268 replies to this topic

[King Arthur IV]

PANZERBUNNY, on 05 January 2013 - 08:24 AM, said:

It was said that during Community Warfare, fighting for certain factions and gaining loyalty points would "unlock" access to certain insignia and schemes, but I'm starting to think that you unlock the honour of spending a crazy amount of MC to use them.

Grind your way up. Pay the MC for temporary Decals, colour and camo.

hmmm.

talking about spending crazy amounts of mc. btw sorry if you own a hero mech but they are useless imo. for $20 you get a mech with special camo/paint but only grind extra cbill and exp on that certain mech. for the same $20 i can purchase a mech, cockpit item,paint and premium time. unless that hero mech is worth it to you for what ever reason., then sure.

i feel so many people are con into buying hero mechs for grinding and people forget that the hero mech is useless in helping you grind out basic/elite/masters.

[King Arthur IV]

Wizard Steve, on 05 January 2013 - 08:35 AM, said:

Yet another pointless poll.

Q. Would you support a change that gives you more than you have now for no additional outlay?
A. Errr.....

please elaborate, i seriously dont understand. i and many others have explain why the current plan doesnt work but you obviously see something i dont, so explain.

o0Marduk0o, on 05 January 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:

It's pointless as a poll sure and the general idea is not new but PGI should take a close look at it. It's a win-win situation for both sides. Customers buy more different paintjobs for each mechs, because they can keep them and PGI earns more money that way.

give him a chance to explain himself out of this one.

[GriefHard]

I can accept buying colors and pattern even for each variant, if it is a must. BUT, I don't want to always rebuy them, if I paint that Mech differently...

If you maybe think about a real camouflage pattern in the future, I am not gonna spend MCs over and over again.

So - I would accept to buy different colors and patterns even for each Mech variant. But I want to reuse them on this Mech variant over and over again, without paying for them again.

Although I am no specialist at F2P games, this is my first, I strongly feel, that it should at least be the above described way!

[King Arthur IV]

JohnnyC, on 05 January 2013 - 08:40 AM, said:

I voted "no" because I would like to be able to buy paint colors and then use them on any mech I want. The only example I see of "doing it right" is the PC Gamer skin colors... except they screwed those up by making them off versions of the original colors so they no longer look like PC Gamer colors, but at least you can use them on multiple mechs and can use the colors at will.

PC Gamer colors are Cherry Red, White, and Black... They wanted to charge money for those three colors so they change the PC Gamer colors to Maroon, gray, and dark gray... which was, again, weaksauce.

sorry buddy but your plan would never be implemented at the current paint prices. if it was, the prices would be something insane.
but thank you for telling us why you voted no, you are the first.

Edited by King Arthur IV, 05 January 2013 - 09:02 AM.

[King Arthur IV]

o0Marduk0o, on 05 January 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:

It's pointless as a poll sure and the general idea is not new but PGI should take a close look at it. It's a win-win situation for both sides. Customers buy more different paintjobs for each mechs, because they can keep them and PGI earns more money that way.

i only hope the poll can draw attention to pgi to take a closer look at our consumer/producer dilemma.

DoctorDigital, on 05 January 2013 - 08:53 AM, said:

I can accept buying colors and pattern even for each variant, if it is a must. BUT, I don't want to always rebuy them, if I paint that Mech differently...

If you maybe think about a real camouflage pattern in the future, I am not gonna spend MCs over and over again.

So - I would accept to buy different colors and patterns even for each Mech variant. But I want to reuse them on this Mech variant over and over again, without paying for them again.

Although I am no specialist at F2P games, this is my first, I strongly feel, that it should at least be the above described way!

general people that are voting yes feel the same way as you. ty buddy

[Barghest Whelp]

Yeah, I don't spend cash on camos atm, partly because I'm not willing to spend that much on vanity items, and partly because it's not permanent, I.E I have to pay every time I want to change it.

Lower the prices, and let the unlocks be permanent for each variant, and I will start buying. And yes, I have already spent money on this game. I just feel that hero mechs, mechbays and other mechs are a much better buy. The mechs i bought for MC that I didn't want I could strip for parts and sell for a few CB in return.

Paintjobs? Heh, not a very good investment atm. If it was cheaper I wouldn't mind that fact that it's just vanity, and I'd buy it anyways. Price makes a difference.

[Joseph Mallan]

Mathmatics made a similar suggestion a month ago(IIRC). Buying "pots" of paint like us Mini maniacs do would be a sweet way to get more money out of my pocket. I would be more apt to experiment with color schemes if I had paint to work with.

[Sug]

I could see permanently owning the Camo pattern, cause those are like skins. But paying for paint each time you repaint is fine.

[Joseph Mallan]

A good idea Sug.

[Kaptain]

This has been said many times and I am glad this poll has received so much response.
+1 for op

Those of you who keep saying "they need revenue" are NOT paying attention to the bulk of our feedback! We are NOT saying to give paint to us for c bills or for FREE! We ARE saying we would SPEND MONEY on them if we were allowed to KEEP what we buy. This would greatly increase the revenue stream as many of us are fundamental apposed to the current system of loose what you pay for.

I know 8 people personally that play this game. 7 of them are founders. 4 of those legendary. Only one of those has painted a single mech and we are all agreed that we will not pay for a thing until we get to keep what we buy.

EDIT: One more thing. Allow us to own what we purchase and I will buy every color and every pattern. Don't, and I will NEVER spend a dime on patterns and colors. From my personal experience and community feedback it is very clear I am far from alone on this one.

Edited by Kaptain, 05 January 2013 - 10:04 AM.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Most people don't understand marketing.

I mean, the only reason I can see them doing it this way is to scoop early buyers of this system before switching over OR they simply don't have the ability in the game for an account to retain colour and camo to be used on your various mechs when purchased.

If this is THE way they hope to market their colour and camo, well, it's laughable and speaks wonders. Who is in charge of these decisions?

They also can't release anything about it until it's ready to launch because it will make everyone stop using MC for it, those that do.

UNLESS there is a way to keep track of who has purchased what, recover that information and grant them previous purchased colour and camo to their account.

Edited by PANZERBUNNY, 05 January 2013 - 09:58 AM.

[Jetfire]

The straight up fact is this, the present monetization scheme for Camo will convert people with massive amounts of funds or very small amounts of Mechs. People who have many mechs or like to change their camo up often or have even moderate investments in MC will not convert very much.

The solution is the make the Paint Cans, Patterns and Decals bind to account unlocks. Think of it like buying a large supply of paint, a stencil and pattern for your paint tech to work with. Nothing is gained from making the paint can limited so keep it infinite like the PC Gamer colors. Now you can continue to release Colors, Patterns and Decals on a continuous basis creating a sustained revenue stream. Yes, someday you may run out of colors that you wish to release, but then you have a large pallette that people will buy into over time and you still have limitless patterns and decals to design.

People with massive funds "Whales" will just unlock everything. Score 1 for PGI
People with a few Mechs will still unlock what they want to use. Score 2 for PGI - balance with where they are now
People with many Mechs will now feel that the money is a fair charge and buy in. Score 3 for PGI
People with moderate funds will see a better value and start to buy. Score 4 for PGI
People with collector mentalities will be enticed to spend and purchase more MC. Score 5 for PGI
People with low funds may occasionally convert due to the fact that they can slowly accumulate options. Score 6 for PGI

All in all there should be no way this change would do anything but attract more revenue. The initial Camo pass is mainly for the Whales and I am sure it has made them some money, but for both PGI and my sake, I hope they realize how much money they are leaving on the table.

Edited by Jetfire, 05 January 2013 - 10:07 AM.

[Sir Wulfrick]

Given the proposal I would, as I suspect many others would, be very happy to purchase quite a variety of paint jobs.

I suspect that the 'sell cheaply to many' paradigm applies particulalry well to paint jobs and other cosmetic items that one can buy in MWO. I have no problem with the cost of chassis or mech bay slots, but I do think that the price of MC and cosmetic items is significantly higher than optimal.

[Loonix]

Micro-transactions huh... never the easiest thing to balance. I've been wondering about paint actually. So you have to pay every time you make a change, including for patterns?

Paying for access to paints and patterns, for specific Mechs, makes more sense to me than paying every time you want to change something. I don't see how PGI will stand to make more money by charging per change, certainly it's not something I'm willing to pay for.

If I could have two colour schemes for my 'go to mech'; one for community warfare/merc colours, and one for my own damn amusement, I would. But I wont pay for every time I switch between the two. Anyone who is going to pay to paint the same mech several times clearly has more money than I do!

[JohnnyC]

King Arthur IV, on 05 January 2013 - 08:55 AM, said:

sorry buddy but your plan would never be implemented at the current paint prices. if it was, the prices would be something insane.
but thank you for telling us why you voted no, you are the first.

Well... here's the thing. If they offered a paint set of 5 colors that I could re-use for about $5, I would buy it. Right now they offer single paint colors for $1.40 per color (if you buy the 1250MC pack with US currency) that only apply to one slot on one mech. So to paint 3 colors on a color scheme it costs $4.20... even if you use the same color for all three slots. At those prices I will never buy a paint color. It doesn't matter what color they offer, I'm not buying it. That is revenue lost. It was a bad pricing scheme to begin with and it still is.

I am 100% positive that I'm not the only one largely ignoring the whole custom paint system simply because it is priced ridiculously. The whole thing seemed like a slap in the face. I still distinctly remember PGI's email announcing that they were releasing the new paint system and I excitedly logged in to paint my mechs and then my mood went from excitement to absolute disgust. Greed is ugly and that's all the paint system seems to me now.

If they come up with other PC Gamer setups where we get a color pack along with the skin and I get to re-use them in the future, I'll buy those. They keep offering these overpriced one use/one slot money grabs and they can forget getting a dime out of me in the paint system because I'll never spend MC on that.

[JohnnyC]

HouseCat, on 05 January 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

Micro-transactions huh... never the easiest thing to balance. I've been wondering about paint actually. So you have to pay every time you make a change, including for patterns?

Paying for access to paints and patterns, for specific Mechs, makes more sense to me than paying every time you want to change something. I don't see how PGI will stand to make more money by charging per change, certainly it's not something I'm willing to pay for.

If I could have two colour schemes for my 'go to mech'; one for community warfare/merc colours, and one for my own damn amusement, I would. But I wont pay for every time I switch between the two. Anyone who is going to pay to paint the same mech several times clearly has more money than I do!

You have to pay for each time you use a color in each slot and each skin every time you apply it to a mech.

Example Painting a single mech with "Phranken" + 3 custom colors

750MC for the skin
250MC for custom color 1
250MC for custom color 2
250MC for custom color 3

Total is 1500MC (or about $8.38)

Later you decide to change to default paint: 0MC cost (unless you change the colors of the default)

Then you decide you want to change back to the Phranken skin with your colors... another 1500MC (or about $8.38) to change it back to what you previously purchased.

Essentially... every time you change the paint, you have to pay. Doesn't matter if you previously bought those colors or not. They're all 1 use skins and one slot use colors. Even if you make all three color slots the same color you must pay 250MC per slot.

Hope that explains it.

[Kaptain]

Jetfire, on 05 January 2013 - 10:02 AM, said:

The straight up fact is this, the present monetization scheme for Camo will convert people with massive amounts of funds or very small amounts of Mechs. People who have many mechs or like to change their camo up often or have even moderate investments in MC will not convert very much.

The solution is the make the Paint Cans, Patterns and Decals bind to account unlocks. Think of it like buying a large supply of paint, a stencil and pattern for your paint tech to work with. Nothing is gained from making the paint can limited so keep it infinite like the PC Gamer colors. Now you can continue to release Colors, Patterns and Decals on a continuous basis creating a sustained revenue stream. Yes, someday you may run out of colors that you wish to release, but then you have a large pallette that people will buy into over time and you still have limitless patterns and decals to design.

People with massive funds "Whales" will just unlock everything. Score 1 for PGI
People with a few Mechs will still unlock what they want to use. Score 2 for PGI - balance with where they are now
People with many Mechs will now feel that the money is a fair charge and buy in. Score 3 for PGI
People with moderate funds will see a better value and start to buy. Score 4 for PGI
People with collector mentalities will be enticed to spend and purchase more MC. Score 5 for PGI
People with low funds may occasionally convert due to the fact that they can slowly accumulate options. Score 6 for PGI

All in all there should be no way this change would do anything but attract more revenue. The initial Camo pass is mainly for the Whales and I am sure it has made them some money, but for both PGI and my sake, I hope they realize how much money they are leaving on the table.

Very well said!

[Gorthaur]

I wouldn't mind paying for the colors every time if they were considerably cheaper (25-50 mc). I would rather have the patterns be permanent, even if they were a little pricier.

[King Arthur IV]

Sug, on 05 January 2013 - 09:21 AM, said:

I could see permanently owning the Camo pattern, cause those are like skins. But paying for paint each time you repaint is fine.

share your money with me!!!!

Kaptain, on 05 January 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

This has been said many times and I am glad this poll has received so much response.
+1 for op

Those of you who keep saying "they need revenue" are NOT paying attention to the bulk of our feedback! We are NOT saying to give paint to us for c bills or for FREE! We ARE saying we would SPEND MONEY on them if we were allowed to KEEP what we buy. This would greatly increase the revenue stream as many of us are fundamental apposed to the current system of loose what you pay for.

I know 8 people personally that play this game. 7 of them are founders. 4 of those legendary. Only one of those has painted a single mech and we are all agreed that we will not pay for a thing until we get to keep what we buy.

EDIT: One more thing. Allow us to own what we purchase and I will buy every color and every pattern. Don't, and I will NEVER spend a dime on patterns and colors. From my personal experience and community feedback it is very clear I am far from alone on this one.

no ty buddy for posting in here and keep this going. i need more people to help me fight the good fight cuz alot dont understand consumer spending.

PANZERBUNNY, on 05 January 2013 - 09:55 AM, said:

Most people don't understand marketing.

I mean, the only reason I can see them doing it this way is to scoop early buyers of this system before switching over OR they simply don't have the ability in the game for an account to retain colour and camo to be used on your various mechs when purchased.

funny thing is and i know you know, is that op's proposal benefits both consumers who have small or large purchasing power because its flexible.

in the real world, we know we cant keep our paints for reuse but this is the virtual world igp.

Jetfire, on 05 January 2013 - 10:02 AM, said:

The straight up fact is this, the present monetization scheme for Camo will convert people with massive amounts of funds or very small amounts of Mechs. People who have many mechs or like to change their camo up often or have even moderate investments in MC will not convert very much.

The solution is the make the Paint Cans, Patterns and Decals bind to account unlocks. Think of it like buying a large supply of paint, a stencil and pattern for your paint tech to work with. Nothing is gained from making the paint can limited so keep it infinite like the PC Gamer colors. Now you can continue to release Colors, Patterns and Decals on a continuous basis creating a sustained revenue stream. Yes, someday you may run out of colors that you wish to release, but then you have a large pallette that people will buy into over time and you still have limitless patterns and decals to design.

People with massive funds "Whales" will just unlock everything. Score 1 for PGI
People with a few Mechs will still unlock what they want to use. Score 2 for PGI - balance with where they are now
People with many Mechs will now feel that the money is a fair charge and buy in. Score 3 for PGI
People with moderate funds will see a better value and start to buy. Score 4 for PGI
People with collector mentalities will be enticed to spend and purchase more MC. Score 5 for PGI
People with low funds may occasionally convert due to the fact that they can slowly accumulate options. Score 6 for PGI

All in all there should be no way this change would do anything but attract more revenue. The initial Camo pass is mainly for the Whales and I am sure it has made them some money, but for both PGI and my sake, I hope they realize how much money they are leaving on the table.

i have to repost this one!! iv said it once but im glad someone is saying it for me again. op's business plan benefits ALL. patterns are infinite. mechs are also infinite, is it really a bad thing if igp get creative and add to the existing bt/tt world??
if your lazy lets just stick to colors for now and im sure there are enough colors in the rainbow to make you filthy rich.

Sir Wulfrick, on 05 January 2013 - 10:08 AM, said:

Given the proposal I would, as I suspect many others would, be very happy to purchase quite a variety of paint jobs.

I suspect that the 'sell cheaply to many' paradigm applies particularly well to paint jobs and other cosmetic items that one can buy in MWO. I have no problem with the cost of chassis or mech bay slots, but I do think that the price of MC and cosmetic items is significantly higher than optimal.

mc cosmetic pricing is insanely high for a f2p but thats another topic

HouseCat, on 05 January 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

Micro-transactions huh... never the easiest thing to balance. I've been wondering about paint actually. So you have to pay every time you make a change, including for patterns?

if you buy a new color (even with mc) for any of the three cammo mode, the existing paint will be deleted and you will have to pay money just to get it back even if you did pay for it originaly. i suck at explaining i hope you get it lol.

JohnnyC, on 05 January 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Well... here's the thing. If they offered a paint set of 5 colors that I could re-use for about $5, I would buy it. Right now they offer single paint colors for $1.40 per color (if you buy the 1250MC pack with US currency) that only apply to one slot on one mech. So to paint 3 colors on a color scheme it costs $4.20... even if you use the same color for all three slots. At those prices I will never buy a paint color. It doesn't matter what color they offer, I'm not buying it. That is revenue lost. It was a bad pricing scheme to begin with and it still is.

i think we are getting ahead of ourselves by trying to create a new system for igp. that being said i understand and kind of think its a good idea. my main problem with this is, it is not as flexible because i am forced to buy certain colors and what happens when they come out with more colors?

what might work is a combination of color packs and single color purchase (all being reusable of course for the specific mech) but this part is getting ahead of ourselves. they need to offer us the reuse part first.

Edited by King Arthur IV, 05 January 2013 - 11:31 AM.

[Loonix]

JohnnyC, on 05 January 2013 - 10:39 AM, said:

Hope that explains it.

It does, thanks!