2926 replies to this topic

[Aahz HHGD]

Garth
Your problem now is you have created a serious credibility issue with your core investers
It is obvious we over whelmingly dont want this, nor do we want you spending any time or effort on it when there are so many bugs and features left not working or not fixed
We no longer have faith in you or this company
You tell us one thing and do another
This isnt the first issue we found out about in a pod cast
The 4 man change was first mentioned in a pod cast and immediatly implemented against all of our complaints
You have ruined the last two weeks of drops for most of us in organized units and now you spring this crap on us
There are any numbers of features that would help game play
Try getting us a working Joystick
Fix the match making so we can go back to dropping as teams (in your own words this is a team based game)
Fix the collision
Fix the lag sheild
Fix the mech lab

We have lost faith in PGI and personally I am with holding any more money until I see a game I feel comfortable investing in once again

[Amadeaus]

We dont want this option the original post on it was yet again locked by the admins. You claim ppl want this option. Yet it was proven that the majority doesnt want it.

Why ask our opinion on something, WHEN YOU DONT LISTEN. This is what i want in it, to bad so sad. If you dont like it leave.

[Byk]

3rd person view would be pretty cool in some cases I think. It would be nice to have the option for those who want it. Take a deep breath, thank you for what you guys are doing. The game is awesome and is steadily molding into a great game.

[MechFrog1]

This is just awful news and it's becoming quite clear that someone in power at PGI is the one pushing 3rd person and not any requests from the fans. Split your player base and the game dies. Mix 1st and 3rd and everyone will just play 3rd for the advantage. Of course plenty of people who actually paid money for founders will leave before that happens.

Consider my faith in the devs shattered.

[MacKerris]

Garth Erlam, on 16 November 2012 - 03:39 PM, said:

Just to make sure everyone, well, actually read that and listened to what Russ said, we don't plan to add 3rd person. We're looking at what it would require of us if we did.

Garth,

I like many here I work in the corporate world where time is money. In that world you don't spend time looking at third person when what you have now is broken. If you are spending your limited resources on 3rd person, someone is planning on implementing it.

Edited by MacKerris, 16 November 2012 - 04:57 PM.

[Skooma]

I don't think it would hurt to have a third person view, but I think it would require a separate playlist so that matchmaking would remain balanced.

[MechFrog1]

Skooma, on 16 November 2012 - 04:59 PM, said:

I don't think it would hurt to have a third person view, but I think it would require a separate playlist so that matchmaking would remain balanced.

The game doesn't have enough players to be splitting them into separate queues.

[AllOuttaBubbleGum]

mint frog, on 16 November 2012 - 05:01 PM, said:

The game doesn't have enough players to be splitting them into separate queues.

Then to hell with third person view. I hope they don't implement it at all. Sounds like something begging for imbalance and as a gamer my attention span is short and way shorter if something doesn't work or changes for the worse.

[RG Notch]

I'm just curious for the people that believe it will remain limited or not be CW did you also believe when them when they said 3rd person was not an option until the distant future when they could remove inbalances? Or did you know they would change their minds? and are they set on this or will they consider the limitations and separation to be mistakes eventually and add it to all modes?
Once you start changing fundamentals to try to get a player base that really isn't into your game you begin the slide down to pandering to anyone with a buck to keep alive. Either stick to your guns and make the best 1st person locked sim or go down the rabbit hole trying to compete with arcadish FPS type games.

[Alois Hammer]

GenDread, on 16 November 2012 - 04:15 PM, said:

so apparently you guys didnt check the following pages where Garth said this :

Posted Today, 03:39 PM
Just to make sure everyone, well, actually read that and listened to what Russ said, we don't plan to add 3rd person. We're looking at what it would require of us if we did.

just putting it out there .... its on page 3 or 4

I've lost count of the times some game company used that precise phrase, "don't plan to," then later (sometimes much later, sometimes the next freakin' day) announced the precise opposite because, you know, "our plans changed." Spending even 5 minutes on this "what if we add it" scenario really gets me feeling like there's another "Well we didn't plan to last week, but..." coming down the line.

Save the what if brainstorming for things like "What if we wanted to fix the new player experience by adding a tutorial level to teach them how to maneuver their mech."

[zer0imh]

Aahz HHGD, on 16 November 2012 - 04:50 PM, said:

Garth
Your problem now is you have created a serious credibility issue with your core investers
It is obvious we over whelmingly dont want this, nor do we want you spending any time or effort on it when there are so many bugs and features left not working or not fixed
We no longer have faith in you or this company
You tell us one thing and do another
This isnt the first issue we found out about in a pod cast
The 4 man change was first mentioned in a pod cast and immediatly implemented against all of our complaints
You have ruined the last two weeks of drops for most of us in organized units and now you spring this crap on us
There are any numbers of features that would help game play
Try getting us a working Joystick
Fix the match making so we can go back to dropping as teams (in your own words this is a team based game)
Fix the collision
Fix the lag sheild
Fix the mech lab

We have lost faith in PGI and personally I am with holding any more money until I see a game I feel comfortable investing in once again

the three main glaring problems a first time mechwarrior player sees.

they should give these three problems the top priority to fix... not this 3rd person view nonsense.

Edited by zer0imh, 16 November 2012 - 05:08 PM.

[Tuvar]

Piloting an Atlas alot I've had scouts stand under my cockpits field of view. This is difficult once collision is put back in, but hiding in the small area behind me or infront of me would be negated if at 3rd person you could zoom out far enough to expand your vision more so than people playing in First person can see. Thats my only concern with it to be honest since it is a competative edge to be outside the opponets field of vision.

[J93653017]

This will be an absolute deal breaker for me. I'm a founder and if they implement 3rd person into the game it will ruin it for me. This is a simulator game. If you want to annoy all the hardcore fans to get a bigger player base, you will alienate the true fan base and the other people won't stick with the game anyways.

[Wired]

nitra, on 16 November 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

It would require to much.

To Much, or not To Much. That is the question...

[BFett]

3rd person is only acceptible if it is done in the same way as Mech Commander2 meaning if your teammates don't see them you don't see them. Please only let 3rd person be for the Battlegrid setting.

[Insidious Johnson]

Garth Erlam, on 16 November 2012 - 02:59 PM, said:

Hi Mechwarriors,

So Russ let slip in an interview with No Guts No Galaxy we are looking into a 3rd person view option. It seems a lot of people are unhappy with this, so we’d like to explain our thought process here.

For reference, we also strongly recommend listening to Russ’s comments, as he provides a clear case for our approach.

Over the course of development, we’ve had a huge number of requests for a 3^rd person camera option. At this early stage, it’s something we feel that warrants further analysis, understanding and exploration.

MechWarrior Online is, and will always be, a game focused on 1st person combat in Mechs. That experience is sacrosanct to the classic Mechwarrior experience.

If we find that there is a relevant role for an optional 3^rd person camera mode, then then would simply be an additional option that, if you don’t want it, won’t affect you. Bryan will be writing a detailed Command Chair post on this (he's currently at 40,000 feet, and not by Jump Jetting) with more details. For now, be assured we're acutely aware of past problems with 3rd person view, and will make sure those same issues are thoroughly addressed. We wouldn’t settle for anything less.

Cheers,
The MechWarrior Online Team

Your Rohipnol reasoning is wrong. Just plain wrong. They have a captive fawning audience here that believes PGI/IGP can do no wrong. More than once have they been called into question for dubious actions which have been cause for debate and distrust. I contend here that they are in a position to abuse that trust and are blitzkrieging in that direction. I believe that march is a foregone conclusion since they have chosen not to even address the viability of several other good options put forth in many instances: training grounds, less grind, better new player experience, and a host of other suggestion threads. I don't know what PGI will do. I do know they can do better than this.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

Hi, I came back to say change my previous indifference on the 3rd person view. It should only exist in certain circumstances, listed below:

• After the match during a replay
  
• During a tutorial video/match

I say this for a couple reasons:


If you could use 3rd person in spectator mode during a match you could give feedback to your team that is otherwise from a 1rst person view considered unfair... no matter how small of a window that may be it'd be a big issue PGI would have to deal with.

The replay function would allow for full camera control, similar to being a dead zombie in left for dead 2, you can zoom out and view the entire field if you like... and other than that the ability to save/share good battles would be invaluable and quite nostalgic I might add.

The tutorial video wouldn't allow you to toggle 3rd person view, it would just show you a visual representation of the 'mechs movement. Even if there's no room for a real tutorial video/map for acquiring targets, 'mechs movement being shown in the lab would be invaluable.

So there are two solutions/additions/functions whatever you want to call it which add to the goodness of the game that nobody can really nay say.

@ the guy above me: I don't think you'd win, but the passion is duely noted. Good news for you: they did say they wouldn't go against the founders, many of which could be the core of the future of this game. It is my belief they will take similar steps to the ones I, among many, have presented.

Edited by M4NTiC0R3X, 16 November 2012 - 05:27 PM.

[Kalthios]

Very upsetting that all game developers want to make arcade games. Instead of making a 3D camera, can you please add in some features that add to the piloting a giant robot experience?

[CyBerkut]

The main thrust of what Russ said in that podcast seems to be concern over getting new players in and helping them come to grips with the torso twist vs leg orientation issues.

With the challenges inherent to running a Free to Play game, I won't blow that concern off as being completely trivial. How far from 'completely trivial' it is, would be debatable to say the least.

In my view, if a 3PV needs to be made available for some time to new players, to help them "get it" (ie. grasp the torso vs legs orientation issues), then that should be done in a training grounds map. The training grounds would afford players the opportunity to experiment with control setups, etc., without messing up games for teammates that count for something. People that want to see what their mechs look like from the outside, and/or get screen shots or video for machinema could do that in there as well. Once newbies feel like they have a grip on how things work, they can put on their big boy armor and jump into regular matches... with 1PV only. The obvious potential downsides are that you would need to devote resources to implementing, and hosting such an arrangement... and there would be a split in the community. The upside is that it gives you a way to keep what appears to be the majority of your existing user base placated. It appears that most of the hard core players who have already gotten off their wallets want to keep their play in 1PV. These are folks who have already demonstrated they are there for you when it comes to the rubber meeting the road... and that is most certainly *not* a trivial thing.

As for actual matches and the forthcoming community warfare... 1PV players should not have to play with 3PV players. If there is sufficient demand for 3PV play by enough players to warrant it, then give them their own 3PV matches and community warfare. I personally doubt that the numbers warrant that, but I readily admit that I'm not in a good position to judge that from where I stand.

For 1PV matches such as we have now, there should not be any 3PV play, nor should there be any 3PV spectator view after death. (Teams on voice comms could benefit from what spectators see and pass along).

If a replay feature ever comes along, a 3PV in there would be fine... as the match would be over, and no advantage could be gained at that point. But that is a very different issue, and doesn't really address the concern that Russ seemed to be voicing.

There... no cussing, no threat, no demand for a refund.

[Lugh]

GenDread, on 16 November 2012 - 04:20 PM, said:

page 3 or 4 garth posted this ...

Posted Today, 03:39 PM
Just to make sure everyone, well, actually read that and listened to what Russ said, we don't plan to add 3rd person. We're looking at what it would require of us if we did.

Which is a colossal waste of time, when they could be doing other things. Fire your project manager Russ.