100 replies to this topic

[Screech]

Heeden, on 04 December 2012 - 09:43 PM, said:

I've heard this before but I can't understand how SLas can beat MLas.

Couple reasons, 6SL is lighter so you can run 17DHS and basically can't overheat so you are able fire anytime you have the right shot. Shorter beam time allows you to concentrate your hits easier. Best way to kill a Jenner is to double leg them, lot easier with small lasers. When I get over 1,000 damage in a match in my Jenner it is always using 6SL.

People going the 6ML just thing "I have have bigger pew-pew I win" and not understanding the whole balancing that is involved. Though ML are nice if trying to keep some range, but I like to slip in knife fight then run before their buddies come for vengeance.

[sheradin]

ok heres something ppl are failing to take into account 1 the ecm effect thier describing are fropm a angel system not a guardian system 2 the standard tatic in the books and tt was to attach a ecfm mech to the command lance based on what I have rerad pgi has made the ecm to powerful for the time period the angel ecm was heavyer and more powerful and was consider by tt rules to be level 3 rules and wasnt avalibe till near the end of the clan wars

[Der BruzZzler von Wiesndoof]

The Jenner is still a really good mech and i'm glad that it has no ECM. Before the last patch, the Jenner was a bit OP against other lights, but now it is well balanced in my opinion. ECM Ravens or ECM Commandos with Streak SRM's are really dangerous and have a chance against Jenners.It is still a useful harasser and very effective against "non streak lights" and bigger targets. I love the Jenner and i still use it successfully. Now, Com's and Ravens are worthy opponents.

[verybad]

To me it seems like the best role for the Jenner is still Scouting (as in seeing where the main group of enemies is.

Also:

Raven/Commando killing. (The Jenner is better 1 on 1 than any other light)
Tagging. You don't need ECM to tag, speed and jets help though...

Jenneral Harassment.

The fall of the Jenner is widely over stated. It's still a great mech.

Edited by verybad, 07 December 2012 - 11:07 PM.

[Gulaschsuppe]

I **** Jenners with my Raven 3L. They have nearly zero chance to win a 1:1 fight without ECM now...

[ICEFANG13]

Are you using the Jenner-F, because the 3L w/ECM is by far better than the D and K.

Please tell me all the reasons to use a Jenner-K/D over a 3L? I have 3 now.

It moves 2.3 KPH faster (which doesn't matter), and its because of the engine cap that the Jenner can use too (a 295 engine).

It has an extra energy slot, which doesn't matter when ECM disables your streaks and not the L's, you lose around 33% of your firepower, where they lose 16.5% (depends on builds of course) Using TAG in that slot, to "counter" ECM, doesn't work, and removes the advantage.

Jump Jets, which weigh 2.5 and take 5 slots (to work correctly) vs 1.5/2 ECM.

Edited by ICEFANG13, 07 December 2012 - 11:12 PM.

[Tempered]

Heeden, on 04 December 2012 - 09:43 PM, said:

I've heard this before but I can't understand how SLas can beat MLas.

Beam duration and recycle time. More of your damage is actually counted by the game. With medium lasers, you are not doing the full damage of the laser, but you are certainly getting all the heat. Personally, I prefer 2 mediums and 4 smalls, which gives me a medium range option. I also like srm4's, but I play the K and D variants differently. Different tactics.

[Der BruzZzler von Wiesndoof]

Gulaschsuppe, on 07 December 2012 - 11:07 PM, said:

I **** Jenners with my Raven 3L. They have nearly zero chance to win a 1:1 fight without ECM now...

My COM-2D with ECM and x3 Streaks is much better!

[Pale Jackal]

ICEFANG13, on 07 December 2012 - 11:09 PM, said:

It has an extra energy slot, which doesn't matter when ECM disables your streaks and not the L's, you lose around 33% of your firepower, where they lose 16.5% (depends on builds of course) Using TAG in that slot, to "counter" ECM, doesn't work, and removes the advantage.

Jump Jets, which weigh 2.5 and take 5 slots (to work correctly) vs 1.5/2 ECM.

Use an SRM6 instead of SSRM2's if you want to ignore ECM. Then, use that extra energy slot. Or pilot a Jenner F - after all, if the Raven 3L is the only good Raven build, then you can switch to the Jenner F.

Also, don't say "Jump Jets take 2.5 tons to work correctly" - we don't know what Jump Jets are going to be like in the final implementation. For all we know, Jump Jets will be 5x better than they currently are when you equip 5x as many. So, saying that Jump Jets take 2.5 tons is ridiculous, they take .5 tons, and Jump Jets rock.

Edited by Pale Jackal, 08 December 2012 - 06:44 AM.

[ICEFANG13]

No, based on how they work in TT, and flight times, currently we have 5 jump jets all the time, can't have 6, can't have 1. Using a SRM6, the Raven can do too, but can also shut down locks. Once again, its down to the same 3 things. The Jenner-D/K goes slightly faster, can carry JJ's, and has an extra energy hardpoint.

I will admit, if you ignore ECM, then the Jenner-D is superior (and I don't want that) and the K is comparable. I want the Raven-2X/4X/3L all good, but right now, Raven-3L is by far king. But for a ton and a half, and all the benefits that ECM provide, no mech that can use it, is not using it right now.

[Alphascrub]

MouseNo4, on 04 December 2012 - 04:01 PM, said:

The Jenner is not a true scout mech. It is more of a combat Light. What is referred to as a "guerrilla fighter" on its mech description page.

That statement has about 3500 holes in it.

So your statement makes no sense... ECM screams guerrilla fighter.

Not be seen as a target blip till around 120 meters? disrupting enemy missile locks?

How is that not guerrilla fighter?

Simply put they need to put the ECM on the JR7-K (would actually make it useful) at least. Actually it should really be on all light mech models, it has no business on the atlas or the cicada.

[ICEFANG13]

No because the Jenner-D and F are better in different ways, but overall better than the 3L, all light mechs should have a level of uniqueness to them, we don't want everyone doing the, "The D is best, lets do that, oh ECM? The 3L is best, lets do that, oh now its on Jenner-D?...". Maybe the K, but if you do that, and keep the Raven-2X in the dust like it is, no one will ever use it. 2X needs a buff, K/D/F are all ok, but outclassed now by 3L.

[Smeghead87]

I like the 2X.
The 4X is a different matter though.

[ICEFANG13]

Is there any reason to use the 2X over the Jenner-K? The K can move faster and that's it, it also doesn't have to put an extra heatsink on because of the 245 engine.

[Smeghead87]

Probably not, but jenners are OP anyway so why use anything but jenners?

Edited by Smeghead87, 09 December 2012 - 03:57 PM.

[Ashnod]

Asakara, on 04 December 2012 - 04:20 PM, said:

Nope, never.. Oh wait...

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Jenner

The JR10-X had Angel ECM.

I think you meant that lore wise there has never ever been a Commando or Cicada with ECM, and that would be correct.

Angel ECM is years into the future, the com needs it so its still viable - why the cicada has it? No idea.

[ICEFANG13]

Yes anyway, the only Jenner that is "OP" right now is the F, and that one is very similar to the Cicada-2A, the K and the D are out classed by the Raven-3L and the ECM. If the Jenner is so OP right now, you have greater things to worry about.

[Smeghead87]

The Cicada has it because it's a good choice for a non-light scout mech and the dev's are using some artistic license.

[Ashnod]

Alphascrub, on 09 December 2012 - 03:43 PM, said:

That statement has about 3500 holes in it.

So your statement makes no sense... ECM screams guerrilla fighter.

Not be seen as a target blip till around 120 meters? disrupting enemy missile locks?

How is that not guerrilla fighter?

Simply put they need to put the ECM on the JR7-K (would actually make it useful) at least. Actually it should really be on all light mech models, it has no business on the atlas or the cicada.

It's mainly because ECM = angel + guardian + null signature system.. Normally guardian doesn't affect streaks or LRM's

[CrayTrashfire]

Asakara, on 04 December 2012 - 04:20 PM, said:

Nope, never.. Oh wait...

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Jenner

The JR10-X had Angel ECM.

I think you meant that lore wise there has never ever been a Commando or Cicada with ECM, and that would be correct.

Angel Ecm isnt in this timeline oh and neither is that jenner but in tt its not really restricted like it is here

Edited by CrayTrashfire, 09 December 2012 - 04:12 PM.