74 replies to this topic

[SirLANsalot]

Game became fighting based, and not so much cap to win based. Basically you now get rewarded for fighting people and dealing lots of damage more so then capping them out or getting all the tickets. Conquest has made the game a lot better, because now it doesn't matter if you lose your "base" there are 4 others out there to get. The rewards for the resources need to go up....by a lot and so dose the damage one. Getting only 150k tops at best is almost depressing, ya there is no R&R anymore, but still, 150k tops and thats getting ALL 8 assists and 900+ damage. On average people will be getting 90-100k on a win or a loss as long as they did over 500 damage in a game.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:21 PM, said:

It's not easy mode. It has essentially just removed you from having to press the repair and rearm button while allow more builds of mechs to be used regularly.

Or worry about taking damage... just trundle right in an see if you can blow someone up before they get you.

[Noth]

[REDACTED]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:32 PM, said:

Or worry about taking damage... just trundle right in an see if you can blow someone up before they get you.

Most builds that did that didn't have to worry about it anyways. Most people ran low cost builds so dieing didn't hurt very much. really nothing changed except you can do that with all mechs now and now if you do that you will get crap for money in return compared to before.

Edited by Viterbi, 19 December 2012 - 03:50 PM.
Removed reference to removed content

[Stickjock]

Indigo... nice to see positive threads when they crop up... always a good thing when players are enjoying themselves!!... I for one never really had too many problems with what we've had in the past, always enjoyed playing no matter what... and so far with the newest patch... still having fun...

As a total aside... a friendly reminder to a few to keep posting per the CoC...

[Kaijin]

Cryptogear, on 19 December 2012 - 01:06 PM, said:

This game needs to be hard. It is designed to punish the weak, not reward stupidity. Go play a real Battle Tech game where mechs dropping into a fight missing limbs is the norm. If you ever saw a fully 100% good to go Atlas you knew your life was about to get real bad.

A challenge is good, but a cash-shop PvP game needs to be rewarding for all players - not just the winners. You cut the player-base in half if you go too hardcore.

[Redmond Spiderhammer]

Anastasius, on 19 December 2012 - 01:30 PM, said:

Its the lack of risk vs reward that the old timers like me will not care for.

I understand why they are dumbing it down as they need appeal to a large group of people in order to turn a profit.

Hopefully if/when they get the campaign/persistant map the risk/reward comes back.

It is what makes playing games like Eve fun. You run a risk of losing your shlt if you play like an *****.

I also find those sorts of mechanics, possibly not 'fun', but engaging at least and feel they add to over-all game experience. For this game at this time, I dont know that they are the right way to go.
Going forward into community warfare I could see a lot of value in a two tier system.
'Easy Mode' that lacks R&R and focuses more on quick pick up play ( I dont want to say arcade style as I would hope the combat rule-set wouldn't be adjusted, but perhaps they could matchmake based on more options, equipment subsets and the like) The trade off for this would be that your wins and losses would mean precisely nothing. Your on to have some fun pew-pewing against other mechs and thats it.

Then you could have the community warfare that includes as much immersive metagame sort of stuff as you like. It would be a lot of fun and very engaging/rewarding but would require a more serious commitment to get the most out of it.

[Major Cockburn]

Kaijin, on 19 December 2012 - 01:40 PM, said:

A challenge is good, but a cash-shop PvP game needs to be rewarding for all players - not just the winners. You cut the player-base in half if you go too hardcore.

I'd rather a small player base than shitty easymode, carebears and ponies game.

Edited by Major Cockburn, 19 December 2012 - 01:42 PM.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:34 PM, said:

Most builds that did that didn't have to worry about it anyways. Most people ran low cost builds so dieing didn't hurt very much. really nothing changed except you can do that with all mechs now and now if you do that you will get crap for money in return compared to before.

It's a matter of Risk Vrs Reward. Now it is just Reward. People keep saying now it is a choice but that is less true than before. Before you could risk going in debt, run more expensive equipment for the slight bonus it gave you, and hopefully get greater rewards from that bonus. Now if you run the expensive or cheep crap you get the same payout so run the more expensive stuff for that slightly better damage and improve your payout. No reason to use anything cheaper.

[Noth]

Major Cockburn, on 19 December 2012 - 01:41 PM, said:

I'd rather a small player base than a ****** easymode, carebears and ponies game.

That is what you call a dead game for a f2p game.

[Major Cockburn]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:42 PM, said:

That is what you call a dead game for a f2p game.

I'd rather no game with some other company able to license the IP and try again than a fail kiddy game.

Edited by Major Cockburn, 19 December 2012 - 01:43 PM.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:41 PM, said:

It's a matter of Risk Vrs Reward. Now it is just Reward. People keep saying now it is a choice but that is less true than before. Before you could risk going in debt, run more expensive equipment for the slight bonus it gave you, and hopefully get greater rewards from that bonus. Now if you run the expensive or cheep crap you get the same payout so run the more expensive stuff for that slightly better damage and improve your payout. No reason to use anything cheaper.

No the risk is just moved to the actual gameplay rather than the outside of gameplay money system that didn't add anything to the gameplay and instead just punished people. Thanks to repair and rearm, you were punished for playing well and tanking damage by torso twisting in order to live longer. It was better to just take it all to the CT and die if you were going to die rather than staying alive and dealing a bit more damage.

[Zirand]

I think for me what is most important about this patch is it says that PGI is listening. There are still things to fix, but at the same time my confidence and moral that the game will go in the right direction is very high. Well done!

[Mercules]

Kaijin, on 19 December 2012 - 01:40 PM, said:

A challenge is good, but a cash-shop PvP game needs to be rewarding for all players - not just the winners. You cut the player-base in half if you go too hardcore.

I think you mean you encourage the worse half to spend some money or leave. If they weren't paying then they are a draw on resources with no benefit. If they were paying then they felt less of a crunch for money. Giving people no incentive to spend money means they won't spend money. Yes you can do that other ways, but saying, "Hey it is going to be a slow grind without premium." seems to be standard and that is what it was.

[Noth]

Major Cockburn, on 19 December 2012 - 01:43 PM, said:

I'd rather no game with some other company able to license the IP and try again than a fail kiddy game.

This may very well be the last chance for a mechwarrior video game seeing as the mechwarrior franchise has been dead for 10 years, and no one was willing to pick it up but a small publishing company and it needed changed to a f2p model. Hate to say it, but your mindset would kill franchises in the current gaming era.

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:45 PM, said:

I think you mean you encourage the worse half to spend some money or leave. If they weren't paying then they are a draw on resources with no benefit. If they were paying then they felt less of a crunch for money. Giving people no incentive to spend money means they won't spend money. Yes you can do that other ways, but saying, "Hey it is going to be a slow grind without premium." seems to be standard and that is what it was.

That's what it still is really.

Edited by Noth, 19 December 2012 - 01:47 PM.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

No the risk is just moved to the actual gameplay rather than the outside of gameplay money system that didn't add anything to the gameplay and instead just punished people. Thanks to repair and rearm, you were punished for playing well and tanking damage by torso twisting in order to live longer. It was better to just take it all to the CT and die if you were going to die rather than staying alive and dealing a bit more damage.

Wouldn't it have been better to not get shot in the first place? Ah, but I guess people keep forgetting that not everyone is supposed to be in an Atlas that has no choice but to stand there and take it.

[Major Cockburn]

I'm fine with that risk.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:47 PM, said:

Wouldn't it have been better to not get shot in the first place? Ah, but I guess people keep forgetting that not everyone is supposed to be in an Atlas that has no choice but to stand there and take it.

Not getting shot is not always an option. especially when you are up against a couple faster mechs. One of the biggest strength of the centurion was the fact that it could tank so much damage because of it's ability to zombie and also use it's arm as a shield. You were effectively punished for using those strengths.

[Lanessar]

Well said, OP.

With the additions that have occurred, and the way the game plays currently, I'm enjoying things much more than before the patch as a general sense. I want to play the game again, and that is a big step in the right direction.

I have literally purchased X-Mas lights for my mech, and a CTF-4X, since this game has gone to open beta. I played perhaps 10 hours over the period from Open Beta to yesterday.

Last night, I played for four hours straight. I also purchased the Flame Hero mech, a Stalker, and nearly all the new years items. I'm down to about 5K from my founder's left. I plan on purchasing another $50 of MC next week.

The rewards are sometimes better, sometimes less than they used to be. But at least I'm not being thrown cash for not participating in a match. I was getting heavily penalized when I win a match, run to the wire, pull off a victory for my team and my mech is smoking from laser fire, but still intact. This feels more "right" than the R&R system did, although I did enjoy the immersion. I look forward to seeing it again when it means something other than just the grind, when we get gear from matches.

I'm enjoying the fights again, as they aren't running from base to base, and even with the blasted ravens hiding behind their ECM and lagshields, I am still feeling more realistic about the game modes added and the dynamic that has changed in assault.

It's gone from "stand near an oil rig" to "no survivors", and it feels more in the spirit of mechwarrior. Yes, some details are missing. But it's the gameplay, not the metagame, that drew me back. Now, the metagame is focused on building new load outs, thinking of new strats, and focusing on beating my opponent, in a good, old-fashioned mech battle.

There are things I want to see in the game; mostly to do with CW, but many to do with little bits and pieces. Balancing the PPCs, fixing netcode, maaaaaybe adjusting the rewards so you get more for a win. A little more tweaking on heat. A bit more in the gear department, a few more maps (and hopefully, bigger maps). But these aren't things that upset me - just eagerness and looking forward to the next iteration. And I ahven't felt that way about this game since T2 tech went in at the end of Closed Beta.

In short, the patch has made it more about big, stompy robots battling to the death. And it is good.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:47 PM, said:

That's what it still is really.

I think it moved more towards "Run at enemy and shoot. Dead. New match. Run at enemy and shoot. Dead. New match. Gee... I'm making money gud naow." Before that behavior would net you a lot of high repair bills. Now it earns you 25k with "bonuses" for those you managed to shoot before you died.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

I think it moved more towards "Run at enemy and shoot. Dead. New match. Run at enemy and shoot. Dead. New match. Gee... I'm making money gud naow." Before that behavior would net you a lot of high repair bills. Now it earns you 25k with "bonuses" for those you managed to shoot before you died.

Actually there is far less suicide farming being reported. This has actually discouraged that because you make less now doing that than you did before.