126 replies to this topic

[3Xtr3m3]

I would like to think that if Stop/Loss is enacted that in some way, the players can choose when it can be discarded too.

Volthorne, on 14 May 2012 - 06:11 PM, said:

Because they totally would have thought about this without you starting the thread.

There is that possibility

Enough for today, we will chat more tomorrow.

Edited by 3Xtr3m3, 14 May 2012 - 06:12 PM.

[ManDaisy]

all the yes-i added together are beating the nos currently. Take that ya screamers!

[Volthorne]

ManDaisy, on 14 May 2012 - 06:15 PM, said:

all the yes-i added together are beating the nos currently. Take that ya screamers!

Only 6 voted for a full "yes". The others voted on certain conditions, so you need to halve the other 38 "yes" votes for proper results.

3Xtr3m3, on 14 May 2012 - 06:14 PM, said:

I would like to think that if Stop/Loss is enacted that in some way, the players can choose when it can be discarded too.



There is that possibility

Enough for today, we will chat more tomorrow.

The possibility being 1:6 billion? Terrible odds. In fact, the odds are so bad....

"we will chat more tomorrow"? What is this, the House of Commons? Forum debates NEVER end! Well, at least they don't until a mod locks them... [/subtle hint]

[ManDaisy]

Volthorne, on 14 May 2012 - 06:26 PM, said:

Only 6 voted for a full "yes". The others voted on certain conditions, so you need to halve the other 38 "yes" votes for proper results.

No no no. Clearly we can see that this is poll manipulation by the opposition party in an attempt to divide and conquer. Unified our numbers are still superior.

Also, I question to speaker as to the sources of his claims.

Edited by ManDaisy, 14 May 2012 - 06:57 PM.

[wwiiogre]

So 91.11% did not vote yes. so the answer is then no. That is a truthful way to read this poll. Or 53.85% did not vote no. Which means only 8.89% voted yes and 46.15% voted no with 45% somewhere in between.

So the no's win.

see Statistics class and jouranlism classes paid off in college.

Chris

[Volthorne]

wwiiogre, on 14 May 2012 - 09:21 PM, said:

So 91.11% did not vote yes. so the answer is then no. That is a truthful way to read this poll. Or 53.85% did not vote no. Which means only 8.89% voted yes and 46.15% voted no with 45% somewhere in between.

So the no's win.

see Statistics class and jouranlism classes paid off in college.

Chris

Motion denied. GG no Re.

[Vectoron]

Guido, on 14 May 2012 - 11:25 AM, said:

I completely agree with this. Merc corps spend a lot of time training their members, because they'll be putting money and reputation on them to win. There understandably isn't as much of an incentive for a house player, other than the "Big V" and a planet territory. That doesn't mean the house shouldn't train their members as well, but there shouldn't be a penalty because the MERC GROUPS TRAIN like any military unit should be doing.

There's a place for newer players, and a place for experienced players. If there was an easy handicap like that, then merc units would have an incredibly hard time winning a match. The battle would be a house-player rush to find the merc unit and lemming until they take out 30% of the BV.

Being a merc is a risky business, and if you want to talk canonically about it, there are thousands of failed/obliterated mercenary groups littering the Battletech history. Nerfing the game, so that when Johnny Smoe start his Purple Pony Protectorates and takes a job too tough for his group he doesn't risk anything, isn't the making of a good game.

I can see having an option for a merc unit to retreat from a battlefield before the game is over as viable, but not a damage limit clause.

I strongly agree with with this also, its just not right and Battletech fans/Mechwarriors want a damn good time out of this game. If your serious the competition then be serious but if you cant handle a hard fight and having to try hard to win, or make a few friends to cover your 6 then dont bother IMO.

[3Xtr3m3]

Vectoron, on 14 May 2012 - 11:15 PM, said:

I strongly agree with with this also, its just not right and Battletech fans/Mechwarriors want a damn good time out of this game. If your serious the competition then be serious but if you cant handle a hard fight and having to try hard to win, or make a few friends to cover your 6 then dont bother IMO.

So casual gamers need not apply? Not the smartest business plan I ever heard.
There should be room in this Universe that we are all so passionate about for the Harcore gamers and the casual gamers as well.

BTW
<--- is a casual gamer.

[ManDaisy]

Oh please we all know statistics can mean whatever you want them to mean. ESPECIALLY in journalism. No further point, just beef with journalism in general.

Edited by ManDaisy, 15 May 2012 - 05:20 AM.

[MaddMaxx]

3Xtr3m3, on 14 May 2012 - 05:17 PM, said:

Agreed that this is something that could be abused IF INACTED BADLY. Though your example puzzles me, If the player who took the Gaus slug retreats from the battle before his commander says to do so, he is guilty of a lot of things.

The example was to show that, with a Clause in effect, why should "I" be part of the dead 30% and then we BUG out. Unless, the Clause also stipulated the Team pays ALL Repair Bills of ALL members in the fight from the C-Bills earned after running away...

I suspect the secondary Clause, within the Clause, will be quite difficult to enforce.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 15 May 2012 - 07:01 AM.

[SideSt3p]

I think this is a cool idea. My current limitation is that I really don't know or understand how the Merc Companies work. House Units appear to be really easy to figure out, but the Merc Companies...LOL

So I'm just waiting to see. I'm hoping to be a Mercenary!

[wwiiogre]

Casual gamers are going to get the part of MWO called Drop Ship Mode that will let them train with mulitple mechs during a mission as they will get to respawn. Heck I imagine that a huge chunk of the player base will be using this mode to grind with. Since it will allow your pilot to grind xp in multiple chasis of mechs during a single game. Not sure if the repair and rearm bill will be to high for this to work well or not. But if I can gain pilot xp in drop ship mode, I will also be playing this style of game as well as I want to be able to learn to pilot each mech well and only stick time will give a pilot that.

chris

[Felicitatem Parco]

This entire Scheme is based on the presumption that Mech Repairs are expensive and will outweigh the gains of success if your Merc Corps wins the battle but loses half your buddies in the fight.

I think the Devs are designing this game specifically so that the Winning team will not have to worry about recouping their costs, because the rewards will be substantial. If your Merc Corps is reduced to 25% strength by the end of a glorious, victorous match, then you should still come out with a profit in the end.

If it were otherwise, then the game wouldn't work.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 15 May 2012 - 08:04 AM.

[Bolo Warden]

The only time I could see this as being viable would be if a commander and his/her group were on Outreach, or similar planet for house factions, and using the training fields. This would be a group scenario imposed upon by the review board, to help evaluate companies. As the group dealt more damage while currently taking less in return, the higher the review board's scores. If you hit x%, then your team is done playing in the sandlots. At that point, a suggestion that the group should practice their skills, tactics and retry.

But in the real world, I can't see how this could be useful in-game. If the commander decide to pull the plug and leave the match because things aren't going his/her way, so be it. If you and your opponent decide to call the match after one side or the other losses 30%, so be it. But to make everyone follow this type of thought (i.e. if one side loses 30% of their capability, they lose the match), I would have to strongly protest.

[Zaius Ex]

Gonna go ahead and add myself to the wave of no's for this idea. I think it's a terrible suggestion for the following reasons:

1. As far as we know, merc corps fight only other merc corps for border worlds. So the PuG vs. Seasoned Team thing is a non-issue to begin with.

2. The dropship mode is the casual mode.

3. You're punishing people for playing the game properly and only a certain group of those players. Others (i.e. House units that are organized and work together like the merc units do) get a benefit from it.

You said you suggested this as a way to boost player retention, but I contend you are being ridiculously shortsighted in that. So Johnny Newb McFirstmech joins the game and rolls some merc units because they have a handicap due to this system. Then all of a sudden all the merc corps disappear because they're all gimped with this clause in their contracts and it's no fun to play merc. Now Mr. McFirstmech finds himself against the same merc players only they've joined Houses now if they didn't quit altogether (some of us don't much appreciate the Great Houses after all), so they no longer have the handicap. He finds that he loses most if not all of his matches now because he's been coddled so long with an easy time he never developed any real skills or tactics at the game other than zerg and destroy. Now he and the other players like him get frustrated and quit. Finally you're left with a game that has nearly no mercs due to the handicap and only long time fans in the Houses because the casual players keep getting beaten.

In my opinion the best way to keep up true noob retention is to have a training tier or intro portion of the game where your matches are against other true noobs or just new players in general until you reach a certain experience/influence cap. This way you learn key skills/tactics for the game and get better as a player instead of crutching on some easy mode bs. You shouldn't punish the hardcore players for dedicating time to a game they love.

[Volthorne]

3Xtr3m3, on 15 May 2012 - 04:03 AM, said:

BTW
<--- is a casual gamer.

Well, that's the problem right there. A casual player trying to impose casual restricitons into a hardcore AAA title.

[Fetladral]

Also whats bad is some groups are going for hit and run where the company will be mostly lights and mediums and maybe 4 heavies or assaults which would possibly be targeted first what if the 2 assaults make up 30% of the bv and they go first you still have 10 mechs that are in field and you lose the battle even if more say maybe most of the enemy team is taken out.

[Vectoron]

3Xtr3m3, on 15 May 2012 - 04:03 AM, said:

So casual gamers need not apply? Not the smartest business plan I ever heard.
There should be room in this Universe that we are all so passionate about for the Harcore gamers and the casual gamers as well.

BTW
<--- is a casual gamer.

More like CASUAL GAMERS need not complain, or try to punish people who arent. If you dont wish to get serious and into the competition than Grimm has your fix, go to Dropship Mode. As far as Casual, The Devs have already solved the issue by allowing you to BUY your mechs with real cash to keep up with people. So even if you dont have time or are "casual" you are able to atleast attempt to keep up. The rest is up to you.

Edited by Vectoron, 15 May 2012 - 01:33 PM.

[eZZip]

The game should be perfectly playable for casual gamers, but people who don't really get into a game and learn its nuances (i.e., non-casual) shouldn't make gameplay suggestions that affect everybody. Obviously, pretty much nobody here has played, but judging from other games, it is a bad idea and doesn't really make sense for a game anyway.

I definitely wouldn't call MWO a 'hardcore' title though; I doubt that it would be a difficult game to get into, considering the defining aspect of most hard games is a lot to learn (past controls) and fast gameplay.

[Vectoron]

eZZip, on 15 May 2012 - 01:59 PM, said:

The game should be perfectly playable for casual gamers, but people who don't really get into a game and learn its nuances (i.e., non-casual) shouldn't make gameplay suggestions that affect everybody. Obviously, pretty much nobody here has played, but judging from other games, it is a bad idea and doesn't really make sense for a game anyway.

I definitely wouldn't call MWO a 'hardcore' title though; I doubt that it would be a difficult game to get into, considering the defining aspect of most hard games is a lot to learn (past controls) and fast gameplay.

I can understand you not saying this isnt a Hardcore game, because most shooters arent exactly hardcore. But in mechwarrior, youll not only need to discuss pregame battle plans, Strategy and coordination could very well be everything to winning a battle. Being able to react quickly will set alot aside and i mean alot more than (ima jump and shoot you) like in halo, and youll be surprised how many people cant react quickly or work together well. so it very well may be a hardcore game. You dont exactly know what it will be when it comes out and neither do i. but i wouldnt go around saying that it isnt a hardcore game just yet.

Edited by Vectoron, 15 May 2012 - 04:05 PM.