2926 replies to this topic

[guardian wolf]

*Looks at page number* Man we keep this up we'll outdo the pony trolls' thread.

But seriously. The current 1PV system right now, is good. I started and it took me a couple matches to figure it out, but now, I got it. We do not need 3PV, HOWEVER, PLEASE READ AFTER THIS AS WELL. I am not going to start arguing about how it's a bad idea, until I get something that I can look at, and judge, and then, let the devs know if either A) it's a good system, or B ) it either needs to be done away with completely or redone. People, we are arguing over a hypothetical system that NONE, of us have seen. So in the end, this argument is moot, as we really have nothing to work with, to gauge this 3PV. For all we know, it could make the MW4 3PV look old school, and backwards, and instead have a system in place to keep people from cheating. We must be willing to let the devs have a chance to show us what they got, rather than just trying to mindlessly shut them down from the start. Remember, people respond to things better, if you try to negotiate with them, be reasonable, tell them a structured list. I know I'm asking you to act like adults, and debate, like adults, instead of whining like children. If we whine like children, then NOTHING will get done. But if we trade ideas back and forth about HOW, a system could be made, that would satisfy BOTH, parties of this argument, then things usually get done along those lines. Both sides need to compromise a little so we all can achieve what we want.

And if you read nothing else but this, please either start acting like adults, or be silent, and leave at your own discretion, because you are not helping anyone.

Edited by guardian wolf, 06 July 2013 - 04:15 PM.

[Gremlich Johns]

Ed Steele, on 06 July 2013 - 03:08 PM, said:

PGI did not out and out lie. PGI used "lawer-speak" which could be interpreted as "yes"or "no" and they can not be pinned to either.

I beg to differ, Paul did and he represented PGI when he said what he said about 1PV and no 3PV. But, that's business - chase the Benjamins at whatever cost to veracity.

[Julius Septim]

Make 2 Gamemodes (1 with 3rd Person and one with 1st Person) Problem solved.... The Arcade Kids can play 3rd Person and the Simulation likers can play 1st. So hard to do that? I think its easier, but wait oh the server cost... rofl

[Belorion]

The Man of Steel, on 06 July 2013 - 05:07 PM, said:

Make 2 Gamemodes (1 with 3rd Person and one with 1st Person) Problem solved.... The Arcade Kids can play 3rd Person and the Simulation likers can play 1st. So hard to do that? I think its easier, but wait oh the server cost... rofl

That is what they are doing...

http://mwomercs.com/...vs-41-answered/

[Gremlich Johns]

SJ SCP Wolf, on 06 July 2013 - 06:42 AM, said:

Apparently you cannot read your own text, because you would rather be ignorant and wrong. Don't ever quote me again. You make me look bad.

You do not need any help looking bad, mate.

you get an ignore from me as well. Seriously, mate, how you you get through life that way? I've read some of your other postings, look to your spelling. It can help your position sometimes.

Edited by Gremlich Johns, 06 July 2013 - 07:49 PM.

[Gremlich Johns]

Belorion, on 06 July 2013 - 06:34 PM, said:

That is what they are doing...

http://mwomercs.com/...vs-41-answered/

That is what we HOPE they are doing....

[Morhadel]

Ed Steele, on 06 July 2013 - 03:08 PM, said:

While I agree that they were deceptive to the founders, PGI did not out and out lie. PGI used "lawer-speak" which could be interpreted as "yes"or "no" and they can not be pinned to either.

The 2nd biggest reason why the only good lawyer is a dead lawyer.

[CyBerkut]

Belorion, on 06 July 2013 - 06:34 PM, said:

That is what they are doing...

http://mwomercs.com/...vs-41-answered/

Actually, that is not what they are doing. They are doing a 1PV queue, and a mixed 1PV & 3PV queue.

From that link:
"Of course as promised out of the gates players will be able to choose 1PV and 3PV mixed or just 1PV."

I'm not necessarily against that, but it is different and it does open the door to the concern some have... that the door has been cracked open to possibly do away with the 1PV-only queue eventually, should PGI choose to seize upon some rationale to justify it.

[Julius Septim]

I think more Player will ignore 3PV (or just look at it sometimes) and use mainly 1PV, i mean seriously wich advantage shall it give to you if u use it? to see when a light stands behind your Heavy/Assault Mech? And then? it doesnt make you turn or move faster anyways, Aiming will be not easier and the Movement itself wouldnt be neither "oh i can see my Mech in Full View" and thats it, totally useless and just Arcade kiddie nonsens....

Why i am Angry about this Crap is that they waste their time with it instead bringing in more Maps, Gamemodes, Bugfixes and Balancing.... noooo 3rd Person View for a less Percentage of the Community who keeps on crying for it. Pffffft Prioritys failed

Edited by The Man of Steel, 07 July 2013 - 04:40 AM.

[Listless Nomad]

The Man of Steel, on 07 July 2013 - 04:38 AM, said:

I think more Player will ignore 3PV (or just look at it sometimes) and use mainly 1PV, i mean seriously wich advantage shall it give to you if u use it? to see when a light stands behind your Heavy/Assault Mech? And then? it doesnt make you turn or move faster anyways, Aiming will be not easier and the Movement itself wouldnt be neither "oh i can see my Mech in Full View" and thats it, totally useless and just Arcade kiddie nonsens....

Why i am Angry about this Crap is that they waste their time with it instead bringing in more Maps, Gamemodes, Bugfixes and Balancing.... noooo 3rd Person View for a less Percentage of the Community who keeps on crying for it. Pffffft Prioritys failed

How about being able to see over hills or around corners/buildings

[Stone Wall]

yay 3rd person, can't wait for more options. Thanks!

[van Uber]

SJ SCP Wolf, on 06 July 2013 - 08:04 PM, said:

Anyway back on topic

3PV isn't killing the game, the sky isn't falling, and North Korea still can't nuke anyone. Move on to the next cry moar topic.

What makes you so sure?

The Devs have publicly stated that one of their major concerns is dividing the playerbase into too small fragments and it is the primary reason we do not get more gamemodes currently. This is in stark contrast to splitting every existing and future gamemode in half.

Obviously PGI feel very confident that 3PV will bring in enough players to compensate. Why not share some of that knowlege to ease our minds?

The initial reaction towards 3PV was very negative here on the boards, but we were told we only represent a fragment of the playerbase. That may be so, but why not go public with the data that explains that this is the most wanted feature according to PGI. The source is unknown to us, just that it is not from these boards.

Finally, we were told not to worry that other features, such as CW would suffer, because it had only one person tied at it at the time (Bryan). But how much resources is tied to it now? Bryan will hardly do the implementation and testing himself. So a little more transparancy would be nice.

Edited by van Uber, 07 July 2013 - 11:50 AM.

[Julius Septim]

Listless Nomad, on 07 July 2013 - 06:04 AM, said:

How about being able to see over hills or around corners/buildings

And then? u see on your seismic that the Mech stays or walk there but when they make it how it have to be it doesnt affect your sensors AND your line of sight neither because your Pilot still can´t see the enemy Mech, what means - no advantage for lrm boats and so on u still have to walk over the hill to "see" the enemy and the only advantge u might have is that u know where to walk to get not slowed, whats still not such a Obvious Arcade kiddie "pwned roflmao yeahyeah" thing is because this situation happens in 1st Person too over and over again...

A good 3rd Person view is still one who doesnt affect the line of sight. Oh you know the map and discovered the Fog of war but your Pilot still CAN`T look around corners or look behind things, if they do so that he can, this Game will Die in a Heartbeat and this is what i can Promise.

Thats why i think 3rd Person View is and should be only a Graphic Goodie, nothing more nothing less... Mechwarriors can´t look around Corners and thats what those Arcade Kiddies expect, when they make it right it will NOT happen and discussion is done.

Ps: if its done right u may see on third Person the Impacts on your rear Armor but still not the Mech who hits you, aslong your Mech got no rear Cameras it would be Magic, in a Mechwarrior Game.. huehuehue sorry

3rd Person is a Waste of time when the Game got more Issues then some missing Graphic goodies, just the simple truth. If they make it better then that this Game WILL die.. that simple brought enough Arquments for it.
When they implement "launch a camera drone there and there (instert location) THEN and only then 3rd Person is a Gamebreaking thing!

Edited by The Man of Steel, 07 July 2013 - 12:58 PM.

[Grimmnyr]

139 pages of comments and nary a PGI response other than the occaisional "volunteer moderator". 3PV is happening and will be implemented the way PGI wants, no matter what we want, so we either have to hang on for the ride and see how it goes, or move on to some other game.

[Julius Septim]

You really expect an answer from PGI here? I dont think they even know this thread exist.

[Crockdaddy]

Star Citizen is looking more and more like the game which will ultimately hold my attention. Now the lack of CW and 3rd person is the primary reason why my interest has been dwindling.. If CW rocks it and 3rd person is a minority part of this game, then I will stay.

[Grimmnyr]

They surely do check this thread once in awhile, but they already have all the input they want from us regarding 3PV.

[Belorion]

CyBerkut, on 07 July 2013 - 03:24 AM, said:

Actually, that is not what they are doing. They are doing a 1PV queue, and a mixed 1PV & 3PV queue.

From that link:
"Of course as promised out of the gates players will be able to choose 1PV and 3PV mixed or just 1PV."

I'm not necessarily against that, but it is different and it does open the door to the concern some have... that the door has been cracked open to possibly do away with the 1PV-only queue eventually, should PGI choose to seize upon some rationale to justify it.

1 FPV mode, 1 Mixed mode... either or any selection. Nothing has changed in this entire thread, its still the same thing. The presumption is when someone says 3pv they are referring to the mixed mode, since there will never be a 3pv only mode.

The "concern" some have is baseless fearmongering, and/or paranoia.

Edited by Belorion, 07 July 2013 - 06:38 PM.

[Hotthedd]

Belorion, on 07 July 2013 - 06:36 PM, said:

1 FPV mode, 1 Mixed mode... either or any selection. Nothing has changed in this entire thread, its still the same thing. The presumption is when someone says 3pv they are referring to the mixed mode, since there will never be a 3pv only mode.

The "concern" some have is baseless fearmongering, and/or paranoia.

Then there should be no problem with separate servers, right?

Let me ask, what if the mixed queue does not have enough players? Do you think IGP/PGI will just shelve 3PV after committing so many resources to it? Or do you think they will merge the queues?

THAT is our fear.

[Farix]

Belorion, on 07 July 2013 - 06:36 PM, said:

1 FPV mode, 1 Mixed mode... either or any selection. Nothing has changed in this entire thread, its still the same thing. The presumption is when someone says 3pv they are referring to the mixed mode, since there will never be a 3pv only mode.

The "concern" some have is baseless fearmongering, and/or paranoia.

I wouldn't say that there will never by a 3PV-only queue. In fact, the very "out of the gate" statement that many anti-3PV players are quoting as a hint that PGI plans to do away with the 1PV-only queue may actually be referring to the planned inclusion of a 3PV-only queue, but they will wait to see how the meta plays out with the first two queues before adding the third.

Hotthedd, on 07 July 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Then there should be no problem with separate servers, right?

Why does there need to be seperate servers? And what if I want to switch back and forth between the two views? Do I have to have two accounts for each queue with two sets of mechs? Or maybe I started out as 3PV but want to graduate to 1PV. Why would I have to create a second account for that? Separate servers means separate accounts, or at the very least, a separate set of mechs.

Hotthedd, on 07 July 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Let me ask, what if the mixed queue does not have enough players? Do you think IGP/PGI will just shelve 3PV after committing so many resources to it? Or do you think they will merge the queues?

I seriously doubt the mixed queue will not have enough players to support it. And the majority of the resources that PGI would have committed to 3PV would be in creating the queue system. Placing the camera behind the mech would be the the easy part. So merging the queues would be the real waste of resources.

Edited by Farix, 07 July 2013 - 07:22 PM.