24 replies to this topic

[Johannes Falkner]

If you had to pick AFFS units to represent House Davion, which would you pick and why? I am thinking in terms of players starting as part of these units and then having the option to join player created groups. Or being allowed to honorarily join the unit (keeping player-clan alignment) as a recognition of skill. Two vastly different uses for the units, I know, but that is what makes it interesting.

Starter units
Any of the Capellan, Sarna or Draconis March Millitia units (March Militia for short)
New Ivaarsen Chasseurs
Kittery Training Battalion
NAIS Training Cadre

Prowess Units
1st Federated Suns Armored Cavalry
Davion Brigade of Guards (1st)


Honorary Units
Davion Brigade of Guards (1st, Light, Heavy and Assault)
1st FedCom (1st Federated Suns Lancers)
1st Kathil Uhlans

Edited by Johannes Falkner, 23 March 2012 - 11:20 PM.

[Radagast]

I don't want the game to use 1st Federated Suns Armored Cavalry for anything because that is my units name!! We have 20-30 members and have been a unit together for over 15 years!! I will complain LOUDLY if my unit name is hi-jacked!!!

Lft. Radagast(1FSAC)-HG

[checker]

Seconded

SgtMaj. Checker (1FSAC)-HG

[Anita Chess]

I don't even have a clue what those names represent >.<

[Johannes Falkner]

Silly question:

Because all of the units I listed are canon, how many other player groups have formed with the same names? I would rather see player units be restricted to fictionalizations and reserve canon units for in game rewards. Otherwise, how many 1st FSACs will there be?

[Jack Gallows]

Johannes Falkner, on 24 March 2012 - 04:41 PM, said:

Silly question:

Because all of the units I listed are canon, how many other player groups have formed with the same names? I would rather see player units be restricted to fictionalizations and reserve canon units for in game rewards. Otherwise, how many 1st FSACs will there be?

I'd say that most of the canon units are going to be run by NPCS, and you get the option to "join" then at certain ranks/loyalty points. Probably just unlocks paint schemes/etc.

[GrimFist]

We took contracts for the AFFS. They paid well and tried not to drive us into the ground by covering basic recovery and refit costs on many of them. Salvage rights were good as long as it was not lost-tech.

We were a combined arms battlion special operations capable. Currently resting and drinking near a beach.

<in the distance a fortress dropship looms over the trees>

[Demi-Precentor Konev]

Radagast, on 24 March 2012 - 07:41 AM, said:

I don't want the game to use 1st Federated Suns Armored Cavalry for anything because that is my units name!! We have 20-30 members and have been a unit together for over 15 years!! I will complain LOUDLY if my unit name is hi-jacked!!!

Lft. Radagast(1FSAC)-HG

Not to be rude, but your unit name can't be hi-jacked. You don't own it. It's part of the BattleTech IP. This is why people have been encouraged not to name themselves after established characters in the setting or to get too attached to playing a certain unit in the game.

[Radagast]

lahyenne, on 24 March 2012 - 10:31 PM, said:

Not to be rude, but your unit name can't be hi-jacked. You don't own it. It's part of the BattleTech IP. This is why people have been encouraged not to name themselves after established characters in the setting or to get too attached to playing a certain unit in the game.

If you are not trying to be rude, then why did you NOT notice that this name has been used for over 15 years!! Our unit took this name BEFORE 3025 tried to come out.....before MW4 came out....we are who we are.

Rad

[Jack Gallows]

lahyenne, on 24 March 2012 - 10:31 PM, said:

Not to be rude, but your unit name can't be hi-jacked. You don't own it. It's part of the BattleTech IP. This is why people have been encouraged not to name themselves after established characters in the setting or to get too attached to playing a certain unit in the game.

This exactly.

Radagast, on 25 March 2012 - 04:36 AM, said:

If you are not trying to be rude, then why did you NOT notice that this name has been used for over 15 years!! Our unit took this name BEFORE 3025 tried to come out.....before MW4 came out....we are who we are.

Rad

Yea, but if it's a canon unit name...then you really have no claim to it. I sincerely hope you can get the unit you'd like, however, just pointing out how many people hoping to control canon units at launch are going to probably be incredibly disappointed.

It's like people who want the Wolf's Dragoon unit name, maybe they've been playing as that online for a looong time. It's just not going to happen, they don't own it.

Edited by Jack Gallows, 25 March 2012 - 04:42 AM.

[Snark]

I hope your kidding Johannas. Your talking about Established units .Your going to have this problem with lots of units in every house.Simply some names are taken .Live with it.

[chewie]

I think what Rad is getting at, and this applies not just to us, but all groups that have been using the names of ANY unit, be it a popular or well renowned unit withing the BT universe, for longer than MWO let alone MW2, 3 or 4 has been around, is that we do not particularly wish to suddenly be told told that we cannot go by that name because its going to become part of the core game.

As it stands, this shouldn't happen, because it IS an MMO, rather than a linear based single player campaign with an attached multi-player aspect.

Its like being part of a group using the name Hansons Roughriders (because you wish to emulate them in your TT/multiplayer identity) and suddenly being told by a big corporation that *hey, we own the rights to that name, you cannot use it because we are using it in this that or the other*

There already exists a group which has got *honorary* pilots in, and has been since long before a lot of the people now looking at this game, have been around.

You'll see a few of em popping up here and there. The Davion ones are all Knights etc.

I don't know what the other *houses* have for their honorary pilots, but i expect if you dug back to the beginnings of them as an online entity, they probably do exist.

OP

What you propose may well be feasable, if everyone starts off as a member of a militia or training *group* such as the Kittery lot, and as you progress you get to move to a better unit. But, why? It certainly wouldn't work for Merc units unless you then get the option to go merc when you leave your *training* period (eg attain sufficient rank in exp)

Your gonna start out as a cadet rank, but still running around in your choice of mech based on what we have seen so far. Be it an Atlas or a Jenner. Does it matter which *unit* you belong to in game at the very beginning?


From the looks of things, the proposed system already looks like you will follow historical ranks for each house anyway, even if you may not get them alongside your name the way you did in 3025.

[Demi-Precentor Konev]

chewie, on 25 March 2012 - 08:04 AM, said:

Its like being part of a group using the name Hansons Roughriders (because you wish to emulate them in your TT/multiplayer identity) and suddenly being told by a big corporation that *hey, we own the rights to that name, you cannot use it because we are using it in this that or the other*

And again, as much as that might be upsetting for someone: it ultimately doesn't matter. It's protected content and whoever started the unit knew the risk on the day of inception. If top brass wants to protect how the 1st FSAC is portrayed in MWO, and doing that means barring player units from using that name, then it's something we're legally obligated to respect. Sure the unit has been around for 15 years, but the IP has been protected for far longer than that. You won't win a battle of seniority or legality.

In addition, it's also a way to prevent units fighting over the same name. One unit calls themselves the Gray Death Legion. Another unit thinks they deserve to be the GDL, so they call themselves the Grey Death Legion. It kills immersion and hamstrings the established story, just like it's painful to see people on the forums with names like Jam1e Wolf and Morgen Kell.

[Qin]

lahyenne, on 25 March 2012 - 10:50 AM, said:

And again, as much as that might be upsetting for someone: it ultimately doesn't matter. It's protected content and whoever started the unit knew the risk on the day of inception. If top brass wants to protect how the 1st FSAC is portrayed in MWO, and doing that means barring player units from using that name, then it's something we're legally obligated to respect. Sure the unit has been around for 15 years, but the IP has been protected for far longer than that. You won't win a battle of seniority or legality.

In addition, it's also a way to prevent units fighting over the same name. One unit calls themselves the Gray Death Legion. Another unit thinks they deserve to be the GDL, so they call themselves the Grey Death Legion. It kills immersion and hamstrings the established story, just like it's painful to see people on the forums with names like Jam1e Wolf and Morgen Kell.

Yes yes we all get the legaleese. We all understand the thing on IP and companies and rights bla bla bla.

And yes it might be a futile wish, but if people dont speak up others will not know how they think about certain subjects.

Mind you though that when those units where incepted the thought of a game like MWO ever being made was not something anybody would have dreamd about. Players did not think, hmm in 15 years they will have a game where i cant claim that name.
Its an emotional thing, the investment people made into the unit, wether it was boardgame, rpg, or one of the many computer games.
And yes we know the devs aint going to change the game mechanics to the wishes of all the old player units that are in every house, clan or merc.

In the end people will find ways to create their own groups inside the regiments, either with chat channels, or things like teamspeak or both.

[Soviet Alex]

The only Davion unit I would play would be the Avalon Hussars. Dunno how you missed them from the list at the top. Davion Brigade of Guards? Prince's playthings with all the best gear. Provincial units? Hillbillies. March units? All hate & divided loyalties. No, the hussars represent the best you have. Not the most elite, not the highest tech-level, not the ones who get the plum assignments. Just professional soldiers who fight for the Federated Suns rather than a lord or district. They've earned my respect.

[Fetladral]

in the first heavy gear game the units were in the game and you could join them already which would unlock certain gears(similar to mechs but smaller swords handheld guns, more like a gundam than a mech) that were not available to other units of the same faction. might have allowed certain tech and piloting perks. like one unit was a light unit so they were faster more manuevrable and such were another had better accuracy and did more damage and another had better electronics so better coms sensors and such

[100mile]

Missing most important questions far as i am concerned...What makes you think i wanna change units in the first place...fact is i don't..and if that means i don't get some skins or whatever....so be it..my loyaltyintegrity is much more important to me...

[Johannes Falkner]

Basically my original intent was to determine which units people should see as the major public face of the AFFS (AFFC). There are so many (Mech) units involved, something like 100 mech regiments by the time you count up all of the Sarna (7), Capellan (9), Crucis (8), and Draconis (11) March Militias, the special regiments (>3), The Avalon Hussars(>9), New Ivaarsen Chasseurs (2), Ceti Hussars (3), Crucis Lancers (8), Brigade of Guards (8), Deneb Light Cavalry (7), Robinson Rangers (3), Syrtis Fusileers (4), and a couple of misc. and traing units (>4) and a completely unknown number of merc groups employed at every level of the bureacracy and aristocracy.

Given the massive number of units I don't think it is reasonable to show them all in game, nor do I think the results would be good because there would not be a particularly strong flavor. If we stick to iconic and distinctive units the overall feel will be better. This is why I was looking at a generic militia unit as an entry point and prestige and prowess units for honorary assignments and skill based inclusion.

I would like it to even be further stratefied by making the skills that get you into one unit be counter to those that get you into another. Many of the various units have strong flavors that would be helpful in conveying the flavor of the AFFS. For example, the 1st Federated Suns Armored Cavalry is predominently medium mechs with a strong focus on maneuver tactics and raiding. The Davion Assault Guards are a coordinated fire, break things and kill people unit.

100mile, on 25 March 2012 - 08:00 PM, said:

Missing most important questions far as i am concerned...What makes you think i wanna change units in the first place...fact is i don't..and if that means i don't get some skins or whatever....so be it..my loyaltyintegrity is much more important to me...

Johannes Falkner, on 23 March 2012 - 11:20 PM, said:

If you had to pick AFFS units to represent House Davion, which would you pick and why? I am thinking in terms of players starting as part of these units and then having the option to join player created groups. Or being allowed to honorarily join the unit (keeping player-clan alignment) as a recognition of skill. Two vastly different uses for the units, I know, but that is what makes it interesting.

(emphasis added)

I honestly doubt that there will be a strongly visible unit affiliation outside of player created clans and a few special units like what I posted about originally.

[El Bandito]

Davion Light guards for life.

[100mile]

Am with Robinson Rangers...come check us out at HTTP://1st-rangers.com/rangers/