to PC. I CANT STAND THIS!!!

[Tannhauser Gate]

Solution = Put all the PC people in battlemechs. Make all the console players infantry. Done.

[Omigir]

Yes, Yes I said that for PC games, a mouse is supiror to a Joy stick or game console. The simple dynamics of drag and click. What you personaly find easy or prefriable are fine, but keepnig a mouse pointer on target vice a joystick or game controller is infanetly more feasable and more intune to hand eye coordination. n___n

Volume, Thank you for a very indepth and good look at hte concept ; p I think you are the first person I have seen who didnt stop half way through and throw a post out! Thank you!

Lakedaemon: Or put them battle armor.

Not that this will actualy happen, or any time soon but its in the realm of 'doable.'

Edited by Omigir, 08 January 2012 - 08:15 PM.

[MuffinTop]

Omigir I read your entire post, and I'm sorry for my kneejerk response earlier. I look forward to dusting off my Saitek SD290 Pro for some carnage later this year ,and I hope you don't have anything military surplus connected to your computer.

Edited by MuffinTop, 08 January 2012 - 08:26 PM.

[Omigir]

MuffinTop, on 08 January 2012 - 08:25 PM, said:

Omigir I read your entire post, and I'm sorry for my kneejerk response earlier. I look forward to dusting off my Saitek SD290 Pro for some carnage later this year ,and I hope you don't have anything military surplus connected to your computer.

what? I didnt think it was knee ****, i didnt really think anything was wrong with your post.

But no, I suck with a joystick so I will probably be using an xbox controller or just good ol mouse nad key board..

[WerewolfX]

Omigir, on 08 January 2012 - 04:31 PM, said:

Ok, I know there are going to be some of you who are going to freak out like a dingo just ate your baby, or an arrow just got shot into your knee, but relax and read before you post, or if you flat out don’t like it, just say so in a short one liner instead of trying to explain yourself because you didn’t actually read any of the OP.

Before I jump into it, NO: Mech Assault is not the first Battletech based game to appear on a console.

Mechwarrior 3 Did release on the Playstation as well as other Mechwarrior tittles that appeared on SNES. So this is not some new basterdized idea that was a onetime try resulting in the abortion that we all know as Mech Assault.

The other thing that helps explain where I am coming from is another eve reference, but only a mild one. Eve online is coming out with a FPS called Dust 514 which was designed as a supplement to the already existing Eve online universe. What this means, is the actions you do in Dust 514, do affect and interact with the players of Eve who are on the PC. So it would not be a split community. Originally Dust was meant for Xbox but due to CCP’s constant updates, Xbox ended up dropping the title and it was picked up by Playstation.

On top of this, Final fantasy XI was a single community as well. PC players played with Console gamers on the same servers. This is not an impossible suggestion.

In no way am I suggesting that MW:O come out as an exclusive Xbox only title, nor am I suggesting that it become a Pay to play game.

In no way would an xbox player have any advantage over a pc player, especially since mouse players are still on the PC and they will always have the advantage over Joystick players or controller players.

The advantages of an xbox release would be for those of us who can’t afford a new computer, but own an xbox, would be able to enjoy MW:O without fear of poor performance from our ****** computers. (I own a laptop that regularly over heats and shuts down on me even with a cooling pad. I have had it happen more often than not in EVE during PvP.

The only really bad thing I can see about this, would be the time and effort it would take to port the game, at that point I could see MW:O appearing in the xbox live arcade for download for something like $5 or less to help cover the cost of porting the game. Xbox also has a number of other controllers with a joystick being available for players who like joysticks.

It’s just an idea, Take it or leave it, I don’t really see any bad cons for the community other than someone assuming that xbox live community is immature, but at that same point, all online communities have that section and none are exclusively one way or the other in the gaming world as far as I have seen. People who prefer PC will still have their preferred game as well as their joystick (depending on built in support, I know they can’t take in to account everything.)

Small correction that was MW2 on the playstation.

[Thorn Hallis]

Is there any example for a multiplayer-only game on consoles?

Edited by Thorn Hallis, 09 January 2012 - 04:04 AM.