174 replies to this topic

[zmeul]

Pangorin, on 15 November 2012 - 02:15 AM, said:

The other thing is that MWO was never planned for 11 million players, I think some of you dream a little much. Take a look to Eve Online and there active accounts and its still alive. Next is, not the number of accounts are important, its the number of paying members!

this is where you are wrong
as a F2P business model PGI needs players and players that will pay
do not compare a subscription model with F2P as number of players - EVE has those numbers and had them for a long time because they are there to stay and pay every year
they also sell PLEXes on top of the subs


ps: there is one thing I noticed with the number of new accounts - quite a few of them are duplicates of existing users
yeah' people create a 2nd account for various reasons, I won't discuss

Edited by zmeul, 15 November 2012 - 02:48 AM.

[Pangorin]

I do not have a detailed insight into the industry as well, just as 99% of all posting in this forum. Some just try to suggest that they have, but I doubt that!
But what I know is that SWTOR was originally planned for 500k to 1 Million players. SWTOR was one of the most expensive productions ever, MWO is not! I personnaly think (I do not know, just think) this game is planned for maybe(max.) 250k players to be in the greenzone. They will for sure not need 1 million players to make enough money!

[Bloody]

i played EQ. Trust me, WoW was grindfree by comparison.

the genre has moved on, GW2 etc show different things, weather that will succeed is another matter

anyway back on topic. I am one of the Beta testers who said the game was not ready for OB. I admit , anyone who asked me in the game forums or my gaming forum buddies what i thought about MWO , i told them flatly not to bother until 5-6 months from now. I still believe this is a horrible representation of Mechwarrior and the BT universe. I am just waiting for PGI to allow me to stop my founders time and then i will log off and return , maybe , in 6 months time to check

[Edi123]

Pangorin, on 15 November 2012 - 02:48 AM, said:

I do not have a detailed insight into the industry as well, just as 99% of all posting in this forum. Some just try to suggest that they have, but I doubt that!
But what I know is that SWTOR was originally planned for 500k to 1 Million players. SWTOR was one of the most expensive productions ever, MWO is not! I personnaly think (I do not know, just think) this game is planned for maybe(max.) 250k players to be in the greenzone. They will for sure not need 1 million players to make enough money!

Yes, but it was planned for 500k-1million subcriptions paying a monthly fee. And even more players buying the game for 60 bucks to get back the development costs (assuming 1million sales this makes for more than ten times the money earned by the founders program).

[Budor]

Game just needs a better starting expirience.They need to either have really good trial loadouts or a mech per account to pick and go from there.

Id rather have the mech per account option because it opens up the mechlab to new players which is a HUGE part of the game and gives them a sense of progression with earning xp.

[OlF]

Just some data for comparison available on the EU Forum of Wot. Someone is gathering this with the acceptance of WoT.

27. September 2012 to 7. November 2012 (game versions 0.8.0 and 0.8.1).

Spoiler

• Total accounts:
  
  • The EU server has 5.47 million accounts, 510k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The NA server has 3.01 million accounts, 200k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The RU server has 9.8 million accounts, 1 million more than last snapshot.
    
  • The SEA server has 781k accounts, 195k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The VN server has an unknown number of accounts - I stopped collecting the data due to the extremely slow performance of the VN server.
    
  • I have no information about the 2 Chinese servers, but calculating based on total account numbers released by Wargaming the number of accounts on the Chinese servers seems to exceed that of all other regions combined.
  All data below is only for the EU server.
  
  
• Played accounts: 2 911 263 accounts have played at least one game, 235,228 more than last snapshot. The ratio of unplayed accounts rises further to 46.80%.
  
• Getting hooked: Of those that played at least one game, 29.46% never even played as many as ten games.
  
• Battles played: The average number of battles per account is 906, or 1937 for those having played last snapshot. Looking only at players having played more than 100 battles, the average is 1979, or 2583 for those having played last snapshot. Players organized in a clan are of course even more dedicated, their average number of battles per account is 4587, or 4814 for those having played last snapshot.
  
  
  Let's look into the amount of battles the players have played in some more detail:
  
  • at least 1 battle: 2 911 263 accounts.
    
  • < 10 battles: 857 600 accounts.
    
  • > 100 battles: 1 318 214 accounts.
    
  • > 500 battles: 789 351 accounts.
    
  • > 1000 battles: 584 961 accounts.
    
  • > 2500 battles: 323 215 accounts.
    
  • > 5000 battles: 151 843 accounts.
    
  • > 7500 battles: 75 170 accounts.
    
  • > 10000 battles: 37 306 accounts.
    
  • > 12500 battles: 18 272 accounts.
    
  • > 15000 battles: 8 892 accounts.
    
  • > 17500 battles: 4 250 accounts.
    
  • > 20000 battles: 2 039 accounts.
    
  • > 22500 battles: 995 accounts.
    
  • > 25000 battles: 483 accounts.
    
  • > 27500 battles: 250 accounts.
    
  • > 30000 battles: 121 accounts.
    
  • > 32500 battles: 61 accounts.
    
  • > 35000 battles: 26 accounts.
    
  • > 37500 battles: 12 accounts.
    
  • > 40000 battles: 8 accounts.
    
  • > 42500 battles: 6 accounts.
    
  • > 45000 battles: 5 accounts.
    
  • > 47500 battles: 4 accounts.
    
  • > 52500 battles: 3 accounts.
    
  • > 55000 battles: 2 accounts.
    
  • > 60000 battles: 1 account.
  Note that the > 100 battle amounts include the > 500 battles amounts, and so on.
  
  
• Player retention: 42.89% of all accounts that ever played a game were active during the last snapshot, and 92.14% of all accounts having played more than 1000 battles.
  
• Account naming: 9.37% of all accounts begin with the letter s, followed by the letter m with 8.79%. At the end of the spectrum, with 0.05%, are account names beginning with the numeral 8. Talking about numbers, out of all accounts ever having played a game, 43.54% (1 267 576 accounts) contain at least one numeral in their name.
  
• Clan Ratio: Of all accounts having played at least one battle, 8.00% (232 964 accounts) are part of a clan.

Stats from 23. August 2012 to 27. September 2012 (game version 0.7.5)

Spoiler

• Total accounts:
  
  • The EU server has 4.96 million accounts, 550k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The NA server has 2.8 million accounts, 180k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The RU server has 8.77 million accounts, 606k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The SEA server has 586k accounts, 167k more than last snapshot.
    
  • The VN server has an unknown number of accounts - I stopped collecting the data due to the extremely slow performance of the VN server.
    
  • I have no information about the 2 Chinese servers, but calculating based on total account numbers released by Wargaming the number of accounts on the Chinese servers seems to exceed that of all other regions combined.
  All data below is only for the EU server.
  
  
• Played accounts: 2 676 035 accounts have played at least one game, 290 728 more than last snapshot. The ratio of unplayed accounts rises further to 46.05%.
  
• Getting hooked: Of those that played at least one game, 31.45% never even played as many as ten games.
  
• Battles played: The average number of battles per account is 861, or 1938 for those having played last snapshot. Looking only at players having played more than 100 battles, the average is 1902, or 2652 for those having played last snapshot. Let's look into the amount of battles the players have played in some more detail:
  
  • at least 1 battle: 2 676 035 accounts, 1 000 124 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • < 10 battles: 841 698 accounts, 118 172 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 100 battles: 1 195 794 accounts, 728 093 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 500 battles: 706 685 accounts, 541 502 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 1000 battles: 521 784 accounts, 433 312 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 2500 battles: 285 173 accounts, 256 847 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 5000 battles: 129 715 accounts, 122 064 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 7500 battles: 61 872 accounts, 59 403 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 10000 battles: 29 339 accounts, 28 520 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 12500 battles: 13 728 accounts, 13 449 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 15000 battles: 6 376 accounts, 6 271 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 17500 battles: 2 919 accounts, 2 876 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 20000 battles: 1 345 accounts, 1 327 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 22500 battles: 627 accounts, 616 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 25000 battles: 300 accounts, 296 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 27500 battles: 144 accounts, 143 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 30000 battles: 69 accounts, 68 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 32500 battles: 30 accounts, 30 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 35000 battles: 11 accounts, 11 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 37500 battles: 9 accounts, 9 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 40000 battles: 5 accounts, 5 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 42500 battles: 4 accounts, 4 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 47500 battles: 3 accounts, 3 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 52500 battles: 2 accounts, 2 thereof having played last snapshot
    
  • > 55000 battles: 1 account, 1 thereof having played last snapshot
  Note that the > 100 battle amounts include the > 500 battles amounts, and so on.
  
  
• Player retention: 37.37% of all accounts that ever played a game were active during the last snapshot, and 83.04% of all accounts having played more than 1000 battles.
  
• Account naming: 9.4% of all accounts begin with the letter s, followed by the letter m with 9.03%. At the end of the spectrum, with 0.05%, are account names beginning with the numeral 8. Talking about numbers, out of all accounts ever having played a game, 43.28% (1 158 136 accounts) contain at least one numeral in their name.
  
• Clan Ratio: Of all accounts having played at least one battle, 7.65% (204 707 accounts) are part of a clan.

The first data available.

Stats from Release until 13.-15. November 2011:

Spoiler

IMPORTANT NOTE: The data currently covers the lifetime of the server (and in the case of the accounts copied from the Russian server up to 8 months more). A lot of re-balancing has taken place over time, including entire tanks being replaced. Please consider this when looking at tank specific data. As soon as I take the next snapshot I will be able to provide data only for that time-span.


Account stats
Player numbers and more.<p class="bbc_spoiler">Spoiler

• Total accounts: There are over 1.43 million accounts on the EU server, with about 10-15k new accounts being created every day. Interesting to note is that the US server is not far off with nearly 1.14 million accounts but much fewer active players than we do. The Russian server has got nearly 3.8 million registered accounts. I have no information about the 2 Chinese servers.
  
• Played accounts: 827 674 accounts had played at least one game.
  
  
  That means over 42% of all accounts created are never used. Talk about serious attention disorder. I'm wondering if the length of the download is putting potential players off here.
  
• Getting hooked: Of those that played at least one game, over 26% never even played as many as ten games (216 077 accounts). This is actually quite positive, because it also means that nearly 74% of those that tried the game liked it enough to play it more often (611 597 accounts).
  
• Battles played: The average number of battles per account is 698. Let's look into it in some more detail:
  
  • < 30 battles: 295 743 accounts
    
  • > 100 battles: 420 936 accounts
  Once you reached that number of battles, you are pretty much hooked and are likely to keep playing. The average number of battles for players having played more than 100 battles is 1354 battles:
  
  
  • > 500 battles: 251 111 accounts
    
  • > 1000 battles: 174 675 accounts
    
  • > 5000 battles: 17 534 accounts
    
  • > 10000 battles: 760 accounts,
    
  • > 20000 battles: 3 accounts (surprisingly, none of those 3 appear to be part of the accounts that were copied from the Russian server).
• Early adopters: The 47 839 players that created an account on day 1 and did play the game (including beta players), have played on average of 2360 games (with a spread ranging from 1 game up to 23 865 games). Not included are the 163 accounts that are up to 8 months older because they were created on the Russian server and copied over, these have played on average 7787 battles.
  
• Player retention is apparently really good, with nearly 45% of all accounts that ever played a game being active in the last 30 days (370 671 accounts, only 28 336 of those having less than 10 battles), and 36% of all active accounts having played during the last 15 days (295 697 accounts ). Remember that collecting these stats takes several days itself so these numbers are not entirely accurate and will be slightly higher in reality.
  
• Tanks per player: While there is no way of knowing how many tanks a player has in their garage, each player has commanded on average 12.46 different tanks. Accounts with over 500 battles have played 26.31 tanks, accounts with over 1000 battles have seen 30.59 different tanks.
  
• Account naming: 9.6% of all accounts begin with the letter s, followed closely by the letter m with 8.7%. At the end of the spectrum, with not even 0.045%, are accounts beginning with the numeral 8. Taking about numbers, out of all accounts ever having played a game, 282 837 or 34% contain at least one numeral in their name (250 724 ending with a numeral, only 7627 beginning with one).

Open Beta startet Februrary 2011.

Lets hope PGI can get close to this numbers. Since I participated in the Founders Programm to get an alternative to WoT and a competitor (wich is usually good for the customer either of this or the other game).

I am not interpreting this in the meaning of MWO will not make it. But it gives a perspective.

An interesting thing is, how many new accounts you need to get one that is playing more/longer then 10 Games. A potentially paying customer.

[zmeul]

just because we're back to WoT
did you know that from those 4mil accounts WG wave around, roughly 50% (!) of them haven't even played a single battle

[Slanski]

From a business perspective I currently see two flaws in the way this game is marketed:

1. Cash is being accepted for ingame content, suddenly your beta tester is a paying customer. Expectations of customer satisfaction go up exponentially once you pay. Any difference between expectations and delivered product is percieved as lack of quality (quality is alway measured from the expectations horizon of your customer!).

2. The game is still labelled as Open-Beta, despite PGI putting out a policy of no more resets. This is mislabelling, because almost any player singing up for an open-beta believes that their achievements are non permanent and many users will wait for launch reset before getting involved (first glance potential customers think they cannot achieve permanently in this game at the current stage!).

[OlF]

zmeul, on 15 November 2012 - 05:09 AM, said:

just because we're back to WoT
did you know that from those 4mil accounts WG wave around, roughly 50% (!) of them haven't even played a single battle

Arent the lines with "played accounts" and "getting hooked" dealing with this? He made selections regarding this, otherwise I wouldnt have said that it need a couple of accounts to get a paying customer.

€: and of course I wasnt happy that he started with this collection 9 month after they went open Beta. It would have been nicer to have them from their start.

Edited by OlF, 15 November 2012 - 05:24 AM.

[Reoh]

When I'm bored and don't feel like playing (or am just behind on patches) I'll watch MWO Streamers on Twitch. We regularly see people who don't know about the game, or that its free2play, or that its open beta and they can go sign up to play right now. Most of them seem to do that though after asking a few questions. I'd like to see MWO get some more coverage to let people know the game is even there.

[Xantha]

Alex Wolfe, on 06 November 2012 - 08:30 AM, said:

I'd say that's a big part of it, yes.

"Hey guys I want to play this new game, is it fun?"

"Kind of, but first you'll need to spend a few days grinding credits on an underpowered mech with terrible heat efficiency and no fighting chance vs. a custom config, while not receiving any XP and not being able to modify it in any way, or spend money on a completely run-of-the-mill mech you'd be able to buy a dozen of in your second week anyway".

"Gee whiz this sure sounds like a game I'd like to play!"

Blake-damn-it .

And now you'll be able to do it in 3rd person! This will fix everything!

[Joseph Mallan]

Wait! Is the Sky Falling again? Why doesn't anyone ever send me the Memo? Can I go back to playing/testing the game now?

[Teeboy]

negative reinforcement never improves anything

you think you can make a fat person lose weight by constantly telling them they are fat and need to lose weight?

no, it's makes them actually eat more and get fatter (this is a fact)


you keep pointing out the negative aspects of this game it will only cause it to fail as you are convincing people not to play especially if you do it publicly

so go pat yourself on the back for causing fewer people to even want to even try this game

the power of suggestion is way more powerful than you can imagine

[zmeul]

Teeboy, on 15 November 2012 - 05:48 AM, said:

following your dumb logic, yeah it's dumb and I'm saying it to your face
kids in school should not be graded because it invites them to be more stupid !?!? - wtf!

[mekabuser]

bump

[zmeul]

good news everyone
we just passed a milestone - 400000 accounts

Edited by zmeul, 15 November 2012 - 08:43 AM.

[zmeul]

on a side note
if you look at the number of users that voted in the pool created here: http://mwomercs.com/...son-its-coming/
it gives you a rough estimate on the numbers of the player base (active and interested in MWO) - 3231 members have cast votes

from 401078 user accounts only 0.8% (!) give a **** about the game ... that's bad

Edited by zmeul, 17 November 2012 - 04:02 AM.

[Spaartaaa]

open beta? thought mwo is open alpha

[Vassago Rain]

Bloody, on 15 November 2012 - 02:50 AM, said:

i played EQ. Trust me, WoW was grindfree by comparison.

the genre has moved on, GW2 etc show different things, weather that will succeed is another matter

anyway back on topic. I am one of the Beta testers who said the game was not ready for OB. I admit , anyone who asked me in the game forums or my gaming forum buddies what i thought about MWO , i told them flatly not to bother until 5-6 months from now. I still believe this is a horrible representation of Mechwarrior and the BT universe. I am just waiting for PGI to allow me to stop my founders time and then i will log off and return , maybe , in 6 months time to check

This seems to be the plan of the large majority.

[Lyteros]

TL;DR: They had it coming, we warned in the Closed Beta forums for ages => nobody cared and now they will suffer the consequence. But of course its all QQ, whining and we all should live in the dream of a soon™ perfect MWO.

As long as PGI tries to monetize a unfinished, in many parts even broken, game this trend will not continue or stop. They themself said... "minimum viable product".
And I see not really a financial emergency as reason to do it - they cashed out over 5 mil from founders.

IMHO the premature Open Beta will scare away more players then it has done them any good. Some of us have been telling this with analysis and lots of logic / experience since open beta, but noone seems to care. It's of course all just whine and will magically fix itself to perfection.

The people who blindly trust that everything will be good and this is beta (actually its not, no matter which deinfition of beta you use) are just avoiding the inconvenient reality. They feed their dreams of finally having a epic mechwarrior game, instead of contributing to achive this - by pointing out errors, mistake and missmanagement.

From my point of view and my available information PGIs decision making is horrible.

On one hand we have:

• No matchmaking
  
• No Community warfare
  
• less then half of the announced mechs are available for OB
  
• Only 1 game mode
  
• Severe issues with bugs and playability (netcode)
  
• Severe weapon imbalancing (heat - math does not lie.)

On the other hand they spend time to implement things like skins and cockpit swag items...
Who the hell will buy this stuff, if they decide not to "waste their time" on a unfinished / broken game?

These major issues are fixed step by step long after Open Beta now. Now when no more resets are there, when balancing etc. changes per patch. They still experiment with stuff, which they should have done in CB (Artemis shitstorm anyone?)

Who does set the priorities here? The classic TT Random Numbers Generator?

The first impression does count, as much as we like to see it otherwise. And its not like there is no competition for MWO, which does attrackt people to play it and may take everyone who deems MWO too unfinished to bother. And those people who are engaged elsewhere, does anyone see a reason to forfit all they have gained and achived - just to give MWO another try when it's improved?

The signs where there, now the evidence starts to pile up too - we'll see what comes of this in the future.

Edited by Lyteros, 17 November 2012 - 04:39 AM.