3696 replies to this topic

[Agent of Change]

ooh ooh i have the best constructive feedback...

AS of 2:25 pm EST the poll on the 28 PAGE original discussion about this very issue has 851 votes cast and NINTEY PERCENT thats right a 9 with a 0 after it percent of you most active and vocal players ARE DEEPLY OPPOSED TO THE IDEA. ~4.5% are indifferent to it and only about ~4.5% are for it.

Does that mean anything to you?

[Chrithu]

Okey so my constructive feedback is this:

First of all as many ppl have said and Russ already acknowledged it is a problem during the podcast: Allowing 3rd Person gives an overview advantage to those using it. Russ' answer to that problem was to practically seperate the crowd into 3rd person and 1st person users. That's not quite what he said, but it is what it will boil down to in my view.

But my more important concern is the reason why you guys want to implement it now allthough you allways said before you didn't want 3rd Person: I simply do not believe that 3rd person would help new players to better adapt to torso and mech movement being indepent of each other. There is enough indication for your torso and movement heading in the first person HUD. I truely doubt that seeing the mech from behind is a better indication of that and thus I doubt it is needed to solve that problem.

That being said you know better than me that implementing a proper 3rd person cam that works flawless in narrow environments (street canyons, tunnels) is not an easy task and will tie up development resources that in my view would be better used to create a proper ingame movement/gameplay tutorial.

To end this post I'd also like to say if you'd focus more on the problems at hand since early beta (missing ingame lobby with textchat and missing voicechat for any type of team, just to name the most pressing ones) you wouldn't need to think about what's needed to get even the last uninterested player to play your game. You'd better think more about how to keep those that are there already. If the forums are any indication you're about to lose a bunch of ppl if you don't get your priorities right like soonish.

Edit:To be really constructive here's an alternative to both a 3rd person view and a tutorial. Add a third indication to the HUD. A Vector pointing from the center of your crosshair towards the projected direction of your movement. It's length reflects your speed. Meaning if you walk straight forward there is an arrow from the center of your crosshair pointing straight up. if you turn your torso 45° to the left the arrow points in a 45° direction to the upper right of the screen. You get the rest I assume.

Edit 2: Another problem with having both views: They aim differently possibly allowing 3rd person users shot's at angles that 1st person users aren't capable of. I have not yet seen a SINGLE game featuring both views that got this very point even close to right.

Edited by Jason Parker, 14 November 2012 - 11:38 AM.

[Ozzalin]

My feedback is:

You said all along, and i quote:

No 3rd person view. "We want the player to feel they are not just the mech, they are the pilot inside the mech"

My question is: Why lying about it, and suddenly change the whole game?

I think it would be VERY constructive for you guys to explain that one to us all...
Especially for the thousands of founder members who bought your expensive packs on this promise.

But you won't answer us with honesty and integrity right?
We are still waiting...

P.S.
What will happen with RAZER's amazing 1st person ARTEMIS cockpit controller? You told them already? As you know NO one will buy that expensive piece of hardware to play a 3rd person game right? No need to, i already sent them a mail regarding your decision, as i was about to buy this immersive controller myself, of course i changed my mind, and also told them i wont buy it until i am 100% sure MWO will stay an FPS.

But with so many lies already...Can we really trust you in the future?

Edited by Ozzalin, 15 November 2012 - 05:31 AM.

[Rishkdia]

I am not a fan at all. If it gets new people in without being discouraged it is somewhat tolerable. Since you would get to see things better that are in your periphery, it gives them an advantage as those things might not be on the minimap.

[torraque]

I am very strongly opposed to this idea. I think a better way to teach people how to control their 'mech would be an actual training mission. 3rd person view in the way it has been suggested would serve only to divide the playerbase, and in a world where it is combined with first-person players, almost force players to use it or be playing at a disadvantage.

[Dagger6T6]

the 3rd person view is not the answer to making new pilots feel all warm and fuzzy... just because a person new to mechs can't grasp the 3d mechanics of a torso and legs.

a robust training program is... and make the training area prominent from within the game... the training videos are a good start i guess but make them more visible, not some obscure Youtube link. a key map for keyboard functions, some illustrations and some insight. WEAPONS CHART and info about weapons...

the only thing a 3rd person view is going to do for new players is give them a nice birds eye view of their charred and busted mech when the rest of player base cores them like an apple

[Alexa Steel]

F lan Ker, on 14 November 2012 - 11:25 AM, said:

S!

In short..3rd person view implemented and MWO does not differ in any way from today's FPS shooters. Say goodbye to SIMULATOR. If people are too lazy or incapable to learn how to steer a mech in cockpit view, then they are playing the wrong game. Not everything needs to be a pampering experience filled with instant gratification and buckets of achievement medals...

... eh what does THIRD PERSON perspective have to do with "other" FIRST PERSON shooters?

[xhrit]

Vassago Rain, on 14 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

It's good we completely eliminate the very fancy cockpit from the gameplay equation.

I actually would not mind a 'cockpit off' toggle. They had it in MW2 (along with 3rd person).

[DeathofSelf]

No. For the same reasons everyone else has stated.

If you feel new players really need to have a 3rd person view to understand something as simple as torso twist, give them a training area to do it.

Edit: Honestly, with some kind of in game tutorial/training ground, you wouldn't need 3rd person view for the reasons Russ gave.

Edited by DeathofSelf, 14 November 2012 - 11:54 AM.

[Quxudica]

Khavi Vetali, on 14 November 2012 - 11:28 AM, said:

Horrible idea. Absolutely horrible.

780-ethed, and counting.

[Dukarriope]

As much as I like the idea of having a third person camera (I love being able to see a big robot stomping about, especially my own), I would only allow it in a replay or spectator mode, or a single player or purely cooperative campaign/training mode. The core gameplay that's all combat should remain first person.

As I just posted, the best way to explain the game's mechanics is not to just toss a video at people, it's to implement a forced tutorial on first launch. Make it skippable maybe, if you want, but make damn sure the player sees it when they first start the game. Make it an actual interactive tutorial, training mode that explains all mechanics clearly, one by one even. I'd perhaps even refer to Blacklight: Retribution - a game that, even in beta, has a training mode. MechWarrior Online has always been pitched so far to be a challenging team game, but it sounds like PGI wants to kind of dumb this game down to suit the newbies.
Yes, it's great to make a game accessible, but cracking the core gameplay to make it simpler is just wrong.


Again, make a proper training mode, allow third person in it if you desire, but keep that damn well out of the actual game play. The way the game is going lately makes me feel it would have been better if PGI had kept this a single player concept. Which is a bit disappointing given that I still see lots of potential in this game. As I'm sure everyone else who gave their $120 does.
For me, it was a major step, given that I've practically never played a MechWarrior game before this.

Edited by Dukarriope, 14 November 2012 - 11:35 AM.

[Thatnanoguy]

Idk why everyone is so up in arms about third person. They said that you could choose to play in gametypes that either allowed it or not. If you want to play 1st person, then do so, if third person is your thing, then by all means do it. Limiting the features of a game for silly reasons like "i don't want it so no one should have it" is ridiculous. I for one (being a former chromehounds player) would love to see third person implemented into this game giving different games for each to make everybody happy.

My two cents. Hope they stay on track for third person.

[Jabilac]

I am in favor of keeping the current 1st person view only.

I think that if people are having problems learning to play this game that a Tutorial Level be developed to allow people to learn this games specific nuances.

A toggle that centers and locks your cockpit to your mechs legs could fix this problem. Would allow people that don't "understand" how this game works to play and adjust accordingly.

I started this game with a barebones understanding of how MechWarrior worked. I wasn't sure what a Variant was, or a Hard Point. I didn't get why there were so many different Mechs of the same kind available. I was able to adjust to this games controls relatively shortly (about 15 matches) and now I understand all the basics. Part of the "fun" is being challenged...

[pesco]

Aside from the fact that the feature is pretty lame -- if you must:

Render no enemies that would not be rendered from the pilot's perspective.
Render the world that would not be seen by the pilot in an abstracted view with no dynamic elements, in a greyed-out shade or something to make it clear where enemies could be hidden.
Make sure aiming isn't easier than in 1st person!

[Laurin]

Absolutely NO
because you can look around corners.

[Joe3142]

PGI should just concentrate fixing the massive amount of bugs and problems, Instead of messing around with 3rd person hoping the bugs will magically go away.

[Smokeyjedi]

Talk about the wrong direction of "immersion" that MWO so deserves........borderline sim is a more suitable playstyle for stompy robots.......... keep your eyes where they factually belong........

[TheMightyWashburn]

Yay. some of my posts about this were locked Not sarcasm. I really shouldnt be allowed to make a new thread right after they say some stupid **** like this

I still think polls are good though because they give core info faster.

[MaddMaxx]

Quxudica, on 14 November 2012 - 07:49 AM, said:

I would like a sombrero and white suit/red neckerchief for my Jenner. That may soften my views on this if it happens (not really).


Gears of War is actually a 1.5 over-the-shoulder view, not third person. I can't really think of a straight up third person pure shooter.. Team Fortress I guess?

Try here for 3rd person info.

http://www.giantbomb...pective/92-464/

[Felicitatem Parco]

In my opinion, allowing/encouraging players to "learn" the game in 3rd person will make them more dependent on 3rd person as a fully-integrated feature to be used in all battles. You can't put in a 3rd person training facility and expect players to be happy when they can't actually use it in-game.

Seeing that the demand for 3rd person training is so strong that this demand might get it into the game, it's only a matter of time before said demand is applied to integrating 3rd person into the mainstream gameplay.