235 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

I understand this Quantum, it's why I am not strongly trying to break ECMs. I want to find how to kill it as is. I am throwing around some ideas on what I'd like to see, but it's not a fist pounding mandate.

[Djarid]

There's a lot of whining in this thread. Is it in its final state? I hope not, but either way I'm puttin gmy effort in learning how to benefit from my sides ECM and fight effectively through theirs.

IMO it is not OP. and being a former Electronic Warefare Operator I know how truly OP EW in the real world can be

[Alex Wolfe]

Dukov Nook, on 05 December 2012 - 06:38 AM, said:

Breaking LRMs, even artemis enabled is easy. It's what cover is for.

...aaaand that's where the "trench" part of "trench warfare" comes from. Looks like we're finally at the same page.

The moment you skulked out of cover since OB, it was INCOMING MISSILE time, and since those missiles hit like a bag of flaming bricks on fire, what you ended up was the perfect mechanical cockroach simulator. Poked out for a few seconds? Squash. Better hide, space robot. Better crawl under a bed.

Last I checked, BT 'mechs were about space jousting with walking tanks, with LRMs as support, not the main threat of the battlefield.

If I wanted radar pings shooting at other radar pings all day, I'd play Harpoon instead .



If you want your easymode hundreds of damage back, get a spotter and actual teamwork going, instead of just a patsy with a working "R" button. You keep the advantage of not having to aim, huge range and indirect fire.

LRMs were just too much of a good thing for one mouse button.

Edited by Alex Wolfe, 05 December 2012 - 07:04 AM.

[Dukov Nook]

Djarid, on 05 December 2012 - 06:56 AM, said:

There's a lot of whining in this thread. Is it in its final state? I hope not, but either way I'm puttin gmy effort in learning how to benefit from my sides ECM and fight effectively through theirs.

IMO it is not OP. and being a former Electronic Warefare Operator I know how truly OP EW in the real world can be

In the real world, you have IR and image targeting on top of radar. Your point is kind of overlooking that.

[Dukov Nook]

Alex Wolfe, on 05 December 2012 - 06:59 AM, said:

...aaaand that's where the "trench" part of "trench warfare" comes from. Looks like we're finally at the same page.

The moment you skulked out of cover since OB, it was INCOMING MISSILE time, and since those missiles hit like a bag of flaming bricks on fire, what you ended up was the perfect mechanical cockroach simulator.

Last I checked, mechs were about space jousting with walking tanks, with LRMs as support, not the main threat of the battlefield.

If I wanted radar pings shooting at other radar pings all day, I'd play Harpoon instead .



If you want your easymode hundreds of damage back, get a spotter and actual teamwork going, instead of just a patsy with a working "R" button.

I can tell from this post that you have never piloted a LRM dedicated support mech. It's blatantly obvious.

A LRM mech, properly piloted, needs to move, constantly, to enable it's angle of attack. See an 'incoming missle' message. Pssh, duck behind another building before you to supply cover. It's not hard. I watch people avoid incoming missles all day long, even with a good lock on them. It's called piloting.

The best groups even utilize smaller mechs to completely harass the LRM boats, making them unable to fire. This was Pre-ECM and was very effective for the few groups that actually did it.

But, go ahead. Press that 'w' button to go forward, go fast. No need to maneuver, duck, and dodge now. Just plow ahead and pew pew. It's what you wanted, right?

boring play.

[Kryuus]

I haven't played yet post patch but I would recommend before this goes further you guys check the weapon balance update in the command chair. Balistic and PPC travel speed is improving, and tag range is being tested at 750m range. The tag range increase may make it viable as it effectively works at close to spotting range. But again I havent played yet so I leave judgement to the rest of.you

[Spooky01]

I think it would be best if ECM came not as a free load up, but with a very high price tag? For those mech pilots who have gone through the mill to find their best mech and load up , only to find that their strike SRM's, LRM's missiles not working and then having to pay a high price to get their mech repaired is a bit unfair, what about a ECM to neutralize lazers or AC's, who many pilots would complain about that?

This should have been thought off a bit better!

But the war goes on!

[VoltarDark]

ECM is fine, LRM with artemis can still be a threat. cool down people. I still find my 2xLRM15 awesome pretty good. i still score in the top 3 under ECM.

Ecm is a great addition to Mwo.

[Steel Claws]

Gee didn't see this thread coming....... not!

For heavens sake there are just four mechs that can mount ECM - 3 of which are rather easy to kill - well four since most anyone in a light can take down a fatlas one on one.

"Wow our super duper streak boats are broken please make it so we can be OP again". Every single mech has the ability to load a weapon that is NOT affected by ECM. Man up and learn to play a mech that requires some skill.

I still see plenty of streaks and LRMs being used but now there is a least a modest amount of skill required to be successful.

[Mavairo]

Phingers, on 04 December 2012 - 10:06 PM, said:

Seriously unbalanced.

1.As players are learning they are switching to those mechs that can use ECM. At this stage early tactics the team that aint all wearing ECM will be stomped.......it will be driven home by the 8 man teams who target the few players with ECM first.

2. Any lock missiles are useless currently in game as everyone switches to ECM teams. Currently Missiles are pathetic.

3. the game is DE_EVOLVING currently into slug fests with the teams with less lag easily able to dominate laggy teams with the SLUG FEST OF LASERS AND BALLISTICS in your face from a SEA of Atlas, Cicada and Ravens

As a founder I have gone from having fun....to face palming, smacking my head into keyboard.

Has anyone that is complaining about ECM taken mechs with TAG yet?

Just curious.

[Steel Claws]

Alex Wolfe, on 05 December 2012 - 06:59 AM, said:

...aaaand that's where the "trench" part of "trench warfare" comes from. Looks like we're finally at the same page.

The moment you skulked out of cover since OB, it was INCOMING MISSILE time, and since those missiles hit like a bag of flaming bricks on fire, what you ended up was the perfect mechanical cockroach simulator. Poked out for a few seconds? Squash. Better hide, space robot. Better crawl under a bed.

Last I checked, BT 'mechs were about space jousting with walking tanks, with LRMs as support, not the main threat of the battlefield.

If I wanted radar pings shooting at other radar pings all day, I'd play Harpoon instead .



If you want your easymode hundreds of damage back, get a spotter and actual teamwork going, instead of just a patsy with a working "R" button. You keep the advantage of not having to aim, huge range and indirect fire.

LRMs were just too much of a good thing for one mouse button.

OMG Harpoon, damn I miss that game.

[Alex Wolfe]

Dukov Nook, on 05 December 2012 - 07:02 AM, said:

I can tell from this post that you have never piloted a LRM dedicated support mech. It's blatantly obvious.

Sorry Madam Nookovska, but your crystal ball seems to be in need of calibrations. I have spent many happy hours in CB driving wanderer's patented LRM fatlas. Was fun, thanks. Nice, relaxing, effective, can play while reading a book.

Dukov Nook, on 05 December 2012 - 07:02 AM, said:

A LRM mech, properly piloted, needs to move, constantly, to enable it's angle of attack. See an 'incoming missle' message. Pssh, duck behind another building before you to supply cover. It's not hard. I watch people avoid incoming missles all day long, even with a good lock on them. It's called piloting.

The best groups even utilize smaller mechs to completely harass the LRM boats, making them unable to fire. This was Pre-ECM and was very effective for the few groups that actually did it.

Oh, piloting? Wow! That sounds almost same as that "piloting" thing direct fire mechs have to do!

Except that they also need to aim on top of that, so however you look at it, they always put in more work than LRM boats. And that's why LRMs cannot be made as powerful as direct fire weapons, and sure enough cannot be made more powerful. Have you... have you never tried driving a direct fire 'mech ?

Also, I don't know what game were you playing pre-ECM, but in MWO there existed those "streaks" things that absolutely ripped small mechs to shreds if they approached to LRM ball. No points.

Steel Claws, on 05 December 2012 - 07:13 AM, said:

OMG Harpoon, damn I miss that game.

After surviving three LRM wars, I don't . Nice to get some Mechwarrior in the mix too, from time to time.

Edited by Alex Wolfe, 05 December 2012 - 07:17 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Steel Claws, on 05 December 2012 - 07:13 AM, said:

OMG Harpoon, damn I miss that game.

You haven't closed 223NM then SC!

[xPhalanx]

Those sneaky DC-Atlas, you'll never see them coming ...... hahahahahaa

[The Bad Charlie]

Im tired of this sort of posts!!! When its a missile fest, you complain... Now its a slugfest! You complain... Cant you EVEN try to adapt? The one patch when the devs release useful content, improve the game performance and bring back 8-mans, you keep bi'chin! why?!?! Why does everyone propose such radical changes to how BAP or ECM work??? Its been ONLY a day, go out there and try the stuff!!! Jesus, i even saw a post saying that now were on "Commando warrior online" LOL!

FYI: You dont lose in a "slugfest" because you have high ping, this aint call of duty... I play with 200-220ms (Argentina) and have learned how to land ballistics and lasers consistently (ps: read that post about lasers, it helps a LOT, kudos to the maker!)... Sure, i cant aim where the mechs actually show on my screen, its not cool inmersion wise, but dont tell me you cant play!!!

[Khan Warlock Kell]

I don't think ECM has totally broken the game. I do think this is a terrible implementation of ECM. BAP should be the correct counter, not more ECM. So now because of ECM, the poor version of 8 man MM we have (no evening factors what so ever). the numerous CTD's, CTML's, the in game grafix bugs, and the numerous other issues that have yet to be be even looked at for fixes by PGI im going to go and spend my money on PS2. Im not quitting MWO. Its just become the game ill play occasonally while i play PS2, until that golden day in the possible future when MWO is back to being a fun and balanced game to play.

I know this is still open beta and the game is going to change alot. i will be here to watch it change. But most of all even while a game changes its supposed to be fun to play. MWO for me atleast has stopped being fun. it's become a chore. so until PGI figure out how to make it fun again im not going to spend a dime here.

[Dukov Nook]

Alex Wolfe, on 05 December 2012 - 07:14 AM, said:

Oh, piloting? Wow! That sounds almost same as that "piloting" thing direct fire mechs have to do!

Except that they also need to aim on top of that, so however you look at it, they always put in more work than LRM boats. And that's why LRMs cannot be made as powerful as direct fire weapons, and sure enough cannot be made more powerful. Have you... have you never tried driving a direct fire 'mech ?

Yes, aiming and shooting while moving is so tremendously difficult.

/sigh

[DeathofSelf]

I have only played a few matches, but, I think ECM is going to bring MORE balance to the game. It will bring about more tactical/skillful/thoughtful playing, Instead of the LRM/SSRM fest we have seen.

[Minoxen]

I have only gotten to play 6-8 games in the 8 man configuration since yesterday. The games I played were for the great part not enjoyable.

I hope that the ECM see's more effective "Counters" since TAG is a poor option, or a severe reduction to the size of its cloaking bubble in addition to an extension to the ECM countermeasure range. I am glad ECM exists, but I believe it is in no way in a balanced place right now.

Totally countering BAP, NARC, and TAG (at certain range) is abit too encompassing. We need more rock-paper-scissors.

Thanks for the added content, and I look forward to its further balancing.

[MustrumRidcully]

The Bad Charlie, on 05 December 2012 - 07:17 AM, said:

Im tired of this sort of posts!!! When its a missile fest, you complain... Now its a slugfest! You complain... Cant you EVEN try to adapt?

How about a bit of both? A bit of missiles, a bit of brawling? Why not have a mix? Why do we need to adapt to a one-sided style of play at all?

Quote

FYI: You dont lose in a "slugfest" because you have high ping, this aint call of duty...

Really? I don't know why your Argentinian lag is different from mine, but when I spectate other players, I often enough see them consistently missing with their hit-scan lasers as they try to track their enemies.

I find it unacceptable that you basically need a second spotter to tell you how much you miss due to lag to fight sometimes. This doesn't look like 2012 MMO worthy net code to me.

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 05 December 2012 - 07:22 AM.