112 replies to this topic

[UraniumOverdose]

Kobura, on 18 November 2012 - 06:27 PM, said:

I'm not even going to state my stance on AC20cats/Gausscats

But I'm going to say

UraniumOverdose, BLOODREDSINGLE, and others (who remarkably are almost all in favor of keeping things as they are)

The level of anger, ignorance, and venom in your statements is to be noted. Why do you bring this to a pleasant community for a game in open Beta when other testers voice their position?

Because all this community does is cry about stuff being overpowered. So when something really bad does happen like the LRM debacle, no one listens. They just need to learn how to play. When a bunch of newbs who probably can't even lag shoot a jenner properly want to come in here and complain about something being overpowered, yes I am gonna get angry. I have no sympathy for someone who can't play worth a damn trying to get something nerfed because it killed them.

[B1R]

Trick out a Cicada....run around a gauss cat in a circle.....kill it....move on to the next enemy. They are rediculously easy to kill in lighter mechs. To me, not nearly as big an imbalance as say.....Atlas being easier to kill than a Jenner (lag armor).

[Deadoon]

UraniumOverdose, on 18 November 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

Because all this community does is cry about stuff being overpowered. So when something really bad does happen like the LRM debacle, no one listens. They just need to learn how to play. When a bunch of newbs who probably can't even lag shoot a jenner properly want to come in here and complain about something being overpowered, yes I am gonna get angry. I have no sympathy for someone who can't play worth a damn trying to get something nerfed because it killed them.

Requiring someone to aim ahead with a hitscan/lightspeed weapon is BS and you know it, the game should make it so people use the weapons properly not compensate for a phantom htibox caused by excessive over compensation of the mechs position. The gauss rifle has a serious advantage over ac in the category of this being the first mechwarrior game where it fires as FAST as an ac.


The ac/20 is not the problem currently, it is the map size, the current map size does not properly bring it's weaknesses into play and makes it seem far more effective than it should be. This isn't to bring up it's range maximum is much larger than it should be.

Edited by Deadoon, 19 November 2012 - 02:03 AM.

[Darwins Dog]

We get it. L2P and you can beat a gauss cat. They are easy to outmaneuver, and I think I heard somewhere that you can adjust your tactics to match the mech that you are fighting. Does anyone else remember reading that somewhere?

My point is that the K2 is able to use two very powerful weapons without the same drawback that any other mech has with them. Everything that can mount an AC20 or Gauss has a large weapon on the model or vulnerable arm holding it. Except the K2. Moving the crit slots would be the easiest way to bring the mech back to what is intended. Reworking the model to have large weapons when appropriate would also work (probably be better, but it would definitely take more time to implement).

Will it break the game if it stays as it is now? No.
Are they unstoppable now? No.
Will it be a better game if they change it? I think so.
Will it kill people's favorite builds? Maybe for a little while until new chases are released.

That's what I think about it at least.

[canned wolf]

UraniumOverdose, on 18 November 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

Because all this community does is cry about stuff being overpowered. So when something really bad does happen like the LRM debacle, no one listens. They just need to learn how to play. When a bunch of newbs who probably can't even lag shoot a jenner properly want to come in here and complain about something being overpowered, yes I am gonna get angry. I have no sympathy for someone who can't play worth a damn trying to get something nerfed because it killed them.

I could have cut and pasted this response out of a dozen other forum topics. What I haven't found is one of you people willing to justify why its OK for the CAT to be able to put such massive weapons in such tiny spaces. All I hear over and over is, its fine, its fine. No one has gone through point for point and explained why you think the points presented are invalid.

I guess what I'm saying here is stop trolling. If you've got useful input, give it up. If you don't be quiet and let the adults talk.

[Bhael Fire]

As K2/Gaus pilot, I can say with authority that while it's extremely effective at range, it's virtually useless once you have a couple lights or a medium up in your face. Trying to maneuver a k2 going 47 mph while a light mech is running circles around you tearing up your *** ain't no picnic.

[Snoid]

I didn't intend my comment to sound mean, and I'm sure UraniumOverdose didn't either. I don't want to speak for him, but in my opinion, if it's not one thing, it'll be another. I think the fast mechs (Jenner and Cicada) having lag issues are much more destabilizing than the single AC20 kitty one encounters in a match.

As for the argument about weapon slot sizes, how far do you want to go with that? What about a mech that comes with a small laser stock? Should you be allowed to put a Large Laser or a PPC in there? That is much bigger and bulkier than a small laser (although not quite as big as the difference between an MG and an AC20). Even if you did get to the point where you limited critical slot size, should an AC2 fit where an MG used to be? Same crits, 12 times the weight. If they restrict crits, they will seriously put a damper on customization of our mechs, and that is part of the fun of this game. I think the hardpoint limitation is limiting enough, and creates a challenge to find a loadout without restricting it too much.

[ZI0N]

They are not OP builds learn how to fight them. AC 20 Cat will fall easily to a good scout pilot or double team him. Same for a gause cat, you just got to get in close to him and brawl from his side. The streak cat is the weakest of the builds but is counter able to any medium to assault mech. They are primarily light mech destroyers. Play smart and with a good team and they will not be trouble. no need to nerf them are restrict the numbers of weapons on them. I drive an AC cat and I do rack up a lot of quick kills but have never felt it was out of balanced with the other mech.

[canned wolf]

I could say the same for my Atlas. I could also say that my Atlas is in trouble when two mediums or two heavies or two assaults are on it.

Bhael Fire, on 19 November 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:

As K2/Gaus pilot, I can say with authority that while it's extremely effective at range, it's virtually useless once you have a couple lights or a medium up in your face. Trying to maneuver a k2 going 47 mph while a light mech is running circles around you tearing up your *** ain't no picnic.

Virtually useless is a bit of a stretch. You go from being the best sniper mech to being number two or three as a brawler. You out torso twist every other brawler, your convergence is better than everything but a 4p hunchback, your heat profile is ridiculous, You've got a big cockpit, which is still a hard target when you're moving, your weapons get blown off.... never.

You're right light mechs are a problem though. I doubt people are far from figuring this one out. I'm sure I'll log in in the next day or two and see the K2 Jenner premade rolling through our lines.

And to top it all off, you still cannot fit a big assed gauss in those tiny cheeks. K2's are the clown cars of MWO. Anyone who pilots one should be required to wear a big red rubber nose in public.

The only fix I support is a graphical change to the model. The others cause too many issues.

The light mech lag issue is a problem, but the devs are obviously trying to fix it. I'm sure you would see a lot less about K2's if there was a fix being presented.

Edited by canned wolf, 19 November 2012 - 03:38 PM.

[UraniumOverdose]

canned wolf, on 19 November 2012 - 02:10 PM, said:

I could have cut and pasted this response out of a dozen other forum topics. What I haven't found is one of you people willing to justify why its OK for the CAT to be able to put such massive weapons in such tiny spaces. All I hear over and over is, its fine, its fine. No one has gone through point for point and explained why you think the points presented are invalid.

I guess what I'm saying here is stop trolling. If you've got useful input, give it up. If you don't be quiet and let the adults talk.

Eat it, I am not trolling. I said earlier that realism doesn't matter in a game about 100 foot tall walking robots. Stop talking nonsense and actually read peoples posts. K2 is a fun variant, and because of massive performance issues I have to run a slower mech. I don't normally care to run slower mechs, so if I can't run the K2 I want to run, then I ******* quit.

[Anti-Social]

Honestly, I do not see a issue with these mechs and Myself and my friends i drop with do not have problems with them. They are a Heavy class mech,, and should be taken seriously. Use of terrain is needed, and common sense. You can not go into battle and rush straight into one of these mechs,,,,,, you have to use skill terrain, and your torso, having a balanced team is very critical, not everyone can be in a assult or heavy. you need those light and med mechs so that they can get in on the gauss cats. Any I do not happen to own any of these variants with these build types But nerff a weapon to attempt to resolve this issue is going to nerff all mechs that use the gauss and the nerff will be felt more by other class's with bigger targets like the atlas, and the yo wang will fee this nerff much more then the cats since there gauss weapon will be much easier to hit.

[wanderer]

Very simply, you're not going to get rid of the Gausscat, any more than they got rid of the Hunchback-P when people screamed "BAN IT! BAN IT!" or folks who howl about Jenners.

You're more likely to see adjustments to the weapons or other widespread more global changes.

The Swayback was dangerous because it was fast and packed many energy weapons, like the Lawesomes that game after it. Engine limits took the speed part out of the equation, and medium lasers got a little hotter.

I'd wait and see as to how the Gauss finally exploding properly (which it should be, virtually 100% of the time when it's HP zeros out) changes things- but the world is not made of one design. We are not all piloting Gausscats, or Streakcats, or whatever Catapult of choice you happen to figure is your more dangerous kind.

To me, that indicates that it's more a case of "rock is OP, paper is fine" coming from the scissors side of the podium.

[canned wolf]

UraniumOverdose, on 19 November 2012 - 03:32 PM, said:

Eat it, I am not trolling. I said earlier that realism doesn't matter in a game about 100 foot tall walking robots. Stop talking nonsense and actually read peoples posts. K2 is a fun variant, and because of massive performance issues I have to run a slower mech. I don't normally care to run slower mechs, so if I can't run the K2 I want to run, then I ******* quit.

So, give you what you want, or you quit? Wow, that's a hard one. Saying you're not a troll, does not make you not a troll.

I agree with the post earlier saying that making the gauss explode more often is likely to make the gaussapult stronger in relation to other mechs. Lots of mechs use the gauss, but most of them have it mounted in a location that is reasonably easy to target.

Would have posted faster, but I had to count the negatives.

Edited by canned wolf, 19 November 2012 - 03:52 PM.

[UraniumOverdose]

canned wolf, on 19 November 2012 - 03:50 PM, said:

So, give you what you want, or you quit? Wow, that's a hard one. Saying you're not a troll, does not make you not a troll.

I agree with the post earlier saying that making the gauss explode more often is likely to make the gaussapult stronger in relation to other mechs. Lots of mechs use the gauss, but most of them have it mounted in a location that is reasonably easy to target.

Would have posted faster, but I had to count the negatives.

No one really cares what you think of who is and is not trolling. You and people like you have been crying about the K2 for months in beta. Would it make you happy if they added two big cannons on the torso of the cat if you added a big gun there? How come you don't complain when people put ppc's in the cats torso? I do that because they are easier to aim. If your only goal in a game is graphics and looks, then why don't you go to an art museum? The rest of us like the customization offered right now. Stop trying to **** all over everyone elses fun in game. The real issue is YOU. You will still be at the bottom of the score sheet even if they break the K2, and then you'll be back here trying to cry about it.

[PropagandaWar]

deadeye mcduck, on 17 November 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

Just wait till Tuesday, as the Cataphract arrives. I bet you will see plenty of those armed with dual gauss rifles come post patch day.

Yeah but youll be able to shoot that torso without a problem unlike the Gauss TCAT that you literally have to attack from the sides

[Csypher]

more qqing about this FOCUS TARGET or FOCUS location and you will find that it is easy to kill them derp.

try playing with a competive group and watch how fast every type you are crying about goes down.

[Moonsavage]

Meh, Inner sphere weapons are supposed to be difficult to aim properly - let the Gauss and other game-killer weapons drift or be slightly less accurate and everyone's happy - apart from the exploiters looking for an advantage so they can faceroll their way onto the killboard.

Edit: This "problem" is a direct result of weapons being interchangeable via the mechlab. There was a lot of thought and balancing put into the standard configs which goes out of the window as soon as people boat.
Just saying.

Edited by Moonsavage, 19 November 2012 - 04:55 PM.

[Bhael Fire]

canned wolf, on 19 November 2012 - 03:32 PM, said:

Virtually useless is a bit of a stretch. You go from being the best sniper mech to being number two or three as a brawler.

Not a stretch at all. The gauss cat is virtually useless against any pilot that knows how to circle strafe quickly; 90% of the time, that's how I'm taken out. Yes, it's great for sniping and pretty good at mid-range brawling, but its slow speed (slower than most assaults), limited ammo and relatively light armor (compared to other heavies and assaults) make it a lumbering target when brawling in close quarters with lights and mediums.

This balances the mech out pretty well if you ask me.

[themoob]

Bartolomeo, on 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

i made the same post... it just get lost xD




I think is a better solution than starting to make sized critical slot... but that is a good way to make variants more different

[canned wolf]

UraniumOverdose, on 19 November 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

No one really cares what you think of who is and is not trolling. You and people like you have been crying about the K2 for months in beta. Would it make you happy if they added two big cannons on the torso of the cat if you added a big gun there? How come you don't complain when people put ppc's in the cats torso? I do that because they are easier to aim. If your only goal in a game is graphics and looks, then why don't you go to an art museum? The rest of us like the customization offered right now. Stop trying to **** all over everyone elses fun in game. The real issue is YOU. You will still be at the bottom of the score sheet even if they break the K2, and then you'll be back here trying to cry about it.

I don't ***** about PPC's because the heat factor balances them pretty well, I don't ***** about AC/20's because the range factor balances them out, but you're right, they would also need a larger graphic. This sort of graphic customization has been around since 02 or so. I don't see a reason to take that kind of step back. PGI isn't a fly by night garage operation, they are a fully staffed game developer. I'm willing to be patient, but I expect major discrepancies like this to be fixed.

How is asking that the graphic representation of a mech match its loadout ******** all over your fun?

I'll admit I'm having trouble staying above 2.0 lately. Mostly because I've been testing different setups. Still, 1.75 isn't exactly holding my team back. If the stats tracked damage I'm betting my score would look even better.