483 replies to this topic

[Fastred]

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 July 2012 - 03:44 PM, said:

Wow, serious thread necromancy.

But seriously. Why would you NOT want hands on your mech? First of all, it makes sense for controlling it. Second of all, all Battletech combat is performed at danger-close ranges, which means you're going to be up in someone's grill, which means PUNCHING. Even better, when you rip/blast the other guy's leg/arm off, you can pick it up and BEAT HIM WITH IT. Third, if you're just going to roll around and shoot ****, drive a tank. Flipping people off with your walking tank? BRILLIANT!

Man, I could go on.

"You sir I like how you think!"

Popgun, on 03 July 2012 - 05:48 PM, said:

Gundam premiered in '79 if you want to get all technical. And yeah, Lucas went after them legally. Personally I love the look the designers of this game settled on. While the original artwork is nostalgically lovable for its blockiness it's also something that's going to only appeal to a vocal minority of sperglords.

I would like to see the numbers that back your claim of the apposing view being in the minority.

[Sarouter]

I have always been a big fan of Gundam and a few of the new mechs do resemble their design, but frankly that's because Gundam has influenced all Mecha. If you read the history of Battletech the publishers go into to trouble for copying designs from Macross.

You mite not like Gundam and its Japanese brethren, but they did and still influence Mecha.

The new Mechwarrior designs are much more realistic and militaristic then past designs. If such a vehicle could be produced it would look much more like Mechwarrior Mech then a Gundam.

Personally I love to see someone make a video of a lance of Mechs tearing up those at times crazy Japanese robots.

Give the developers time in getting more mech's out there. I am pretty happy so far with the results so that is why I am really looking forward to the release.

[Bobfrombobtown]

Is this another thread of, "I has the sad because no Timber Wolf."

[Bishop Steiner]

WhirlpoolBrewer, on 27 January 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

I've been playing the computer games since Mech Warrior 2, and I have always preferred mechs that don't remind me of gundams... like alomst every inner sphere mech does. I prefer the war simulation side of it all, not the arcade Mech Assault meets Gundamwing thing that most inner sphere mechs scream. Nobody can claim that they want Mech Warrior to be more sim than Mech Assault was and like mechs with hands. For pete sake the last mech to come out had a Mohawk. It looks like instead of shooting me, he is going to pull a guitar out and play heavy metal rock.

There are respectable Inner Sphere mechs out there that I'm praying they come out with. I'm happy to hear about the catapult, and I really hope they put the uziel in as well. There are acceptable mechs on the Inner Sphere side, but whenever a mech with hands comes out everyone just gets all excited about it, and my hope for a good mech warrior game drops a little more.

Don't get me wrong I still plan on playing it, specially when Clan mechs become available, but until then its just a little depressing. Heres to hoping for less 50 ton jokes and more 50 ton machines of war.

No offense, but your reasoning seems flawed. Why shouldn't mechs have hands? I suggest your problem is that the only exposure to Mechwarrior is through the video games, and their rather narrow combat focus. Hands allow one to pick up and take items during fast objective raids (like parts and ammo), allow you to grab nearby objects to use as weapons when your ammo is expended. Make it easier to get up when knocked down (without, you know, lodging a rock in the PPC barrel where your hand might be) and many other things.

If Mechwarrior Online is trying to become a true sim of the Battletech universe, and not just Mechwarrior 5, (or those idiotic Mech Assault games) they need to make missions and contracts where the hands get used. I'm hoping they do fans of the REAL Battletech game a solid and continue with what they started.

And don't look for that Uziel too soon. They came into production around 3063, and it's just now 3049. I'm really tired of people basing all their expectations for this game off MW4, which was a pale shadow of Battletech.

[Adrienne Vorton]

i gotta say i mostly hate the "gundam-ish" or whatever mechs - like the old wasp f.e. - as well... but i don´t see any mech here, that hits my brain with terror... most of the mechs here look like warmachines, the way i prefere my battlemechs (in BT/ MW, cause there is a difference between "japanese mecha" and Battletech in my head... but i can only speak for myself^^)

i´m pretty fine with the designs in MWO, even if i´d never touch the commando... just LOVING the new Catapult, looks just great...
i´d be so goddam curious about how these guys would design the bushwacker ...

Edited by Adrienne Vorton, 03 July 2012 - 10:55 PM.

[Elkarlo]

One Reason most younger MW2/3/4 players don't realize:
Without Handactuators there won't be any MW game.

Handactuators let a Battletech Manipulate Objects, and with this, a lot of cool Storytelling was possible.
How many Mech's were salvaged and Field repaired by Handactuators Mechs in the Novells?
I can remember about 20 at least...
How often were the Hands used for going through Jungle standing up loot Carrying Ammunition, about 3-4 Times.
In most non Military campaing book the Hands came into play. So we would have had lot of less Sidestories.
So the BT univers would have a less Coloutfull Novells and the SuccessfullNovells are one of the Reason's MW made it so sucessfully into the Computermarket. Because the Novells were Cool and suddenly you could play Scenarios out of the Books.

So let the Hands in, there are one of the most important parts, and even the Clans let them in.
Mech's without Arms and Hands were often Handycapped in the Novells, and disliked by the Authors.
Simply because it's way cooler to shoot each other then Brawl and ripp some Parts out of each other
then only doing Pew pew pew Dead. Or which Mech will get more attention the Warhammer in a group or the
thunderbolt which grab the Arm of the Comrade which was shooten of and take it along when they retreat, only to reattach the Arm again.
Not the Warhammer which gave the important Firecover saved the day, but the Thunderbolt with his TWO HANDS.

But this is Novell Stuff, not video game stuff, unless the Producer implement the "P" Key for straight forward Push/Melee Weapon attack.

So let us have the Hands even when they are useless in Videogames.
They made Battletech for us Cool. And in some poeples imagination a Atlas use his 20 Tons lift capacity to grab a Locust and bowl it into the attacking other Mechs.

[Feindfeuer]

Though i'm not a fan of the novels* i agree with Elkarlo, the Hands are an integral part of the BT lore. They come in handy for all kinds of duties outside the battlefield and though that would probably also work with a more 'primitive' claw setup, i always felt the human hand (and human shape in general) would work better with feedback info of the neuro-helmet used by mechwarriors.
On the other hand, the non-human designed mechs are just as awful designed as the human ones. With glaring weakspots, unneeded arms, shottraps, etc... so it's not like they are superior in design to the hand-equipped, human forms in any way but in 'looking cooler' to some people. They don't offer the higher simulation factor... they too are just magic space-robots firing colored magic-beams at each other at laughable short ranges. But that is great, cause that is fun.

There are also quiet a few 'unseen' designs without Hands... meaning 1:1 copies of japanese anime/manga designs. So the whole gundam/anime QQ is pretty questionable anyway... especially since the gundam series itself features quiet a lot handless, 'sim' designs... which are still of questionable efficiency, as the whole concept of mechs only works cause the author/writer wants them to work.

Nobody forces you to fight in a magic space-robot with hands. But if you don't like them, battletech might be the wrong fictional universe for you.


* I just can't read game-based fiction, it always feels like reading a novelization of 80's cartoon, no matter if it's BT, 40K, shadowrun or a modern videogame.

[HybridTheory]

WhirlpoolBrewer, on 27 January 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

I've been playing the computer games since Mech Warrior 2, and I have always preferred mechs that don't remind me of gundams... like alomst every inner sphere mech does. I prefer the war simulation side of it all, not the arcade Mech Assault meets Gundamwing thing that most inner sphere mechs scream. Nobody can claim that they want Mech Warrior to be more sim than Mech Assault was and like mechs with hands. For pete sake the last mech to come out had a Mohawk. It looks like instead of shooting me, he is going to pull a guitar out and play heavy metal rock.

There are respectable Inner Sphere mechs out there that I'm praying they come out with. I'm happy to hear about the catapult, and I really hope they put the uziel in as well. There are acceptable mechs on the Inner Sphere side, but whenever a mech with hands comes out everyone just gets all excited about it, and my hope for a good mech warrior game drops a little more.

Don't get me wrong I still plan on playing it, specially when Clan mechs become available, but until then its just a little depressing. Heres to hoping for less 50 ton jokes and more 50 ton machines of war.

haters gonna hate...

That said I'm looking forward to a Nova... or Black Hawk KU whichever I can get my greedy hands on

[Jumbik]

I did not like mechs with hands until I've read few Battletech books where you get to see for what reason they have them. Even though it may look silly on the drawing, and let be honest a lot of draws from the earlier days are fugly, the hands are there for a reason and if we will see any melee in this game...

then do not forget that there are Mechwarriors who has seen the Atlas lifting lighter mech in the air and tossing it away.

[CTsai]

WhirlpoolBrewer, on 27 January 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

I've been playing the computer games since Mech Warrior 2, and I have always preferred mechs that don't remind me of gundams... like alomst every inner sphere mech does. I prefer the war simulation side of it all, not the arcade Mech Assault meets Gundamwing thing that most inner sphere mechs scream. Nobody can claim that they want Mech Warrior to be more sim than Mech Assault was and like mechs with hands. For pete sake the last mech to come out had a Mohawk. It looks like instead of shooting me, he is going to pull a guitar out and play heavy metal rock.

There are respectable Inner Sphere mechs out there that I'm praying they come out with. I'm happy to hear about the catapult, and I really hope they put the uziel in as well. There are acceptable mechs on the Inner Sphere side, but whenever a mech with hands comes out everyone just gets all excited about it, and my hope for a good mech warrior game drops a little more.

Don't get me wrong I still plan on playing it, specially when Clan mechs become available, but until then its just a little depressing. Heres to hoping for less 50 ton jokes and more 50 ton machines of war.

Bro, bro, brochacho, no. Like, just no bro.
Gundam-like mech? Have you EVER watch an episode, ANY episode of gundam?
The only mechs that are remotely Japanese influenced are prbly the unseen land-air mechs
Sure a few mechs in this game are a bit too humanoid-looking, but gundam? Like, bro *** have you been smoking???

[Aeryk Corsaer]

Please remember many light and medium 'Mechs were used for garrison duty and doubled duty in emergencies like our National Guard in the US. The humanoid look and the functional hands allowed them to "not" be scary or alien looking (had a familiarity to it) and be more capable of helping in disasters with their hands. Some history-fluff also reflects this way of thinking in the TRO and other resources but I do not have access to mine now.

[Diomed]

I'm with the OP on this one. I don't like the anthropomorphic mechs. I like the hammer, the madcat, the vulture.

[Adm Awesome]

It's preferance really... it's why people want to make cyborgs that look like humans. In our image, humans are the superior species, so why wouldn't some people want to make their battle mechs look humanoid? It's more of a psychological thing than anything else. Plus I have to be honest that a mech with hands is a lot more versatile than the others, especially with a humanoid form. Something like the commando not only can fight in battle, but in between battle they can help move heavy cargo, or help move destroyed mechs off the battlefield and plenty of others things that are harder to do if not impossible without actual hands, and more importantly, the anatomy similar to a human body.

because really, hands won't help you out if they're tiny and in the most retarded place like this

Edited by Adm Awesome, 08 July 2012 - 02:27 PM.

[Evil Ash]

The mech choices only get as depressing as you see them. Truthfully the game looks the best it has ever been. (No i'm not talking about graphics, that's a no brainer tards.) With a promise to get more and more mechs added is going to add variety every month or so. Also the game isn't coming out for realz for a while, plenty more Battlemech #'s to go!

Adm Awesome, on 08 July 2012 - 02:25 PM, said:

because really, hands won't help you out if they're tiny and in the most retarded place like this

Those hands are perfect shot glass size.

[Lightdragon]

WhirlpoolBrewer, on 27 January 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

I've been playing the computer games since Mech Warrior 2, and I have always preferred mechs that don't remind me of gundams... like alomst every inner sphere mech does. I prefer the war simulation side of it all, not the arcade Mech Assault meets Gundamwing thing that most inner sphere mechs scream. Nobody can claim that they want Mech Warrior to be more sim than Mech Assault was and like mechs with hands. For pete sake the last mech to come out had a Mohawk. It looks like instead of shooting me, he is going to pull a guitar out and play heavy metal rock.

There are respectable Inner Sphere mechs out there that I'm praying they come out with. I'm happy to hear about the catapult, and I really hope they put the uziel in as well. There are acceptable mechs on the Inner Sphere side, but whenever a mech with hands comes out everyone just gets all excited about it, and my hope for a good mech warrior game drops a little more.

Don't get me wrong I still plan on playing it, specially when Clan mechs become available, but until then its just a little depressing. Heres to hoping for less 50 ton jokes and more 50 ton machines of war.

thats not a mohawk thats a garret d2j tracking system comes standard with rifleman and jagermech one of the best off the shelf systems for a battlemech in that era

[Knight2pwn]

BRING ON THE LAM's!

[PewPew2]

Lightdragon, on 08 July 2012 - 03:10 PM, said:

thats not a mohawk thats a garret d2j tracking system comes standard with rifleman and jagermech one of the best off the shelf systems for a battlemech in that era

Might wanna check the date when he wrote that post. He's talking about the centurion back in January.

[Erwiin]

Diomed, on 08 July 2012 - 02:25 PM, said:

I'm with the OP on this one. I don't like the anthropomorphic mechs. I like the hammer, the madcat, the vulture.

Just to get pedantic... The Hammer is an anthropomorphic 'Mech...

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Patience my friends they are adding new Mechs, as many as they can. I'm sure that eventually they will actually hit one you like. But I'm not sure the Uziel is on the menu though as Sarnet mentions this Mech around 3069-3070. It doesn't say exactly when it was invented or used but it doesn't mention it any sooner than then so I have no idea if it fits the timeline or not. Maybe someone with more MechWarrior knowledge can clarify.

Knight2pwn, on 08 July 2012 - 04:03 PM, said:

BRING ON THE LAM's!

NO.

[Buck Rogers]

I was going to type more, but I can sum up my thoughts on some of these arguments with these two statements:

I like humanoid 'mechs just as much as the chicken walkers.

Someone who thinks hands on 'mechs and physical attacks are not important to the Battletech universe is a doodiefondler .