79 replies to this topic

[Aaron DeChavilier]

1) Not true, and depends on actual clan implemenatation.
2) So? Devs would find a way to do it.
3) Done by player groups and self-policed, again not a problem
4) Personal preference, man
5) Imagine MWO as an ‘instance’ of the fiction, it will work
6) Personal preference
7) Who knows how CC will be done?
8) This is a universal bone that everyone is picking
9) Self-policed, maybe honor point deficits.

you are showing the same problem that many here are having: understanding that the video game is not a 1:1 translation of canon. No game ever could be. If the IS side of this game isn’t following canon 100% (which it isn’t) then why do the clans? Why can’t the canon be improved upon and changed to make the game a more fun experience?

Jaroth Winson, on 15 February 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

Why people should read the lore..............or risk making foolish posts.

Oh so you’re draft is sanctified but this guy isn’t, he’s a fool?

Jaroth Winson, on 15 February 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

Again this is something we accept. If you do not want to have constant Trials & wish to be promoted by time served, bribery or nepotism feel free to stay IS.

Or you learn to temper your expectations, and understand that many clan players aren’t like you, and don’t mind. Or maybe let player groups represent clans and manage themselves.

Jaroth Winson, on 15 February 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

This is like StarCraft. The Clans are the Protoss:

Mmmm no. you see, the Protoss in Starcraft is an actual balanced faction in a game, the clans are just power gaming laid bare. Blizzard took the time to make sure that each faction was balanced and powerful in different ways.

Jaroth Winson, on 15 February 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

The IS are like the Terrans:

False, cause if that were the case, then the ‘clans’ would just be a super powered terran faction. If clans were protoss, they would have shields, alien tech, etc. More like IS is the Imperial guard, and the Clans are Space Marines.

Jaroth Winson, on 15 February 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

The game will be balanced out.

I know it will, but it may not balance in way many people in the clan forums would find tolerable.

Jaroth Winson, on 15 February 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

As I said before you CHOOSE the faction you want & accept BOTH the advantages & disadvantages they bring. The Clans bring better tech but will have limited numbers & combat restrictions. The IS will have inferior tech but will field more troops & have hardly or no restrictions in combat.

So accept the reasons why some people would choose clans – the fancy power gaming toys.

[Maurice]

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

Why Clan Players Won't Work....or be too complex.


Attention, Freebirths

Seeing as MWO attempts to stick to cannon and chronology, players being able to play as the Clans would throw a serious wrench into things.

1) Only 25 players may have a certain bloodname at a time. These name rules go hand in hand with having faction names being unusable by players.

2) Clan on clan fighting would have to follow the clan rules of Zellbrigen. Players who violate these rules would suffer recieve serious punishment.

3) Clan trials of combat would be the only way to advance through the clan ranks.

4) Clanners do not speak using contractions and have their own dialect which (i assume) few new MWO players would understand.

5) Because MWO devs will be keeping certain planets from being player controled in order to advance the timeline according to cannon, having player controled clans occupying planets in clan versus IS and clan on clan fighting would become very complex.

6) Clan alliances, friendships, and rivalries are convolluted at best and this could cause certain clan alliances to be unbalanced in power in the actual game.

7) Clanners do not use their mechs in physical attacks unless all other possibilites for continuing combat are gone.

8) Clan tech and omnimechs would be superior to all IS tech.

9) When fighting the IS, the clans might not always follow Zellbrigen but still maintain a certain set of tactics which MWO players might fail to adhere to.

As much as I would like to play a Clanner I think implementing clan players may be more trouble than it is worth. Lets just hope we can salvage their awesome clan mechs. Anyone who still thinks Clans would work in this game is a stravag, quiaff?

Neg

[Gremlich Johns]

@Bebo, your line in your OP: "Seeing as MWO attempts to stick to cannon and chronology"

a gentle reminder.....The proper spelling for the word you used is canon, not cannon.

One is related to rules/principles, the other (usually) for launching BIG bullets.

Edited by Gremlich Johns, 15 February 2012 - 06:09 PM.

[KaiserSoze]

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

Why Clan Players Won't Work....or be too complex.


Attention, Freebirths

Seeing as MWO attempts to stick to cannon and chronology, players being able to play as the Clans would throw a serious wrench into things.

1) Only 25 players may have a certain bloodname at a time. These name rules go hand in hand with having faction names being unusable by players.

2) Clan on clan fighting would have to follow the clan rules of Zellbrigen. Players who violate these rules would suffer recieve serious punishment.

3) Clan trials of combat would be the only way to advance through the clan ranks.

4) Clanners do not speak using contractions and have their own dialect which (i assume) few new MWO players would understand.

5) Because MWO devs will be keeping certain planets from being player controled in order to advance the timeline according to cannon, having player controled clans occupying planets in clan versus IS and clan on clan fighting would become very complex.

6) Clan alliances, friendships, and rivalries are convolluted at best and this could cause certain clan alliances to be unbalanced in power in the actual game.

7) Clanners do not use their mechs in physical attacks unless all other possibilites for continuing combat are gone.

8) Clan tech and omnimechs would be superior to all IS tech.

9) When fighting the IS, the clans might not always follow Zellbrigen but still maintain a certain set of tactics which MWO players might fail to adhere to.

As much as I would like to play a Clanner I think implementing clan players may be more trouble than it is worth. Lets just hope we can salvage their awesome clan mechs. Anyone who still thinks Clans would work in this game is a stravag, quiaff?

I approve of this message KAISERSOZE for president!!!!!!

[Alaric Wolf Kerensky]

While I would prefer sticking to canon as closely as possible while retaining balance, if the only way for me to be in the Clans is to have them be equivalent to IS 'Mechs to-for-ton, I am fine with that. I simply love the Clans for the lore, and they are the only factions that I can personally relate to. The houses do not interest me much at all. Telling die-hard Clanners that they cannot be in the Clans would be like telling someone who loves Steiner that House Steiner is off-limits and they should go join House Kurita. It is simply ridiculous.

Edited by Alaric Wolf Kerensky, 29 February 2012 - 07:39 PM.

[Odins Reaver]

I would say go with the 10vs12 thing for the clan warriors rather than the ton for ton option. As for the bloodnames why not have 250 per bloodname? That is roughly 10,000 open slots, and a bloodname would not be a requirement for most people anyway as I do wish to see a clan military structure in place with Star Captain being the highest rank almost everyone can get without a bloodname and a trial of Position. This is my idea for a compromise with both lore and this being a MMOSWG (Massively Multiplayer Online Simulation War Game).

[Stormwolf]

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

Why Clan Players Won't Work....or be too complex.


Attention, Freebirths

Seeing as MWO attempts to stick to cannon and chronology, players being able to play as the Clans would throw a serious wrench into things.

No it won't.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

1) Only 25 players may have a certain bloodname at a time. These name rules go hand in hand with having faction names being unusable by players.

1000 bloodnames for each Clan, I doubt that we'll have 7000+ Clan players within the next three years. And besides, the munchkins wouldn't care about bloodnames since they'd hold no meaning for them.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

2) Clan on clan fighting would have to follow the clan rules of Zellbrigen. Players who violate these rules would suffer recieve serious punishment.

They are already working on a system that rewards honorable combat.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

3) Clan trials of combat would be the only way to advance through the clan ranks.

Wrong, many Clan warriors get field commendations after the initial trial of position.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

4) Clanners do not speak using contractions and have their own dialect which (i assume) few new MWO players would understand.

I think that we will be able to turn a blind eye here since a lot of players do not have English as their native language. This has no influence mechwarfare whatsoever.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

5) Because MWO devs will be keeping certain planets from being player controled in order to advance the timeline according to cannon, having player controled clans occupying planets in clan versus IS and clan on clan fighting would become very complex.

Ever think that this could be a special event? Those planets are going to fall eventually, this could trigger evac missions on the IS side.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

6) Clan alliances, friendships, and rivalries are convolluted at best and this could cause certain clan alliances to be unbalanced in power in the actual game.

No more convolluted then the IS factions.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

7) Clanners do not use their mechs in physical attacks unless all other possibilites for continuing combat are gone.

Clans find it distasteful to initiate a physical attack, it isn't forbidden.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

8) Clan tech and omnimechs would be superior to all IS tech.

Correct, but the IS will be able to field larger numbers, think 5 vs 12 battles. Also, there's probably going to be a bidding system, munchkins in assaults would be missing out on a lot.

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

9) When fighting the IS, the clans might not always follow Zellbrigen but still maintain a certain set of tactics which MWO players might fail to adhere to.

Sure, but those players would never reap the rewards the honorable players will be getting.


The devs already confirmed that they are working on Clans and honorable combat. But you're welcome to stay with the IS.

[Canniballistic]

All these threads about how its impossible to implement the clans into the game when it seems everyone just doesnt realise that every player will be playing as mercenaries just like in MW4.

From what the devs have said, this will work in the same way that MW4's campaign did, youre groups of players that are signed up with a larger organisation which gives you benifits in exchange for representing their interests, and then if players like they create their own mercenary companies (clans//guilds).

What that means is when the game is released you likely wont actually be in the DCMS if you sign up with house Kurita, you will just be a mercenary working for them.

With that in mind, when they implement the clan invasion theres no reason they cant let you sign up with them if they so choose. There is all the possibility that instead they may make the clan invasion a world event of some kind, but the fact remains they are able to use the clan invasion any way they like.


On a side note; from what the devs have said this game is going to be near abouts what Chrome Hounds was (minus the customisation), so it might be a good idea to go see what that game was like before they shut the master server down, to give you an idea of what gameplay mechanics to expect in MWO.

[renegade mitchell]

Canniballistic, on 01 March 2012 - 12:37 PM, said:

All these threads about how its impossible to implement the clans into the game when it seems everyone just doesnt realise that every player will be playing as mercenaries just like in MW4.

From what the devs have said, this will work in the same way that MW4's campaign did, youre groups of players that are signed up with a larger organisation which gives you benifits in exchange for representing their interests, and then if players like they create their own mercenary companies (clans//guilds).

What that means is when the game is released you likely wont actually be in the DCMS if you sign up with house Kurita, you will just be a mercenary working for them.

With that in mind, when they implement the clan invasion theres no reason they cant let you sign up with them if they so choose. There is all the possibility that instead they may make the clan invasion a world event of some kind, but the fact remains they are able to use the clan invasion any way they like.


On a side note; from what the devs have said this game is going to be near abouts what Chrome Hounds was (minus the customisation), so it might be a good idea to go see what that game was like before they shut the master server down, to give you an idea of what gameplay mechanics to expect in MWO.

My thoughts exactly.

Just to add, the Devs stated Mercs will have to bid to gain a contract. Lowest bidder wins said contract. I see the same thing here, but we call it Batchall. So the winning clan bids the fewer mechs or lowest tonnage, which also levels the playing field.

Edited by Renegade Mitchell, 01 March 2012 - 02:25 PM.

[GDL Germ]

Bluey, on 15 February 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

It takes one medium lance to take down a Timber Wolf cant imagine a lance of clanners could do.
But you know Clans have limited numbers a faction based team could out man them in the end.

They won't in MWO, since everyone and their mother thinks clans are soooo awesome and wants to play one.

[Sug]

As much as I like the clans I will probably join whatever faction/house has the least amount of players.

[Kartr]

Renegade Mitchell, on 01 March 2012 - 01:35 PM, said:

Just to add, the Devs stated Mercs will have to bid to gain a contract. Lowest bidder wins said contract. I see the same thing here, but we call it Batchball. So the winning clan bids the fewer mechs or lowest tonnage, which also levels the playing field.

I think it's Batchall, not batch ball.

[renegade mitchell]

Kartr, on 01 March 2012 - 02:12 PM, said:

I think it's Batchall, not batch ball.

Correct. Being away from BT/MW since 2004, I miss spelled it.

Edited by Renegade Mitchell, 01 March 2012 - 02:27 PM.

[JzT Dolomite]

Renegade Mitchell, on 01 March 2012 - 01:35 PM, said:

My thoughts exactly.

Just to add, the Devs stated Mercs will have to bid to gain a contract. Lowest bidder wins said contract. I see the same thing here, but we call it Batchall. So the winning clan bids the fewer mechs or lowest tonnage, which also levels the playing field.

The batchball is what regulated the clans, since yea you can pilot that MadCat and be all awesome. But if your star said that they can take the planet with only 5 mechs and with light to medium mechs you gonna be out. Or if they include you in the batchball, you leave yourself open to other players who can undercut your batchball by saying "Well STRAVAG!! My Trianry will bid 1 star of light mechs to take the whole base, Cowards like you NEED bigger mechs, we shall garner the glory!"

Its all in how they regulate how they are implemented cause the Clans are gonna be in this game regardless of how any of us feel and I want it that way.

[renegade mitchell]

{JzT}Dolomite, on 01 March 2012 - 02:40 PM, said:

The batchball is what regulated the clans, since yea you can pilot that MadCat and be all awesome. But if your star said that they can take the planet with only 5 mechs and with light to medium mechs you gonna be out. Or if they include you in the batchball, you leave yourself open to other players who can undercut your batchball by saying "Well STRAVAG!! My Trianry will bid 1 star of light mechs to take the whole base, Cowards like you NEED bigger mechs, we shall garner the glory!"

Its all in how they regulate how they are implemented cause the Clans are gonna be in this game regardless of how any of us feel and I want it that way.

Yeah if all you can pilot is a Timber Wolf. For me and most I played with, we can pilot a variety of lights, mediums, heavies, and assualts. Devs have stated we can level up on a variety of different weight classes. If another clan undercuts yours, either they have a better clan or they are stupid. The stupid clans will get their arses handed to them and will not bid so low next time.

Edited by Renegade Mitchell, 01 March 2012 - 02:56 PM.

[Teeze]

MW4 balanced clan/IS fine.

Clan = more power/heat
IS = more range/ammo

If we want a fun game to play, we cannot stick to canon 100%.

Either way, I'm rolling Merc so I can roll however I want.

[renegade mitchell]

Teeze, on 01 March 2012 - 02:57 PM, said:

MW4 balanced clan/IS fine.

Clan = more power/heat
IS = more range/ammo

If we want a fun game to play, we cannot stick to canon 100%.

Either way, I'm rolling Merc so I can roll however I want.

Well in a way we all will be rolling merc at release.

[nubnub]

Bebo, on 15 February 2012 - 07:59 AM, said:

Why Clan Players Won't Work....or be too complex.
Rest of message hidden

Spoiler

Attention, Freebirths

Seeing as MWO attempts to stick to cannon and chronology, players being able to play as the Clans would throw a serious wrench into things.

1) Only 25 players may have a certain bloodname at a time. These name rules go hand in hand with having faction names being unusable by players.

2) Clan on clan fighting would have to follow the clan rules of Zellbrigen. Players who violate these rules would suffer recieve serious punishment.

3) Clan trials of combat would be the only way to advance through the clan ranks.

4) Clanners do not speak using contractions and have their own dialect which (i assume) few new MWO players would understand.

5) Because MWO devs will be keeping certain planets from being player controled in order to advance the timeline according to cannon, having player controled clans occupying planets in clan versus IS and clan on clan fighting would become very complex.

6) Clan alliances, friendships, and rivalries are convolluted at best and this could cause certain clan alliances to be unbalanced in power in the actual game.

7) Clanners do not use their mechs in physical attacks unless all other possibilites for continuing combat are gone.

8) Clan tech and omnimechs would be superior to all IS tech.

9) When fighting the IS, the clans might not always follow Zellbrigen but still maintain a certain set of tactics which MWO players might fail to adhere to.

As much as I would like to play a Clanner I think implementing clan players may be more trouble than it is worth. Lets just hope we can salvage their awesome clan mechs. Anyone who still thinks Clans would work in this game is a stravag, quiaff?

Summary of thread

1. MWO wont be canon
2. Devs will fix it
3. Devs will make it work

I think also I read somewhere all tech will be availible to all?

Edited by nubnub, 01 March 2012 - 03:16 PM.

[JzT Dolomite]

Renegade Mitchell, on 01 March 2012 - 02:52 PM, said:

Yeah if all you can pilot is a Timber Wolf. For me and most I played with, we can pilot a variety of lights, mediums, heavies, and assualts. Devs have stated we can level up on a variety of different weight classes. If another clan undercuts yours, either they have a better clan or they are stupid. The stupid clans will get their arses handed to them and will not bid so low next time.

Funny thing from some of the responses I have seen on theses forums, we will get a repeat of the inital attack by the Clans: Till people get over the shock of just being OUTCLASSED and OUTTECHED badly, the clans are gonna faceroll. Till people realize that tatics and strategy will negate a lot of their advantages and use them to full effect.

[Felbombling]

I've said this once before, but it makes sense to say it again here. I'd be all for players who are having a rough time with the game, either through bad net connection speed or a lack of skill, have first crack at playing Clan Mechs. I think it would be good for the game to give that player base a better chance of winning when the Clans arrive... keep the player numbers up this way. Besides... anyone who played Clan Mechs when they became available was floored by how powerful they were. I remember playing the first table top game with Clan Mechs after years with the original game. The group of us were floored. "Wait... what? How can that Mech fire all that stuff in one round... what will your heat level be?! What... +3... you've got to be kidding! Here... let me see that sheet!!"