1392 replies to this topic

[Name60014]

Cries followed by a lack of dollars would prove effective.

[Airwolf]

Prophet OFC,

While you have several valid points, I don't agree completely with your assessment of "The Process" due to one *major* factor ...

Prophet OFC, on 07 November 2012 - 12:49 PM, said:

Don't think for a minute that new changes haven't been hammered to hell and back by internal elements before they get pushed to us in a BETA (critical) format

It is rather painfully obvious that this is *NOT* the case as evidenced by the multitude of errors (gameplay and otherwise) being reported by the community that were obviously missed by these so-called "internal elements". Either that or these "internal elements" live right next door to hell.

[Airwolf]

P.S. it is also difficult for us to "STAY ON TARGET" when we, as the community, are rarely, if ever, truely informed as to what *exactly* the target is. Especially when the "rules" keep constantly changing from the "expected". We are told to "expect" something .... yet we get something that is different than what we were told.

[Demokin]

EmperorMyrf, on 06 November 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

I just posted about damage reduction in another thread, seems to be a hot topic (rightly so). I don't think they should be touched until ECM hits, and if anything it should be reduced to 1.7 or maybe 1.5, but not as low as 1 or 1.2.

Perhaps the reason you feel it's necessary to go to 1 is because you get dropped very quickly by them? It's likely several mechs using them against you at once, and it's several mechs because of the clear advantage in LRMs now. A small reduction in LRMs should (in theory) reduce damage per missile AND the number of missiles because some people would rather use other weapons.

ok, to this whole thing, i sort of agree but mostly dont. the 1 damage would be most prudent as it would force LRMs to the role they were designed for, as a support damage and NOT a primary damage dealer. The ballistics and energy weapons as well as SRMs (SRMs to a point, but not completely) were meant as primary weapons in most of all of the rest of BattleTech games i have played including TT. Sniping was meant for ER LL and ER PPCs for energy, Ballistic being Gauss or multiple AC 2s, but not meant for missles to be the primary damage dealer at all. Damage rolls on an LRM 10 from TT was 5-10, nowhere near the 18-20 they actually get. in older MW games, their damage was FAR less.

LRMs were always designed to soften targets, not to eliminate them

RragnarR40k, on 07 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

Damn I thought I was playing Streakwarrior online, but hey now I am playing LRMwarrior online.

Hey wouldn't it be cool if they changed it so it was actually Mechwarrior Online ???

AGREED COMPLETELY. BRAWLING needs to be a priority, not using LRMs as artillery all match, lol

[Blizz003]

Mazgazine1, on 07 November 2012 - 08:19 AM, said:

Maybe, just MAYBE they should only take 2 slots.

I'd say definitely. then at least they are double in something. might calm the traditionalists a little bit...

honestly, i'm surprised that more people don't whine about being able to turn at intervals other than 60^o

[Sedit]

120,000 to rearm my lrm boat, no damage taken just to buy ammo. That's crazy money not even worth taking it out of the bay.

[Stormgut]

Prophet, your perspective is a little goofed. We, the players, hold the keys -- especially in multiplayer games. Without the community, there is nobody to play this game against. When they release patches that cause people to rage so hard they quit in frustration (somefraction of whom goes through the trouble of posting vitriol on the forum), they damage the community. And multiplayer gaming communities are already oh-so-eager to move on the next flavor of the month anyway. We're all well aware of how whiny the modern gamer tends to be, but this patch, and its response... this goes way beyond that.

Take a moment and put the "beta" label away on a mental shelf temporarily, and look at the game again. Any developer working on a free-to-play multiplayer title will continue to fix, update, and expand that title as long as it is popular. Even after beta! In that regard, what would objectively distinguish this game from a free-to-play multiplayer title that doesn't slap the "BETA" label on itself at every opportunity? Once you take that self-applied label away, what about this game (a game that asks you, directly, to spend money on it every time you launch it) makes it more forgivable for it to have fun-crushing imbalancing patches than any other game?

If your point is just, "don't freak out so much about problems because the game is still being worked on", then I have news for you: this better be the case regardless of whether or not the game is still calling itself a beta.

And the really crucial thing is, nobody is attacking the process. The process here isn't the problem. But there is a problem: patches should progress the game forward, not cause it to regress. When a patch causes the game to become significantly worse, that makes some serious red flags go up about the future of this project.

It's not like this is the result of the major overhaul of some system that hurts now but will pay off over time; simply put, they buffed something that was already good and nerfed stuff that was already mediocre. This causes a lack of faith in their capability to actually, y'know, make progress with each patch instead of arbitrarily swinging around off-target in different directions. It seems like either they don't know how to play their own game, or they are failing horribly at showing (as opposed to telling) how the game should be played, as well as recognizing how people do want to play it.

[Stingz]

Who says you need all 180 ammo/ton, make use of the 75% free ammo rearm while it lasts.

[Legionar20]

ok, to make it as short as i can

its been like a week im playing this game for the very 1st time since mercenaries 2 back in the day

i love it ! great job

all i see here is a bunch of crying little nutsacks, THE GAME IS IN BETA STILL, which means, everytime a new patch comes, some things will get balanced and some will go OUT OF BALANCE ! its expected , they cannot create somethig fullproof from the get-go. Next patch will fix a lot of things and its expected that again it will de-balance other stuff - ITS BETA !

tired of ppl saying "oh i get pwn now, im quiting" seriously, get a grip and change ur tactic till a new patch comes, ppl like to be "not disturbed" .....

KEEP CALM till the dust settles down ... and stop whinning ...... ALSO good luck with the "refunds" lmaooo, im really curious if u can actually get a refund .... give them ur in game "experience" explanation to why u want a refund, LOL bunch of jokes, little kdis, im sure, do quit, im tired of little kids

[dal10]

artemis missiles cost significantly more

[Les Grossman]

Cpt Grunge, on 07 November 2012 - 12:45 PM, said:

I dont know if you are just trying to be a **** or you truly don't understand what I mean. Les F$$ckingdickinurbuttman you are ******** ********. Go be a **** on some other games forum.

Sorry had to say this...."U mad bro?"

LOL, moving on to mmo's that actually work! See you next Tuesday for more schmitz and giggles!

[Stingz]

dal10, on 07 November 2012 - 01:30 PM, said:

artemis missiles cost significantly more

Yea that too, cause you need to stick fancy tech into every missile to track better.
Better accuracy, but higher price VS Cheap, and some misses.

[Latika]

nice solution to the bugged missiles - make them freaking costly, lol.

[Nicholai Matowski]

Greetings, from the Throne Room of the Matowski Protectorate.

This patch, we have seen many changes. Most of them, have come under fire by the more organized outfits within the game. Those of us who have been here from the beginning, and have taken the time to organize, have been slapped in the face. We have been forced to limit our numbers, and pick up Lone Wolf mercenaries. Not because we are superior in skill or numbers, but because we avail ourselves of modern technology.

It would seem that those of who have striven to make connections and cast off our prejudices are being punished. We are even faced with mech pilots, for they are not warriors in the truest sense of the term, who turn on those they are assigned with, and disable their mech out of some childish need of retribution.

Added to this, is the fact that there seems to be a serious lack of variety on the battlefield. In the periphery, when a conflict happens, lances are fielded with a variety of armaments. Here, in the Inner Sphere, it would seem that everyone relies on long range missile technology, the likes of which I have never seen before. It is near reminiscent of LosTech. I have seen missiles not only fly along the ground only to shoot up and tip down on the head of an Atlas, but I have seen them able to destroy mechs that are completely behind cover out of contact.

As it is, I have to say that my reluctance to continue piloting is waxing, until this technology could be understood better, and countered in some form. I would hate to needlessly die, as I have people to lead.

Thank you for listening.

[Dagger6T6]

[Ceribus]

My LRM boat was fine to rearm only 60K.... I'm assuming you added artemis? those missiles are much more expensive due to the sophisticated homing built into each one

[Zerikin]

Just turn off auto rearm and run at 75% for free. Until they fix that and make ammo too expensive to use.

[SirLANsalot]

The heat system is still being worked on so its a slow process. Right now DHS is working FINE, if your heat efficiency went down its because before it was calculating that your eng HS were double too (which they weren't they were SHS). Any DHS you put on before were properly doubled but the eng was not.

Now with this patch, DHS is applying to BOTH your eng and any DHS you put on. Also go and test it out some, I have found that I run real well at 1.2 efficiency with 4 large lasers and can keep firing them for a long time in chain. During internal testing they found that if they fixed DHS to apply to the eng as well that heat for smaller guns became a non issue and you could fire till the cows came home. Heat management is a skill a LOT of people will fail hard on and its the spark of a good pilot to know how to manage there heat while firing.

Beam boating is a part of the game as many mechs (like the awesome) are MADE for beam load-outs but run very hot and require a lot of skill to manage such a mech. This game is SKILL based not some twitch game like hawken or CoD, skill plays a lot in this game. If you played EvE online you would know that micro managing many things at once is what makes that game tick in PvP, managing your cap and tank while also keeping an eye out for other enemy's that may be coming and knowing when to leave. All of that happens in a matter of minuets in that game all while shooting something. All of those skills go right into MWO, but instead of managing your cap, you are managing your heat and watching your incoming damage. Also to top it all off, you need to know where to AIM at the enemy to down him before you die or take any more damage. This is a high skill based game and those who can't cope with it.....whine.





Anyways 2 crit DHS's are Clan tech and will be coming eventually. However I would suggest that they allow us to use SHS WITH DHS's.

Quote

All we need to do is forbid clan tech to be mounted on anything other than clan chassis, and then the heat balance is permanently fixed.

No.....just No. A great many IS mechs get FAR better when using clan guns/tech in them and dis-allowing that would just break the game the wrong way.

[ArmsLikeNoodles]

This is a long one TLDR version : QQ I want to help in rectifying this patch.

Match Making; Phase 1

* Players can launch into a match as a solo player.
Works?:
Yup still works,
Is it Fun?:
Without team speak coordination, no you will find yourself in groups of players who don't talk or type at all since their Voice comming, or you hear one sided conversations as their typing due to not wanting/having a mic. also The C3 integration is completely unintuitive and not explained in an easy to find, in your face, appealing way.
Suggestions?:
Add a HELP section to the interface just after the "store" button.
This section can hold C3 installation and set up details, also a tutorial section, which can start out as a text page with links to the Youtube tutorials and sticky forum threads (such as the outreach Team speak servers and how to actively join their communities and how to allay concerns for those who don't want to speak or feel socially awkward.). It can then be further developed into having it's own mini tutorial videos or missions when the basic HOW TOs are more clear and concise.
(eg. Targeting
basic: the two reticules and what they do.
Intermediate: lasers, balistic and missle targeting differences lightly touching on convergence effects and how they affect the 3 types.
Advanced: leading a target and explaining mech/torso momentum's effects, advanced modules that affect targeting, artemis, ECM, TAG, NARC)

* Players can launch into a match as a group.
* Player groups cannot be larger than 4 players.
Works?:
yup can't seem to break it and launch with more than 4 (yet).
* Player groups can be 2, 3, or 4 players in size.
Works?:
Yup
Is it Fun?:
Not so much at the moment, it's nice dropping with friends but this isn't X-box live, This is a community using PCs and connecting through various alternate media the Team speak communities alone encourage many rooms of 8-20 players to yammer on and have fun with MWO.
Suggestions?:
At this point due to the secretive nature behind the specifics for the goal of a skill based MM system (totally understandable as you wish to avoid exploits as long as possible while trying to maintain as much disclosure with us as you can) I can only have a dislike for the small drop groups and wait to see the bigger picture. stage 1 of 3 is really not enough information for me to understand the specifics of the MM's direction and offer helpful suggestions at this point.

* The Match Maker still checks to make sure there are even Mech weight classes on both teams.
Works?:
From what I have seen so far, I haven't seen an all atlas team against me without my team being all assault class. and there seems to be a good mix.
Is if Fun?:
I feel it definitely has improved Lonewolfing issues of facing coordinated brawlers and heavies as a hand full of light mechs and assorted others.

Suggestions?:
Nice implementation at this stage but I have to wonder if focusing on pandering to lonewolf's "i cant play as a team in a team game so make my matches exactly 50% balanced on a non player skill related statistic" is more productive than providing easy to find and read information on how to join lonewolf packs and even how to leave lonewolfing behind for Merc units through Teamspeak, C3, mumble what ever (see my help section suggestion).
But then again this is only stage 1 and I may not understand the full direction MM is to take.

New BattleMech:

Centurion CN9-D
Works?: dunno sorry too buisy enjoying my personal game play choices for mechs haven't got round to taking a look at it,
Is it fun?:
from what I have heard yes.
Suggestions?:
Nice to round out the variants but it's even nicer to see an even number of diff mechs (yes I know each mech takes time to implement, and I'm as impatient as everyone else to see what the new heavy and assault mechs will play like. >_<)


Artemis IV FCS Upgrade
* Artemis improves the grouping size of LRM and SRM volleys.
Works?:
Yes it is far more effective than a standard system to the point that only people who have just bought their XL engine and are now cbill-less wouldn't use it.
* Artemis improves the lock on time and tracking strength of LRMs
Works?:
Yes missles doing 90^o turns to pinpoint your soft spot behind a nice large hill without any leeway in hiding and shutting down to break lock is an improvement without peer.
Is it Fun?:
No, from a team and lonewolf perspective I have seen a dramatic shift in discontent from users and victims ranging from damage jelousy, despair at it's wide use, rearm costs complaints and boredom in it's incredible ease of use and effectiveness without very effective counters and the advanced LRM tips and tricks are of little use (eg powering down to break lock, doing so makes you a sitting duck due to the targeting time and inability to restart and move before the volly impacts (even with quick ignition perk)). As the Role warfair stands, scouts are afraid to spot targets due to them needing to stick their head out of cover or full speed run zig zaging to maintain a loc for their team's artillary (which is now almost exclusively artemis LRMs) they may keep the lock enough for one volley if coordinated but the return fire volley will almost certainly nail or sevearly cripple the scout. Mediums are use to brawling on a front line, but as there is no front line they are reduced to chasing scouts that out pace them while hiding in cover or moving to make a front line and getting Artemis enhanced damage wrecking them. Heavy's and Assaults rarely see much of anything but missles coming at them or using missles themselfs.

Key elements of game play such as brawling, dodging and weaving, using terrain cover were very satisfying to a lot of players as it gave the feeling of time well spent learning tips and tricks and how best to use them. this applied knowledge seems barely usefull and may save you from 1 or may be 2 volleys but when there are plenty more volleys out there, the overwhelming odds of dieing to those volleys before delivering significant contribution to the match are stacked against you. this commonly triggers the "if you can't beat em join em" attitude so Artemis and LRM purchases are made.

Suggestions?:
Don't rely on an ECM implementation to fix this situation, validation of their piloting skills is what players are seeking, not a simple case of add component X if they use component Y. I don't have table top experiance but my view of what the Artemis does would have been more along the lines of the tighter missle clusters and increased lock on speed but not the enhanced flight path guidance leave that to TAGs, and NARCs

* Artemis does NOT add guidance to SRMs.
Works?:
I haven't seen SRMs make any 90^o turns, so yup
* Upgrade panel has an Artemis category with two options, Artemis and Remove Artemis
Works?:
Yup
* The Artemis category will not show up if the Mech does not have Missile hardpoints.
Works?:
Yup
* Changing options will automatically upgrade/downgrade any existing eligible missile weapons and swap any eligible missile ammo to the proper type
Works?:
Yup
* The Artemis upgrade can be applied to all standard LRM and SRM launchers, but not Streak SRMs or Narc Beacon launchers
Works?:
Yup but does it need to work if flight path enhancements were not used?
* Price of the upgrade includes cost of the upgrade itself plus cost of the ammo if there was not enough in the inventory
Works?:
Yup
* Ability to select the Artemis upgrade will depend on availability of sufficient slots and tonnage
Works?:
Yup
* When viewed in the Loadout, all Artemis capable weapons will take up one extra slot and weigh one more ton than usual when Artemis is selected
Works?:
Yup
* For any weapons that are Artemis eligible, only the Artemis version will show in the equip list
Works?:
Yup
* Similarly, only Artemis ammo will appear for the ammo for those weapons
Works?:
Yup

GAMEPLAY

* Double heat sinks are now 1.4 times as effective as standard heat sinks. This includes DHS's that you place on your Mech as well as those integrated into the engine.
Works?:
Yup
Is it Fun?:
I personaly don't use heat intensive weapons but it sems to me with the increase in weapon heat from previous patches the double heatsinks are there simply to absorbe crit slots and keep the status quoe as opposed to improving heat situations. I don't find loosing crit slots to be much of a sense of improvement to veterans. new players will notice the difference they provide. as such I'm indifferent on it's impact to my fun as I was hoping for improvements to what I was used to, not a re-baseline we must accept.
Suggestions?:
I understand why they were changed and it may open up a few new load out possibilities beyond my limited discoveries but the only suggestion I have is the way it was communicated would have been received better as a straight up "We don't want things scaling out of control so we re-baselined the heat situation." instead of "Here's a shiney new Cbill sink you have all been lusting after, oh and we're nerfing the bejeezus out of everything it affects."

* Trial Mechs now get locked when taken into gameplay.
Works?:
Yup
* If you leave early, the Trial Mech you were using is locked into the game until it finishes.
Works?:
Yup
* Mechs with Weapon Bay Doors can toggle the doors open/closed with ‘/’ slash
Works?:
Yup
* Catapult and Centurion now have weapon bay door indicator lights in the cockpit. Green for Open, Yellow for Closed, Red for Destroyed.
Works?:
No, their not very intuitive to spot, it may be worth adding to a corner of the hud like the vision modes.(doors O/C with the green, yellow and red highlight for their state).
* Fixed a source of de-synchronization issues (result should be better hit-box detection)
Works?:
Fast mechs still teleport a little after firing but I have seen improvement in hit detection.


WEAPONS
see my earlier comments on double heat sinks, nothing to add
* AC/20 heat reduced from 7 to 6
* Small Pulse Lasers were only generating 50% of the amount of heat they should have been. This is now fixed.
* Small Lasers, Medium Pulse Lasers, and Large Pulse Lasers were only generating 75% of the amount of heat they should have been. This is now fixed.


MAPS

Forest Colony

* There is now a beached ship splitting the large water expanse. This provides a new area of cover for people engaging long-range enemies.
Works?:
as long as there are no Artemis LRM volleys on their way it works.
Is it Fun?:
It definately creates a new focal point on the battlefield other than the mountain passes and caves which is fun for diversity and gives brawlers a wider array of aproaches, but it also takes away the risk Vs reward excitement of the path least trodden with the wide open water killing field. Also it has increased the likely hood of water assaults being less of a coordination and pilot skill challenge and more of a race to the ship. I feel the true value of these changes realy won't be seen till artemis LRMs are not such a defining game play element.

NEW: Forest Colony Snow

Forest Colony Snow is now part of the random map rotation. During the winter, temperatures drop to (-25^oC), making quite a frosty glow around this familiar area - turning this map we know and love into a winter wonderland of low temperatures, frozen ground, with an icy chill in the air.
Works?:
Yup
Is it Fun?:
It's a nice easy implamentation of two already existing and tested environment elements, Forest Colony and heat disipation friendly temps. I feel this is resurrecting the old arguments about those sniperfests which are now curbed due to a closer field of view instead of the dark forest atmosphereic effects which seems to have caused more annoyance than nostalga.
Sugestion?:
This is definately a case of very nice developers wanting to appeas both sides of the old Forest colony argument rather than spending resources on stimulating new styles in areas such as post sunset environments, we have night vision for quite some time and only forest colony's cave to use it in. I am sure there are many other environments the Cryengine 3 is capable of handling that the environmental artists are chomping at the bit for such as low gravity, celestial skylines, tall grass, vacumes and heck why not try high orbital platforms or sky cities.



BUG FIXES

* Heat value will no longer desync for clients when a Mech does not contain any external heat sinks
* The Catapult K2 now has correct geometry/textures when swapping out PPCs.
* New equipment on Mechs will default to weapon group 1 instead of not being set
* Missiles will now correctly explode at their max range
* Locking animation will no longer play when firing SRM if LRM/SSRM ran out of ammo
* Machine gun will no longer fire when Mech has been destroyed
Realy? I thought it looked cool for those harmless bullets to spray around as the mech collapsed with a jammed fire control system.
* Catapult arms will once again blow off correctly when side torso has been destroyed
* Greatly reduced Mech ragdoll jittering
* Fix an issue where the cockpit and/or arms will randomly jitter
* LRMs will no longer behave incorrectly (spin wildly) when fired at corners of objects at close range
* Ammo counter will update with each volley fired
* Damage glow amount and size reduced

Edited by ArmsLikeNoodles, 07 November 2012 - 02:03 PM.

[KageRyuu]

I'm a Battletech fan boy, not a MechWarrior fan boy, there is a difference, a small one but a significant one, regardless I won't be boycotting or asking for refunds like some of these other jokers, but I will sure as hell voice my opinion on a game that's cost me one and a half times the admittance fee to any other Triple A game out there. There may be times that I'm heated or down right raging on a subject and thus less than coherent, but seeing as this isn't a professional job for me, don't expect me to act professional 100% of the time. Now, I do agree, the process is one that works, they release something, if we don't like X they know to fix X, if some people don't like Y but most do, they are free to tweak it a little until most are happy with it, but when everyone loves Z and then they change Z for the worst, then they sure as hell should expect people to light their torches and grab their pitchforks, because it's human nature to react violently to undesired change.