255 replies to this topic

[SouthernRex]

"Groups are reduced to 4 man teams." OK, I think I'm done. The whiney sissies have managed to ruin the game for all the real players. GG guys. See ya at the next MW game in 10 years, cause this one is done.

Edited by SouthernRex, 31 October 2012 - 03:16 AM.

[Dr Killinger]

Technoviking, on 30 October 2012 - 03:30 PM, said:

People are not getting stomped because of pre-mades.

They are getting stomped because they've just picked up the game.

This game, (thank the heavens) has a learning curve. You actually need to know the speed of turning etc of your mech to get good at it. 14 matches should be good enough to know a single mech, add some XP, and feel ok. If you try out all 4 trial mechs, that means you only tried each chassis 3 times. Couple that with learning its heat and weapon group abilities... loss is going to happen.

This a thousand times! Why do people assume you'll be great from day 1?

What you said about turning speeds etc is so true... going from my fully unlocked Atlas to a fresh inefficiencies tree, I suddenly was dying a lot, and I realized it's because I couldn't stop and reverse as quickly as I used to, so I was exposing myself to waaaay more enemy fire. My mech wasn't worse, but just different, and that was enough to put me out of sync with my habits!

[cryonic]

The comments that taking leadership of a pug is the difference between a win and a lose is only partially true.
For pug vs pug this is true. Premades use voip setups like teamspeak and mumble which is a huge advantage in organisation.

The lack of ingame support for the community - lobby/ chat is a huge barrier to getting into a group. relying on the community to selforganise is just the developers wimping out on implementing the game properly. Thats whats perpertuating the feeling of alienation for new players - theres no community - just the ability to launch a random fight.

[Greyfyl]

Garth Erlam, on 30 October 2012 - 03:14 PM, said:

We are taking steps to fix this (Phase 1 will be soon, in fact) but a lot of this is player perception. I play outside of groups 99% of the time, and in the last two weeks I've played against a grand total of two premades. Today I played 20 matches just to see; got zero.

It can be frustrating to lose like that, sure, but what people often forget is they're losing because they literally do zero group work. No-one uses C3, no-one even uses text chat. Then they get picked apart one by one. I managed to get a random group of guys to talk and we beat an actual premade (one of those two I faced) because a lot of the guys there were great players, they just needed a good leader.

I call BS. I was off due to the hurricane on Monday when OB dropped. The first 2 hours or so was fine, maybe that's when you did your little 'test'. However, by early evening the premades were out in force. I've done premades, I have c3 and ts installed. I know many of the players that I was facing. They often advertised for their clans. Don't tell me I wasn't facing premades in over 50% of the games.

Yesterday was pretty much the same thing - the morning was fine. Evening is premade time.

I'm glad for you that 'one time in bandcamp' you managed to beat a premade with your leet leadership skills. But here again you are sugarcoating the whole issue. A team with 6 people in trial mechs has NO CHANCE IN HELL of beating a premade, regardless of communication. End of story.

Fix your matchmaking - you should be embarrassed by the product you currently have on the live servers.

[Jequan]

I agree - it's ruins the fun. Of course you could go that route like some suggest and go find your own group.
Maybe people don't WANT to do that?
I love these type of games for a quick match every now and then and i don't have the time to commit to a premade that will have for hours if possible.
If you force this on people they will leave because it is not the mass of players that play in organised clan. Wake up!
You only make money with the masses and those will leave.

I can play and make a profit because i have my founder mechs. If i had to play with these ridiculous trial mechs i'd be long gone.

[Obadiah333]

Yeah, the whole "we died to a premade" bit is a little over-exaggerated. I dropped solo a while yesterday and today. The amount of new players with little skill is insane. I had many matches where I had 5+ kills and the rest of my team had 0 and we lost (and sometimes won). There are a lot of new guys out there in trial mechs - they don't know the maps, the good spots, how to manage heat, etc. The list goes on and on. They are going to lose a lot until they get some experience and can get better mechs. That's just the way of the world. I hope that they have the patience to hang in there until they get some matches in and get a little better. The learning curve of this game is pretty steep (and also fairly demanding). Hang in there new guys, you'll be pwning other noobs soon enough.

[Greyfyl]

SouthernRex, on 31 October 2012 - 03:15 AM, said:

"Groups are reduced to 4 man teams." OK, I think I'm done. The whiney sissies have managed to ruin the game for all the real players. GG guys. See ya at the next MW game in 10 years, cause this one is done.

Hilarious - can't beat up on newbies so you are quitting.

Phase II will supposedly drop sometimg this year and bring exactly what you 'real' players want which is premade vs premade.

[tenderloving]

Hikyuu, on 31 October 2012 - 02:13 AM, said:

i direct your attention to 'cannon fodder' trial mechs making 2-3 kills a match and winning pug games:
http://mwomercs.com/...20#entry1318207

QQ elsewere.

So a Founder had middling success in Trial mechs after playing the beta for months? Good job!

[Enigmos]

KrazedOmega, on 30 October 2012 - 03:12 PM, said:

Knowing how to play the game has little to do with the matchmaking problem. Good job completely missing the point.

It appears the problem is not in matchmaking but in team competitiveness. With experience comes effectiveness, but more than that where many players fire on the same target that target goes down faster. With communiction comes team coordination. It is that simple.

If individuals cannot bother to notice which mech is the biggest threat, designate the primary target, and coordinate their fire it isn't a problem with matchmaking it is a problem with owning your problems and identifying effective solutions.

Edited by OriginalTibs, 31 October 2012 - 03:34 AM.

[Greyfyl]

Obadiah333, on 31 October 2012 - 03:25 AM, said:

Yeah, the whole "we died to a premade" bit is a little over-exaggerated. I dropped solo a while yesterday and today. The amount of new players with little skill is insane. I had many matches where I had 5+ kills and the rest of my team had 0 and we lost (and sometimes won). There are a lot of new guys out there in trial mechs - they don't know the maps, the good spots, how to manage heat, etc. The list goes on and on. They are going to lose a lot until they get some experience and can get better mechs. That's just the way of the world. I hope that they have the patience to hang in there until they get some matches in and get a little better. The learning curve of this game is pretty steep (and also fairly demanding). Hang in there new guys, you'll be pwning other noobs soon enough.

This is exactly why SOME sort of matchmaking was needed prior to OB being dropped. If there are 6 new players in trial mechs on your team and the other team has 7 or 8 founders who already have good custom mechs - you might as well be playing against a premade because you just simply are not going to win. Look at all the missile boats again, why do you think that is? Because of the high number of trial mechs without AMS.

SIgh.

[Joseph Mallan]

Mack1, on 30 October 2012 - 02:46 PM, said:

Well this just sucks, everyone I introduced to the game since OB has now left due to Premades. They say "why should I do something that is not fun" I kind of agree with them. Am only here because I have two good Mechs and even against Premades I can do enough damage to make a profit.

I just think the Devs should be kicked up the arse as we warned them about this over 3 months ago, no excuses, it's harming the game, fix it or lose money. Oh and 4 man lances won't fix it, we need Solo queues.

Have you and those you "introduced" grouped up to be a premade? The Mechs don't make a premade better than some PUGs its the coordination given by TS or other VOiPs.

The 4 man queues will be dropped wit 4 PUGs so teams will be "balanced".

[Kadix]

People are leaving...am I'm one of them.

I'm sorry, but this isn't worth it. The matchmaking is horrible. I think I'm something like 0 in 10 so far. MWO has potential as a very casual game for me, but the lack of decent matchmaking isn't worth it. I don't have the time to get involved in a guild and run regular pre-made raids, and getting *** raped every moring in a couple matches before I go to work just isn't a fun way to spend my time.

I'm a long time fan of pen && paper batteltech, and the other battletech computer games, but there are just too many problems with MWO. Hopefully matchmaking will improve to the point that this game is worth playing.

(p.s. Please fix the website so IE10 users can add multiple lines of text into a "reply to this topic" box. It's just obnoxious to have to copy/paste into notepad to post on the forums with paragraphs)

[Alex Miller]

Mack1, on 30 October 2012 - 02:46 PM, said:

Well this just sucks, everyone I introduced to the game since OB has now left due to Premades. They say "why should I do something that is not fun" I kind of agree with them. Am only here because I have two good Mechs and even against Premades I can do enough damage to make a profit.

I just think the Devs should be kicked up the arse as we warned them about this over 3 months ago, no excuses, it's harming the game, fix it or lose money. Oh and 4 man lances won't fix it, we need Solo queues.

You maybe thought about people who just want to play with their friends? Lets say I want to play with 3 of my friends as always because its more fun together but I cant do it because some people get their *** raped by premades. Well thats not my problem and they will lose a lot ( and I mean actually a LOT) players. Not everyone has no friends you know?

[Adestre]

Yokaiko, on 30 October 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

So a noobie expects to just jump into a First person shooter sim, and rock the house? It took me days to survive a game. I was just happy to be standing.

I am a newbie at this game. I do not expect to be a pro after a few matches. i expect, thou, not to be pitted against someone with a vastly better mech AND with a better experience than me. Pls take the time to play 1 hour in world of tanks (similar type of ftp game, very successful financially) and pls compare the new player experience. And that has nothing to do withs beeing open beta, becouse i played that game from closed beta and the system was the same

Edited by Adestre, 31 October 2012 - 03:33 AM.

[Krivvan]

paladin yst, on 31 October 2012 - 01:17 AM, said:

eg.
superboy vs noob dragon
giantmole vs nova dragon
hercul3z vs giant dragon
y3llowcow vs baby dragon
heromonk3y vs cute dragon
etc etc...

Dont need a brain to know which group is premade

I still don't understand why you think this is proof that most groups are premade? It's evidence that one group you have faced was premade.

Do you actually find those matching names to be common? Because if so, I don't know what game you've been playing.

Edited by Krivvan, 31 October 2012 - 03:38 AM.

[Enigmos]

SouthernRex, on 31 October 2012 - 03:15 AM, said:

"Groups are reduced to 4 man teams." OK, I think I'm done. The whiney sissies have managed to ruin the game for all the real players. GG guys. See ya at the next MW game in 10 years, cause this one is done.

This condition will last a couple of weeks at the most. Then we will gat 8 man's back. I assume if the devs can master netcode we will then get 12 (note: multiple of 4) mech drops.

The culture sure has changed. Used to be folks understood you have to build the foundation right before you raised the walls, and the walls had to be square and plumb before you thought about roofing.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Ravendreams, on 30 October 2012 - 02:53 PM, said:

Where is the proof they were all premade groups as well. I've seen very few premade groups myself.

8-0 is proof. You're lucky if your team gets even 1 kill vs one. Pug vs pug half a team will die. Premade however will be 0 or 1
This is because they are using voice chat and focus fire based on names and targets. They will cut down your numbers fast and once its 5vs8, you've already lost.

[Tokra]

SouthernRex, on 31 October 2012 - 03:15 AM, said:

"Groups are reduced to 4 man teams." OK, I think I'm done. The whiney sissies have managed to ruin the game for all the real players. GG guys. See ya at the next MW game in 10 years, cause this one is done.

So we have the choice between losing you and losing 100th new player that dont want to get stumped? Let me think,....

Bye.

[Aym]

Desecrator, on 30 October 2012 - 02:54 PM, said:

Ever stop to think people dont wish to play like you do.

How many times are you going to try and force your playstyle down someones throats.

Solo players are a fact in MMOs. It has been for a long time
The successful games are friendly to solo players.
The games that do not fail.

When the solo players jump ship, the numbers go down, the game fails , and you can kiss another game goodbye
I think you severely underestimate how many solo players there are. Without them you wouldn't have a game to play in

Big difference between a PvP Mech Sim game and all the "MMO's" you're referring to. One being NO PVE!!! No Questing!!! No ANYTHING THAT THE PERSISTENT WORLD MMO'S HAVE TO DO AS A SOLO PLAYER!!! This is a team based PvP game. Period. You're getting beaten by pugs that use team work. End of story. When I pug, near enough to 50% W/L that I can't tell the difference, a friend of mine tried it out today while I was at work, loved it, pug'd the WHOLE TIME and won 50%, wonders what all the whining about is for on the forums. PvP games from Counter Strike through CoD, BF, Halo, and TF have all been no more or less solo friendly than MWO.
Once again, this is not an argument of "raid/guild/party v. solo pve carebears." There are no carebears in this game.

[Tokra]

Bluten, on 31 October 2012 - 03:43 AM, said:

8-0 is proof. You're lucky if your team gets even 1 kill vs one. Pug vs pug half a team will die. Premade however will be 0 or 1
This is because they are using voice chat and focus fire based on names and targets. They will cut down your numbers fast and once its 5vs8, you've already lost.

Not true. Even a 8-0 can be pug vs pug. I have been in more than enough matches we won and lost (8-0; 0-8) without premade on any side.

Even premade is not the same as team premade.
Only really few matches are really against a team premade team that is working as a team. You notice this really fast in a match.

Its already enough when you have a suicide runner and a new player that has to learn the controls. You are down to a 6vs8 and can go down really fast. Even against other Pugs.

From all the matches i had the last two days, i would say 2 or 3 were against team premade. These were the only when we were crushed. All other when we lost (even with 0-8) were bad luck, bad constellation or to many disconnects.

It is a problem, but not as big as some present it (90% against premade).

Edited by Tokra, 31 October 2012 - 03:56 AM.