110 replies to this topic

[Squirtbox]

Rannos, on 08 December 2012 - 06:56 AM, said:

Oh, what does that have to do with anything? SA is a community in the hundreds of thousands. Some of us have never even heard of EVE.



Tell us more about how you were grown from a vat by furries to play a game.

Stopped reading the entire thread to comment on this.

Posting how large your 'community' is has nothing to do with the fact you've never heard of EVE. That would be like saying my country numbers in the hundreds of millions and some of us have never heard of cricket. Completely irrelevant to the point you are making.

[RainbowToh]

Unless someone can come up with a good technical solution to prevent sync dropping, otherwise just deal with it. After all if they sync drop, that means your team prob has two 4 mech premades as well. Talk to them.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

I guess the developers assumed that teams wanted to play against other teams (the majority probably do, but some teams are interested in padding their stats and wallets). Maybe next time they can require a minimum of 4 PUGs per team in the PUG matchmaker.

[TB Freelancer]

GenDread, on 08 December 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

Sync dropping is not going to stop untill theres some form of mitigation in 8 man drops. Though we don't do it i can understand who others do. dropping 8 mans is usually a fest of 400 -600 tons of atlas and another 100-150 tons of other mechs. bringing back weight matching to 8 mans would fix this issue even if people had to wait to drop.

I don't think a lot of you guys get it. You're not getting matched drops in 8vs8 because there aren't enough enough premades to make weight matching a viable option many hours of the day.

Either there has to be a max tonnage or a strict 2-2-2-2 chassis requirement or some combination of the two. It would still allow 'unbalanced' teams, but the discrepancy wouldn't be as big as some of the more wild situations that can happen with no restrictions.

[Kaziganthi]

Aerowind, on 08 December 2012 - 06:15 AM, said:

I can't tell what he's asking here, can you guys? Near as I can tell, he's getting upset because the matchmaker randomly put two 4 mans on the enemy team.

Either that, or he's complaining about 2 mans. I'm honestly not sure which.

What he is complaining about is the sync-dropping. and yes it can be done.

Greyfyl, on 08 December 2012 - 06:55 AM, said:

So if I understand the OP...

It's perfectly acceptable for 4-man teams to stomp the living crap out of pugs.

But it's not ok for people to double-sync drop and 8-man group to stomp 4-man groups?

Holy hypocrites Batman!@!$!@!

If you want to sync-drop with 2 man man teams. obviosuly toyr showing yourself as the not so 1337 player that wanted the 8 man drops. As your 8 man is obviosuly getting their butt handed to them tied up in a nice big pink ribbon.

[Kaziganthi]

Konrad, on 08 December 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

I am curious where everyone is getting this information from. Can you please share your sources?

Thanks,

Corp I ran with did this prior to the 8v8 patch a few times to try and get training matches against each of our in house companies.

[Kaziganthi]

RainbowToh, on 08 December 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

Unless someone can come up with a good technical solution to prevent sync dropping, otherwise just deal with it. After all if they sync drop, that means your team prob has two 4 mech premades as well. Talk to them.

Umm what!!!!

If they have 2 man premades on their side, and I have 2 4-man premades on my side. What am I the pug refferee in the middle in the white atlas carrying the big neural disruptor stick? What the poster is saying if I believe is the 2 4 man premades syncing so they can roflstomp the 8 1 man pug group

Edited by Kaziganthi, 08 December 2012 - 01:03 PM.

[Throat Punch]

Kaziganthi, on 08 December 2012 - 12:49 PM, said:

If you want to sync-drop with 2 man man teams. obviosuly toyr showing yourself as the not so 1337 player that wanted the 8 man drops. As your 8 man is obviosuly getting their butt handed to them tied up in a nice big pink ribbon.

Or it could be a pre-made is sick of fighting a team of 8 D-DC's or 8 Ravens, or 8 Jenners and is looking for some semblance of a real fight. Or it could be you don't have a full 8 man. I've sync-dropped as 2 three man teams because some of our guys just couldn't play that night, and if you end up together great, if you don't no biggie either. About 50% of the time we end against each other anyways.

Edited by Morsdraco, 08 December 2012 - 01:05 PM.

[Kaziganthi]

Morsdraco, on 08 December 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

Or it could be a premade is sick of fighting a team of 8 D-DC's or 8 Ravens, or 8 Jenners and is looking for some semblance of a real fight. Or it could be like my case where you don't have a full 8 man so you sync-drop as 2 three man teams, and if you end up together great, if you don't no biggie either. About 50% of the time we end against each other anyways.

The probkem is, even though its allowed, it's not really fair is it. You know that your roughly 50% likely to end up in the same match with another 50% of being on the same side, and your most likley going up against a full pug group, especiallly when you can see the coordination they are showing. Do you guys back off and say, hey we'll send 1 of our premades in to help the 2 pugs, while the others sit back in reserve, and if they take them out we move in. Or do you just roll on in with your 6 players and steamroll and requeue?

Edit : and the poster i was replying to was asking if it's not ok to sync drop with 2 x 4 man teams on the pretense they'll be going up agaiunst another 4 man team. If you have enough for an 8 man, drop an 8 man. Yeah you may die, so as people keep saying its a game. Learn from the loss and adjust. It's how you be competative. What's going to happen when CW comes in and your not able to sync drop and you need 8 men to take the field. Your skills will be lacking.

Edited by Kaziganthi, 08 December 2012 - 01:09 PM.

[Throat Punch]

Kaziganthi, on 08 December 2012 - 01:06 PM, said:

The probkem is, even though its allowed, it's not really fair is it. You know that your roughly 50% likely to end up in the same match with another 50% of being on the same side, and your most likley going up against a full pug group, especiallly when you can see the coordination they are showing. Do you guys back off and say, hey we'll send 1 of our premades in to help the 2 pugs, while the others sit back in reserve, and if they take them out we move in. Or do you just roll on in with your 6 players and steamroll and requeue?

We tell the pugs we are a pre-made and involve them in our tactics. If they choose to be part of the plan, then great, if they choose to ignore us and lone wolf it more power to them. And just because all 6 of us end up together isn't an "insta-win" by any means. We have had plenty of matches that even had all 6 or 7 of us get on the same team, and we get curb stomped.

[Ghost_19Hz]

It was inevitable that this would happen, in the 8v8 teams some are good, some are terrible... just like every group in the history of earth. Now the terrible ones can't make money and look like tards when up against an entire team of skilled opponents, as they possess no skill of their own or as a group, save for focus fire and half decent mech builds.

Now they are desperately trying to find ways to pub stomp teams that maybe if they are lucky have a handful of skilled players, who, in that scenario will not make enough difference to win.

They then justify their actions by saying 8v8 is too hard for the reward, it takes too long, boo hoo, whatever. You just suck get over yourselves. When we did the ESL's ESEA's TWL's CSL for CSS and BF2 there would always be at least one guy while better than pubs, was terrible in competitive environment.

[Akulakhan]

I gotta agree with the OP here, if you have 8 people RUN AGAINST OTHER 8 MANS, which is what we do. If we don't have the numbers, we'll split into two smaller premades. You can roflstomp pugs with ease with 4 people, and you may even run into another 4 man premade with the same communication. Syncdropping is ridiculous and proves you can't handle (the admittedly lame currently) tactics of a real 8 man, but at least it's something of a challenge to go against a team of similar builds and communication.

Basically, show some pride guys. Roflstomping proves nothing, ever. It's even too easy with four.

[Soy]

Grraarrgghh, on 08 December 2012 - 06:41 AM, said:

Yep goons have never dominated in any other game ever.

Nope.

Not once.

I've been seeing Goons in online gaming since 2003 and never once have I ever seen any individual gaming skill displayed by any of them, at this point I've come across thousands. I will say however, they are skilled politicians and obviously enjoy zerging. Thankfully politics mean zilch at the moment in MWO and you can't really 10198510985 v 8, either.

[BigJim]

Vexel, on 08 December 2012 - 06:41 AM, said:

Unless they can come up with a technical solution that forces groups to seed with groups that they haven't dropped with before, or a certain amount of matches before you can be in the same match as a team you've been with before, there isn't really a way to stop it. Even that wouldn't be perfect.

No, it wouldn't be perfect - in fact it would be utterly ********, and kill the game completely for people like me, and all those who are in teams.
It would kill the league, the tournaments, everything good that has come out of the community at all (the only other thing this community does is bi**ch about stuff).

We may not be the majority numerically, but it'll be a looooong time before the regular joe-publics who dip their collective toes are putting the cash into this game that the die-hards do..

All I'm interested in is competitive team v team play, and if you can't drop vs a given team, then why even bother practising or being in the game at all?

[Vexel]

My suggestion, thought of off the cuff as it was, was in regards to teams sync dropping and being on the same side. Not teams opposing each other. So, the genuine competitive play you mention would be unaffected, if you are really looking for opponents in 4v4. In fact, I would hazard that you would probably end up enjoying things more as you'd be fighting against your own clan members. I know when I've seen my friends *randomly* pop up on the other team, it makes for much more banter and amusing shenanigans as you try and kill each other. Besides as it is Beta, they can test systems like that, since that is the point of Beta, to test.

Fact is, if you really wanted an honest experience and you had 2x4 man groups, you wouldn't try and coordinate drops, you'd just take it as it comes and deal with it like everyone else. If you end up in the same match on the same side, so be it, if not well... GLHF and try not to die.

Of course, on the other hand, you could always just play 8v8*.



*Which I do agree need work, and we shall see what they do with it in the coming patches. But it shouldn't give you a carte blanche pass to sync drop to be in the same team.



(Sorry if this is necro'd to far back, but I just got on the computer and this topic was still in my browser.)

[Dataman]

Rannos, on 08 December 2012 - 07:01 AM, said:

No no, I think that's Aurora. I'm pretty sure EVE is the one where you stare at a ship shooting a laser at a rock for three hours and then get blown up by space pirates.

is that the game that you build space ship with real dollars? then when your space ship blown (and along with your 'benjamin bill'), you QQ?

[Ricama]

Vexel, on 08 December 2012 - 06:41 AM, said:

OP is talking about Sync dropping (I'm pretty sure he is anyway).

Sync dropping is a problem in many team based games, I've seen in in WoW, TOR, and others (gets worse when you have teams doing win-trades in ladder competitions). In this game it is more obvious when it happens, especially so when you recognise groups (or see them in a channel further down in TS).

Unless they can come up with a technical solution that forces groups to seed with groups that they haven't dropped with before, or a certain amount of matches before you can be in the same match as a team you've been with before, there isn't really a way to stop it. Even that wouldn't be perfect.

Max 1 team per side ... how hard is this?

[Roadkill]

It would be a trivial fix and frankly I'm surprised that PGI didn't do it correctly from the start. The matchmaking system should not allow more than one group per side regardless of group size.

[Lefty Lucy]

Taizan, on 08 December 2012 - 11:47 AM, said:

Oh I'm not saying that the current "FOTM Fest" as you call it is a good thing- not at all. Just saying I can understand those that want to fight a battle with 7 other friends but not have to all bring D-DCs with them (if they have them at all on their team). Not everyone is skilled and coordinated enough to be able to counter 600 tons of "stealth death" and trying to fight that may be utterly frustrating. On top of that it will most probably help in practice and improving teamplay.

Its a common thing that players often seek the path of least resistance. For some its the assault stacking, for others its still sync dropping because of the assault stacking.

So then it's better to give someone else a frustrating game experience of having to fight someone else on 3rd party coms abusing the match making mechanic to defeat the limit of 4 players max on a team?

LOL

No.

[GioAvanti]

Rannos, on 08 December 2012 - 06:29 AM, said:

On the plus side, syncing isn't a perfect science so you may end up with 4mans on both sides! Then you just gotta hope they're not goons who will wait till you're all dead to hounoure duel in the caldera.

Goons have only been a factor in Eve; every other game they've joined they've proven to be fairly weak sauce.