41 replies to this topic

[Scanlon]

Are the IS houses allied against the invaiding Clans?

Are the IS houses all fighting each other and then the Clans show up?

Are the Clans allied?

Is it as simple as the IS houses the good guys? and the Clans the bad guys?

[Carl Wrede]

1. The IS houses are semi-allied against the Clans.

2. Yes most of the IS houses are fighting each other (with the exception of House Davion and House Steiner as they have formed the Federated Commonwealth together) and then the Clans show up.

3. Some of the Clans are semi-allied and some are hostile towards each other.

4. Not all IS houses are good guys but all of the Clans are the bad guys.

[Threat Doc]

Carl Wrede, on 23 March 2012 - 06:17 AM, said:

4. Not all IS houses are good guys but all of the Clans are the bad guys.

And that's a big <SALUTE> there, Carl!

Scanlon, from a standpoint of the lore, Carl's absolutely right. What the devs take on it will be, concerning the circumstances surrounding the game, is yet to be addressed.

[Krubarax]

That is what I love about the Battletech universe.
It is not all black and white.
It is not "the glorious and honorable rebel alliance against the evil galactic empire"
There are no good side and bad side.

Sure, there are indeviduals that could be concidered "bad guys"
But the clans are not bad guys.
House Liao are not bad guys.
House Kurita are not bad guys.

From my personal point of view, House Davion are the bad guys, but that is just me.

To answerar your other questions:
At the beginning of the Clan invasion, the Great Houses were neither allied nor at open war.
As already mentioned, House Davion and Steiner had recently merged into the Federated Commonwealth.
Other than that, the Houses were pretty much rebuilding and licking their wounds from the Forth Succession war.

The clans are different.
They are, of course allied. And I would like to say, in contrary to what Carl Wrede said, that they are not "Openly hostile towards eachother"
The Clans are of a different culture. A warrior culture. They always fought agains other clans and even other warriors within thir clan.
For just about anything. A ritualized combat.
Sure, there are different opinions, grudges and feuds within the clans, but not what you and I would call open warfare.
The only exeption to this has been the Annihilation of the not-named clan.

The Clans all have a common goal, and they are neither allied or at war with one another.
There are but different opinions on how to achieve the goal. and When.

In Battletech, you really have to read up on the books and make your own opinion on who you think is the good and bad.
That is the magnificance of this universe.

I, personally think that the clans are the good guys.
Exept maybe the Jags and the Falcons

[CoffiNail]

There are some grudges among the Clans though. IE Clan Wolf and Clan Ghost Bear. As during the annihilation of the Not-Named Clan A Ghost Bear Commander let a number of Not Named go, as, it was not their honor to do it, that was Clan Wolf who won the right to annihilate the Not Named. On his death bed he let this fact be known and the Wolves hold a grudge due to the fact CGB let some of the Not Named go.

Some Clans also have a long standing mutual benifit. Clan Wolf and Clan Coyote, Clan Ghost Bear and Snow Ravens....

[Jonas]

I have to say that the post have been spot on. If you really want to dive in to the World that is Mech Warrior/BattleTech go to battle Tech Wiki and search Mech Warrior out on u-tube also the old cartoon of Battle tech is on U-tube to. Or better yet Go to amazon.com and get the novels or perhaps a old book store.

[Krubarax]

Sure.
But CW and CGB are still "Allies"
They would not initiate an all out warfare against eachother.

For example, they bid, fair and square, for the right to take Rasalhague.
And the "loser" Accepted the loss, and the "winner" got to assault the planet.
Also, even though their invasion corridors were side to side, there were very little (if any?) fighting between them.

Had they been "at war" they would just have tried to destroy eachother.
A grudge does not mean that they are "enemies"

That is my point.

Some Clans share a closer relationship and some does not exacly "share opinions"
The best example of this perhaps, would be Clan Wolf and Clan Jade Falcon.

[Scanlon]

What does bidding mean? What does it entail? And why do they do it?

[Krubarax]

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Clans

[Scanlon]

In the FAQ the developers said when you create your mechwarrior, you choose a house to align yourself with. Does this mean that the houses will be at open war with each other when the game begins? GB_Kruburax said that the houses were licking their wounds from 'the 4th succession war'. Is this war amoungst the houses? Is this what the battles will be about at the start of the game?

Edited by Scanlon, 23 March 2012 - 07:39 AM.

[Krubarax]

The Forth Succession war ended 3030 and was between the Great Houses.
The game is set to launch in 3049.
The Clan invasion is late 3049/early 3050

Edited by GB_Krubarax, 23 March 2012 - 07:45 AM.

[Kenyon Burguess]

when you look over the entire lore, there is no good or evil for houses or clans. each side has their own agenda that changes over time. civil wars, alliances, betrayals, are all common for each faction

[Jaroth Corbett]

Scanlon, on 23 March 2012 - 05:56 AM, said:

Are the IS houses allied against the invaiding Clans?

Are the IS houses all fighting each other and then the Clans show up?

Are the Clans allied?

Is it as simple as the IS houses the good guys? and the Clans the bad guys?

1.Yes

2. Sort of.

3. It depends on your POV. From the IS side (mostly), the Clans are the bad guys. From the Clan side the IS is bad. I should explain a bit here though. There are two Clan POVs, the first being the IS is bad as rotten to the core & should be wiped out, while the second uses the version of bad one would associate with a naughty, troublesome, misguided child who needs to be set straight.

Edited by Jaroth Winson, 23 March 2012 - 08:04 AM.

[Scanlon]

Im just trying to understand the basics to make an informed decision about what house I join. As opposed of whose logo I like best.

Just trying to be clear on who I am, who my friends are, and who my enemies are.

[Jaroth Corbett]

Scanlon, on 23 March 2012 - 07:34 AM, said:

What does bidding mean? What does it entail? And why do they do it?

I am happy that there is at least one person who is new who is interested in & taking the time to, actually learn about the background of the game instead of just diving in like a noob. Hats off to you Scanlon!

For information on any BT related material please consult either:

http://ppc.warhawkenterprises.com/

http://web.archive.o...ultraforce.org/

or

http://bg.battletech.com/

If you want to check out Sarna, be warned you do so at your own risk. Sarna is basically like Wikipedia i.e. anybody can type anything there without quoting a legitimate source. I have NEVER trusted it.

To understand bidding, I will quote you from a BT novel entitled Roar of Honor. Enjoy!

Quote

Tseng turned to his bondsman. "Very well, Barthelow. Explain the concept of bidding for a Trial."

The bondsman drew a deep breath. Surely he knew that Tseng and the others were trying to break him, attempting to mold him to the ways of the Ghost Bear, but some fight in his warrior's soul probably still yearned for escape. He drew another long breath and spoke as if reciting the words Tseng had drilled into him. "The Clans do not fight mere battles. A Clan warrior engages in Trials. The defender will state what forces he will defend. The attacker then must bid to defeat his foe with the minimum amount of force possible."

"And why is that?" his bondmaster prompted.

"I believe it is to minimize the amount of potential loss."

"Partially correct, but what you believe is not important. What is important is what I believe," Tseng said. "There is more, bondsman. Why not simply engage as your former commanders in the Inner Sphere do, with every bit of manpower and BattleMech hardware available?" He did not conceal his scorn.

The bondsman shook his head, but did not lower his eyes. "I do not know."

"At least this time you did not use contractions," Tseng said. "Star Captain Bekker, perhaps you would be so kind as to inform this surat-dung as to why we do not attack with everything we have."

Angela regarded the bondsman for a moment. "Honor," she said.

The bondsman looked puzzled, but she went on before he could interrupt. "To use every bit of your strength to achieve a goal shows no honor. The blood in our veins as Ghost Bears is red with honor. If I outnumber you four to one and attack and defeat you, what then? Nothing. There is no honor in such a cheap victory. If I bid down and take you with even odds, there is some honor in that. But if I bid the least possible amount of force and beat you with that, then I have achieved the greatest honor. If you learn nothing else, learn that honor is the lifeblood of this Clan."

"If I may, Star Captain?" the bondsman said. "If you underbid and lose, then there is no honor, quaiff?" He was careful to use the traditional Clan interrogative.

Tseng looked over at Angela. "This one is not a mindless soldier, is he, Star Commander? His questions are apt."

"Aye," Angela said. "But if an officer underbids and stands to lose, he or she can either end the trial or call in the last group of forces he bid away before the final bid.

There is a loss of honor in raising the bid, but in defeat, there is no honor."

Edited by Jaroth Winson, 23 March 2012 - 08:18 AM.

[FireNova]

GB_Krubarax, on 23 March 2012 - 07:03 AM, said:

That is what I love about the Battletech universe.
It is not all black and white.
There are no good side and bad side.










Exept maybe the Jags and the Falcons

Double standards FTW! lol......

[Krubarax]

There are always exeptions

(on a serious note, that is just my personal opinion)

[Seabear]

As the game opens, the IS is recovering from the 4th Succession War and the War of 3039. While technically at peace, the border areas are in a state of constant flux due to the longstanding fueds between the houses. There will be strikes and counter strikes that "adjust" the boundaries but no all out major battles, if the lore is followed. When the clans show up, all the IS will focus on one goal for the first time in hundreds of years and should lead to the creation of a new Star League. We will have to see how that plays out in the game. The clans will probably introduce a new faction(s) , Comstar, within the IS. Just don't expect to play a merc associated with the clans.

As has been pointed out, there are no good guys or bad guys in this universe; every faction has positive strengths and glaring weaknesses. Check out sarna.net for detailed info on the houses and clans. Most people find they are drawn to one faction or another. Follow your heart in making your choice as you can't make a mistake. Visit the forums and see which group feels best to you. Welcome aboard and enjoy the ride!

Edited by Seabear, 23 March 2012 - 08:32 AM.

[Coralld]

For the most part the IS was allied against the Clans, now they still hated each other but the Clans posed a bigger threat to them at the time. The relations between the great houses during this temporary alliance was almost always strained so they all had one eye on the Clans and one eye on each other. So they may have been allied militarily but politically they were technically still at war with each other. Davion and Steiner at this point already joined together to form the Federation Commonwealth as mentioned before.

Clans do have allies with other Clans but they also have hated enemies. When it comes down to bad blood between Clans, look no further then Clan Wolf and Clan Jade Falcon or Clan Snow Raven and Clan Sea Fox/Diamond Shark. The rivalry and often times bitter hatred between these Clans are legendary. Even during the invasion, the Wolves and the Falcons took pot shots at each other, and the Ravens and Sharks were constantly trying to screw each other over with economic warfare.

As for whos good and who is bad, hard to say, despite the fact that the Clans see them selves as better then the IS when it comes to bickering or when at war with each other, the irony is that they are not better, they are just like the IS in their own way. Example: A number of Clansmen frown upon the Great House leaders, believing them to be all high and mighty and better then every one else which they see a reason to run rough shot over their people, and in some cases this is true. However you get the same thing with the Clans when it comes down to the True Born (Those who are genetically engineered. AKA test tube babies) treatment over Free Born (Those who are born naturally) that can be down right brutal among some of the Clans. There really is no good guy or bad guy for the most part for the IS and Clans, just a bunch of grey with a lot of swinging from one end of the good guy bad guy spectrum to the other. How ever they are exceptions. The Jags and House Liao are usually depicted as the bad guys and the Wolves and House Davion are depicted as the semi good guys, with say Sea Fox/Diamond Shark and House Marik are usually considered neutral over all.

[Thorn Hallis]

GB_Krubarax, on 23 March 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

For example, they bid, fair and square, for the right to take Rasalhague.
And the "loser" Accepted the loss, and the "winner" got to assault the planet.

Yeah, if you call it "fair" to intentionally drive your opponent far below the cutdown just to make him lose face.