79 replies to this topic

[Chemie]

Asakara, on 27 November 2012 - 03:59 PM, said:

It seems to me from reading the "counters" section that anyone with TAG who is not within 180m of an ECM equipped enemy mech can paint a target within the jamming radius so that friendly missiles can lock on and fire.

I could be wrong but I think you can paint it but your LRM boat won't be able to lock it.

[Asakara]

Chemie, on 27 November 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

I could be wrong but I think you can paint it but your LRM boat won't be able to lock it.

That would be contrary to what they have posted:

Quote

If you are not being disrupted by an enemy ECM, any hidden Mech on the other team that you hit with a TAG laser will be revealed as if it wasn't being hidden. This allows you and your teammates to target and lock on it for as long as you can keep the TAG beam trained on it.

[HRR Insanity]

Read through it. They need to seriously think about increasing the minimum detection distance from 200m to 300m. A 20m 'band' to hold targets is nearly nothing and will make ECM infighter rushes (especially with SSRM boats covered by Jen-D's with ECM) very hard to stop.

I look forward to the start of information warfare.

Insanity

[superbob]

Reading through that writeup, I couldn't help but think one thing... Man, is this gonna be bugged!

[Khobai]

Seriously how is ECM even remotely balanced?

It ONLY weighs 1.5 tons and it does ALL of this...

1) reduces sensor detection range of all nearby friendly mechs to 200m (instead of 800m)
2) cancels out BAP, Artemis, TAG, and NARC from being used on all nearby friendly mechs
3) makes missile lock-on take twice as long on all nearby friendly mechs
4) cuts off nearby enemy mechs from sharing any sensor information with their team whatsoever
5) prevents nearby enemy mechs from being able to lock on with missiles at all
6) has some kind of battlegrid/targetting disruption effect on nearby enemy mechs?

WTF is PGI thinking? This thing will completely ruin the game if they add it in...

1) light mechs will be immune to the only weapon that can reliably kill them derp derp
2) lrms will be made completely obsolete, as if they werent nerfed badly enough already
3) running any variants without ECM will be completely pointless
4) kills the whole long-range dynamic of the game by making it easy to close within brawling distance

Edited by Khobai, 27 November 2012 - 04:33 PM.

[Parnage Winters]

Boy am I glad I bought the JR7-D and not the laser only variant, sucks about C1 catapult going to be mothballed I really enjoyed using LRMS, but as any sensible team is going to run an ECM and binary counters are silly I better enjoy my fire support role while it lasts.

[JagdpantherX]

******** ECM looks really OP.

[Solis Obscuri]

Mercules, on 27 November 2012 - 03:12 PM, said:

Sounds like if you are within the 180 meters of the mech with ECM it will mess with your sensors that achieve locks for you. Solution: Don't get within 180 meters of a mech with ECM if you use missiles that lock on. In addition ECM has many other uses in TT, if you used the expanded rules, including creating "Ghost Images" on other's radar and such. Those sound like a module upgrade in combo with ECM but we will see.

Yeah, because it's so viable to keep fast, lagshielded light 'mechs >180m away right now, right? That's why no one ever spammed Small Laser boats, right?

Taizan, on 27 November 2012 - 03:31 PM, said:

Well obviously we are using a different C3i system than in the TT rulebooks.

We don't have a C3 or C3i system at all. We don't use dice rolls to determine whether or not our weapons hit, so C3/C3i would have no point in a first-person game. The only ability that we have past what standard battlemech sensors do on TT is the ability to get info on an opponent's loadout if we maintain lock long enough.

[Freeride Forever]

Tekerton, on 04 November 2012 - 05:59 PM, said:

let's test it first and evaluate it from there, yeah?

No. I stopped testing when they stopped resetting.

[Khobai]

Quote

Solution: Don't get within 180 meters of a mech with ECM if you use missiles that lock on.

Uh what?. If youre in a Streak Cat that moves say 80kph... and you only have a range of 270m with Streaks... how are you going to keep a Jenner that moves nearly 150kph from closing within 180m? Its impossible.

[Scratx]

I think most people missed this:

If you are not being disrupted by an enemy ECM, any hidden Mech on the other team that you hit with a TAG laser will be revealed as if it wasn’t being hidden. This allows you and your teammates to target and lock on it for as long as you can keep the TAG beam trained on it.

However, I must admit I am worried that ECM will make the usage of LRMs even less attractice while at the same time negating much of the attractiveness of most light mech variants because they can't be made effectively immune to streakboats.

And by the way, it is hilarious the notion that anybody can actually keep a TAG trained on a light mech reliably enough to actually achieve a lock. Let alone keep it for the missile flight duration. This counter to ECM is mainly useful against slow, big mechs.


... So, from the perspective of an LRM boater, we already pay (or don't, depending on whom you ask) the highest ammunition reload bills, we also often have some of the most expensive and fragile mechs too and the missiles aren't even overpowered (as the ammunition costs would imply in comparison to just about every other weapon), and now ... it is mandatory for us to have a TAG with us otherwise we (predictably) won't be able to shoot half the enemy team.

...

So, am I the only one seeing there'll be a sudden influx of Atlas D-DC's for the assault mech slot and most light mechs we'll see are the ECM capable ones?

[Ragor]

This is the very very first time I totally disagree with PGI because of the announced mechanics of the GECM.

All the functions the ECM will have, available on some many variants -> IMO this is quite OP.
The GECM will definately influence the gameplay in a very extreme way.
Compared to GECM the BAP is really joke.

IMO these features would perfectly fit to the Raven as unique and exclusive features of the Raven, to give the Raven a destinctive role and reflect the canon. (...and not only the TT rules where the unique and very high specialized Raven is just an other 35t chassis)

But that is just me.

Not whining here, just a bit unlucky about it.

(... but I will for sure shed some tears in silent when I go to bed tonight.)

[Alexander Joe Eisenkreuz Steiner]

I'm personlly horrified that the Jenner should get it too. Makes the Raven completly pointless IMO. Guess I put my money on the wrong horse. Oh well, I was going to take a long break anyway.

[Scratx]

SicksGunz, on 27 November 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

It doubles lock time, negates Artemis, Narc, TAG and BAP, AND makes getting a lock on it within 180 meters completely impossible. That is one crazy powerful 1.5 ton piece of equipment.

This is ****ed up.

Worse. You can't lock on enemy mechs hidden by ECM unless you're within 200m. However, if you get closer than 180m, you get disrupted!

It is terribly OP by the sounds of it. Maybe it actually won't be so in play but... I'm confident I'm right, to my own sorrow.

[Salient]

They are using it to make this game not suck. No more BS LRM EZ mode nonsense.

[Khobai]

Quote

They are using it to make this game not suck. No more BS LRM EZ mode nonsense.

uh there hasnt been any BS LRM EZ mode nonsense for 2 weeks. There is absolutely no need for ECM to make LRMs and SSRMs completely useless.

ECM detection range should be 640m not 200m. ECM should also have no effect on BAP. That way BAP increases 640m sensor range back to the normal 800m sensor range (640m x 1.25 = 800m). So ECM and BAP would just cancel out.

Additionally ECM should not prevent lock-ons within 180m. Doubling lock-on time is sufficient enough punishment for Streaks in addition to the other nerfs they have planned.

Those are the only two aspects of ECM that are overpowered and need to be fixed.

Edited by Khobai, 27 November 2012 - 06:05 PM.

[Scratx]

Salient, on 27 November 2012 - 05:51 PM, said:

They are using it to make this game not suck. No more BS LRM SSRM EZ mode nonsense.

Fixed that for you.

[Solis Obscuri]

Salient, on 27 November 2012 - 05:51 PM, said:

They are using it to make this game not suck. No more BS LRM EZ mode nonsense.

Instead: lagshields and no-skill beamspam and no team tactics

[Churzy]

Considering the Raven was explicitly created to carry an ECM (because it was inviable on other existing Mech models)... well, let's say that not everyone should easily be able to carry one around and use it effectively.

While I'm not against any mech equipping ECM (or BAP for that matter), I think that they should at least be cheaper/baseline for Ravens, and more costly for the rest. Otherwise we'll be seeing even more Jenners, and SSRMs won't be able to help

[Tekerton]

Freeride Forever, on 27 November 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

No. I stopped testing when they stopped resetting.

Really? You necro'd a 22 day old post to state that nonsense? Yes, it is non-sense because whether you like it or not, data is collected from each account.