229 replies to this topic

[Captain Midnight]

Klaus, on 15 December 2012 - 05:00 AM, said:

They've said why before I'm sure.

In a game where you can run out of ammo along with having your weapons destroyed there has to be another way to win other than killing the other team. It's pretty simple. TDM will never happen unless they introduce repairs/rearms in the actual match.

What are they afraid of? Obviously it being an assault mech only fest which goes against everything the game is trying to do. Go play some baby fps if you just wanna run around and shoot things without thinking.

What if I want to rush 3 line on Caustic Valley in ECM lights and not shoot ANYTHING without thinking? Is that okay? Thanks for the seal of approval!

[S3dition]

Captain Midnight, on 15 December 2012 - 05:05 AM, said:

What if I want to rush 3 line on Caustic Valley in ECM lights and not shoot ANYTHING without thinking? Is that okay? Thanks for the seal of approval!

That's a game balance issue, not a map or objectives issue. If I had a Dire Wolf right now, would you be worried about point capping? Afterall, a Dire Wolf or Kodiak could utterly kill 3 - 4 IS assault mechs without using an experienced pilot. So squatting it on our base while rushing to take yours with all heavies would be fair?

[Jalak Bali]

Captain Midnight, on 15 December 2012 - 04:45 AM, said:

Taking a castle by siege involved killing all the enemies defending it, not sieging for five turns and automatically winning. Objective based warfare is TDM where the winner holds the objective.

Duuurrr, that's what a siege is. What, you actually think the attackers in a siege would throw their men at the ramparts and walls day in and day out? That would be called an "assault" not a "siege". You siege a castle/town to force the defenders to surrender or at least force them out to face you in open battle (aka. "breaking the siege"). You cut off their supply, you burn their fields, you starve them out. You don't charge in. That defeats the entire purpose of a siege.

Also, no, it doesn't involve "killing all the enemies defending it". You win when the enemy surrenders the castle/city/etc.

[Sifright]

S3dition, on 15 December 2012 - 05:09 AM, said:

That's a game balance issue, not a map or objectives issue. If I had a Dire Wolf right now, would you be worried about point capping? Afterall, a Dire Wolf or Kodiak could utterly kill 3 - 4 IS assault mechs without using an experienced pilot. So squatting it on our base while rushing to take yours with all heavies would be fair?

Lol no it couldn't.

As the game stands at the moment all of the stock clan mech builds are completely useless.

I can't wait to see the first timber wolf user who will explode after two alphas because they don't have heat sinks working right.

[KinLuu]

Captain Midnight, on 15 December 2012 - 05:00 AM, said:

The objective is to capture the planet Noobulon IV, it has a factory that can produce Raven 3Ls and ECM. House Kurita has sent their best forces to capture this world, and defeat will be crippling to the war effort. Gentlemen, defeat is not an option. The southern peninulsa is best defended, numerous mines and static emplacements covering the approaches through the ravines. For this reason, we're going to send an elite squad via orbital drop into the forests in the north. From the rendezvous proceed south to E5 and engage the enemy and take the factory, if you stand in the red square for 25 seconds the enemy will surrender the factory regardless of how many forces they have remaining. Good luck and god speed.

YEAH SO BASICALLY TELL ME ALL ABOUT IT GUYS

Stupid, but still better than TDM.

The only thing I can imagine that would be worse than TDM would be FFA DM.

[S3dition]

Sifright, on 15 December 2012 - 05:10 AM, said:

Lol no it couldn't.

As the game stands at the moment all of the stock clan mech builds are completely useless.

I can't wait to see the first timber wolf user who will explode after two alphas because they don't have heat sinks working right.

Um... okay. I've seen Cicadas with more heat and less damage than a Timberwolf own assault mechs, but if makes you feel better, I'll let you learn that through experience!

[Captain Midnight]

S3dition, on 15 December 2012 - 05:09 AM, said:

That's a game balance issue, not a map or objectives issue. If I had a Dire Wolf right now, would you be worried about point capping? Afterall, a Dire Wolf or Kodiak could utterly kill 3 - 4 IS assault mechs without using an experienced pilot. So squatting it on our base while rushing to take yours with all heavies would be fair?

Wow, it's a game balanace issue? and all this time I thought it wasn't an issue at all! I forget what I was even posting about, was it turtles? was it linday lohan? OH RIGHT, IT WAS ABOUT A GAME BALANCE ISSUE!!!!!! yeah dude I know it's a game balance issue and the solution is absolutely 100% not making clan mechs OP, it's about making the system fair so all mechs are balanced.

[Sifright]

KinLuu, on 15 December 2012 - 05:12 AM, said:

Stupid, but still better than TDM.

The only thing I can imagine that would be worse than TDM would be FFA DM.

what, how exactly is that better than TDM?

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT.

S3dition, on 15 December 2012 - 05:12 AM, said:

Um... okay. I've seen Cicadas with more heat and less damage than a Timberwolf own assault mechs, but if makes you feel better, I'll let you learn that through experience!

Hahaha, You must be one of those terrible players that doesn't understand how the game works currently.

I run an SRM6 Cat anything that isn't protected by copious amounts of lag shield dies almost instantly.

Tell me about these cicada builds that run ER ppcs like complete jebs and get away with it because they are pugging and most players are pants on head useless.

[S3dition]

Captain Midnight, on 15 December 2012 - 05:13 AM, said:

Wow, it's a game balanace issue? and all this time I thought it wasn't an issue at all! I forget what I was even posting about, was it turtles? was it linday lohan? OH RIGHT, IT WAS ABOUT A GAME BALANCE ISSUE!!!!!! yeah dude I know it's a game balance issue and the solution is absolutely 100% not making clan mechs OP, it's about making the system fair so all mechs are balanced.

I don't even know what you're arguing now. Do you know what you're arguing? Clan mechs aren't in the game. I was referring to their current power level if they were injected "as is". You seem to feel that changing game modes to 1995 standards would fix a game that is about 10x more complex than the most recent game implementing TDM. Sorry, but developers with 2+ years of development on a game engine with 1000+ employees and 200+ million dollars make TDM games (that suck). But you want PGI, a company with only a fraction of that money, an insanely complex game, and only ~20 - 30 employees to spit out a TDM game in a slow paced simulation game?

You need to spend more time yelling at DCS to see where that will get you

[KinLuu]

Sifright, on 15 December 2012 - 05:16 AM, said:

what, how exactly is that better than TDM?

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT.

Simply, the current gamemode - even as flawed as it is - forces teams to make decisions... Where to fight, where to defend, where to scout. How to handle the enemy.

In TDM you just blob up and go. TDM is for CoD-tards.

[Sifright]

KinLuu, on 15 December 2012 - 05:19 AM, said:

Simply, the current gamemode - even as flawed as it is - forces teams to make decisions... Where to fight, where to defend, where to scout. How to handle the enemy.

In TDM you just blob up and go. TDM is for CoD-tards.

........

it doesn't though.

In Cap warrior online you blob up at a point on the map and sit there because thanks to the cap zones there is no reason to do otherwise.

S3dition, on 15 December 2012 - 05:19 AM, said:

I don't even know what you're arguing now. Do you know what you're arguing? Clan mechs aren't in the game. I was referring to their current power level if they were injected "as is". You seem to feel that changing game modes to 1995 standards would fix a game that is about 10x more complex than the most recent game implementing TDM. Sorry, but developers with 2+ years of development on a game engine with 1000+ employees and 200+ million dollars make TDM games (that suck). But you want PGI, a company with only a fraction of that money, an insanely complex game, and only ~20 - 30 employees to spit out a TDM game in a slow paced simulation game?

You need to spend more time yelling at DCS to see where that will get you

You aren't the sharpest knife in the drawer are you?

Edited by Sifright, 15 December 2012 - 05:30 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

TDM would be fine. I even know of situation when that should be the primary objective... Strong rivalry the most prominent. But to date i don't think we have enough animosity towards one another to warrant forcing this scenario style... yet

[S3dition]

No, I only know about programming, IT and network systems, game design, history, English, creative writing and character development. Certainly not sharp enough to grasp that this entire thread is a huge "forget Battletech, just make us another modern warfare where death doesn't matter and 6 story tall death machines are as common as paper mache!" rant.

Edited by S3dition, 15 December 2012 - 05:32 AM.

[KinLuu]

Sifright, on 15 December 2012 - 05:25 AM, said:

........

it doesn't though.

In Cap warrior online you blob up at a point on the map and sit there because thanks to the cap zones there is no reason to do otherwise.

Still better than TDM.

The gamemode in general is fine. The current implement is not... if you have only one capturenode per team, capping should be blocked if both teams claim the enemies node. But there should be much more nodes in the first place. You know, like in most other successfull FPS games?

[Sifright]

S3dition, on 15 December 2012 - 05:31 AM, said:

No, I only know about programming, IT and network systems, game design, history, English, creative writing and character development. Certainly not sharp enough to grasp that this entire thread is a huge "forget Battletech, just make us another modern warfare where death doesn't matter and 6 story tall death machines are as common as paper mache!" rant.

Yes that exactly what we are asking for thanks for boiling your own imagined opposition down to that, I'm glad I can finally see exactly what your [REDACTED]

FYI, Team death match with permanent player death (for that match) has been in games since 96, [REDACTED]

Assault mode encourages some really stupid and frustratingly boring tactics.

TDM would encourage actually shooting at each other. You know combat and fighting?

Edited by Viterbi, 18 December 2012 - 02:32 PM.
Removed insults

[Teralitha]

S3dition, on 15 December 2012 - 02:28 AM, said:

Keep in mind that Mechwarrior Online and Battletech in general is more than just a generic video game. They were meant to be combat simulators. Despite what many believe, there is more to warfare that simply killing everything that comes your way. It's a waste of money and lives to just stand and shoot in an open field, which is why modern warfare is done with specific objectives in mind.

Battletech emphasizes this in every novel and bit of fluff that has ever been published. The entire premise of the clans is making an auction system to minimize asset loss when seizing objectives. Thus, it stands to reason that you will not see TDM or any kind of meat grinder. The devs have announced a "drop ship" mode where you get 4 mechs, but this is a far cry from classic TDM.

There are many great games that offer this kind of play mode, such as Planetside 2,Teamfortress 2, Monday Night Combat, Unreal 3, etc.

Mechwarrior is not that kind of game, and in an effort to be more than "just another shooter", it should remain so.

What the hell are you talking about... mechwarrior has ALWAYS been that kind of game.

[xenoglyph]

I think there should be some more arguing about which is better.

I'll get in on it, let me know if I properly understand the general consensus.

Assault is apparently a highbrow, mech romney kind of thinking man's game...akin to Weiqi played with diamond pieces on a solid gold board. Anything else is just rubbish.

TDM is the dumbed down version for the knuckle dragging masses, a crass sport only mentioned in hushed whispers. Who would want to play that?

[Teralitha]

Korm, on 15 December 2012 - 02:34 AM, said:

7 guys died, only one left. He's in fast light mech. Now he will run away from the "winners" till the timer ends. "Finish them all" mode might be a nightmare.

No more or less frustrating than a suicider/macro afker on your team. I personally dont mind searching to find the last mech hiding on these TINY *** maps. Honestly the maps are so small they will be found quickly. Such a player can simply... leave the match too to avoid consquences.

Edited by Teralitha, 15 December 2012 - 05:45 AM.

[S3dition]

Sifright, on 15 December 2012 - 05:34 AM, said:

Yes that exactly what we are asking for thanks for boiling your own imagined opposition down to that, I'm glad I can finally see exactly what your fevered mind seems to think we are asking for!

FYI, Team death match with permanent player death (for that match) has been in games since 96, pull the rod out of your *** and stop being a jackass.

Assault mode encourages some really stupid and frustratingly boring tactics.

TDM would encourage actually shooting at each other. You know combat and fighting?

My my, aren't we unsociable.

Actually "Team Death Match" represents two teams killing each other until the kill meter on one site hits a pre-determined win level. In other words, you're talking about respawns.

I'm trying hard not to completely mock you right now. I really am, so forgive me for a little condescending tone.

You are completely wrong here. Many people have proven you wrong so far. You are turning this personal in the hopes of pushing your own argumentative failure into some sort of personal vendetta. Just stop. It's not helping you or the forums to do this.

There are people making the decisions for this game that have built, sold, and lost more games than you have played, which makes them far more worthy of making decisions than you or I.

You don't agree with them? That's fine. You aren't forced to play or even post here. In fact, continuing on such a hate-filled path will lead us to reporting your posts.

You've said your part, I've said mine. Let's just stop here?

[Teralitha]

there is little point in argueing against having TDM mode. Those that like it, should have it, and those that dont, will always have their assault mode. So there really is no reason or arguement not to have TDM.. devs?

Right now all the players who hate assault mode either dont play anymore, or will get fed up eventually and not play anymore. That is no small number of players. I believe there is another topic or 2 concerning the number of players still playing and the TS servers being quite empty these days.... That and the reveal of how conquest mode works was the last nail in the coffin for me. I want TDM or Im done here. Dont think im the only one either.

Edited by Teralitha, 15 December 2012 - 05:51 AM.