478 replies to this topic

[SethAbercromby]

The Atlas really is one of the best 'Mechs to follow during engagements. I am piloting a Stalker 5S which is rather suited for the second line of fire. After the Atlas moves in, the Stalker will follow right behind it, soaking up additional damage and crushing the enemy's armor by raining down LRMs, harass with Large Lasers and brawl next to the atlas with Medium Lasers and SRMs. Insane overheating problems though. The 450 points of armor are pretty useful too. But even with an Atlas and a Stalker being a terrifying combination, they still need more agile 'Mechs to help them survive. Medium or Light 'Mechs can easily slip past those two 'Mechs and poke fire at their rear (having focused most of my armor to the front, that's a very bad thing to happen for my Stalker). That's why you should always follow the Assault. Keep their Backs clear, provide focus fire and help turning the enemy forces into a burning pile of scrap.

[Liquid Leopard]

Void Angel, on 21 December 2012 - 08:19 PM, said:

Also, I believe the proper spelling of "has" in Lolcat is "haz." =)

[Liquid Leopard]

I don't know if this has been covered, but among the signs that your Atlas driver is a doofus, or at least new to Atlases:

It's an Atlas D-DC with no ECM.

I followed him, and the rest of the team didn't, and I shared his noobtacular demise.
I'm not sure I should read anything into the fact that we died last.

[Void Angel]

I actually removed my ECM by accident last week - I had put a beagle into that torso as an experiment, and since people were waiting on me to swap my loadout, I was in a hurry... Didn't actually do so bad, but I did miss the ECM.

That being said, I have been tempted to forgo ECM myself - in order to preserve a build that was invalidated due to the ECM hardpoint nerf (and the general impotence of LRMs currently.) I found that it wasn't worth it, but it could be that someone else is testing a similar idea.

[NRP]

Very soon, it will be "Follow the frackin Boar's Head!"

[GMAK]

This is a good idea to follow the Atlas but I'm not willing to wait for them.

So I won't do that. I could use their support 10 minutes after my fight altough...

Edited by Mak54291, 26 September 2013 - 05:57 PM.

[Wove]

The triangle above an enemy mech's head becomes solid if the mech is being targeted by a team mate.

It's been a while since I've played, so correct me if I'm wrong.

[Void Angel]

Nope, you're correct. However, just because one guy is targeting something doesn't mean that a significant amount of fire is heading its way. Still, a good starting point for focus fire.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Void Angel, on 27 September 2013 - 01:47 AM, said:

Nope, you're correct. However, just because one guy is targeting something doesn't mean that a significant amount of fire is heading its way. Still, a good starting point for focus fire.

The old adage is "Shoot the biggest thing you can kill in one shot". So absent a better target, ie someone dangerous but almost dead, shoot someone who is being shot at.

On a related note, if anyone ever yells at you for killstealing, make a note of that person's name and never listen to anything else they say. This game isn't about K/D ratios, or any other personal score. So I avoid those people.

Now don't get me wrong. People are free to play as they wish, etc etc, but that doesn't mean I can't and won't put them on ignore lists so I can play my way

[Void Angel]

Although this is a bit off-topic, you generally want to select targets based on their proportion of weaponry to total tonnage -higher being better. This is because toughness scales linearly with tonnage, but engine weights scale increasingly with engine ratings. This means it takes a larger proportion of a 'mech's tonnage to install an engine large enough to give a viable speed. Thus, it is usually best to kill heavily-armed mediums, heavies, and then the lighter assault 'mechs - in that order. An Atlas is usually the last person you want to focus down - unless he's exposed by himself because his team wet themselves and ran for cover as soon as they saw an enemy Assault 'mech.

To demonstrate what I mean, consider an Edward Missilehands-type Orion build. Including the ammo, that thing has 35 tons devoted to killing people - my Atlas, by comparison, is using 40. This sounds comparable until you examine the percentages - the Atlas is using (obviously) 40% of its tonnage as armament, but the Orion is using ~47%. Combine that with the fact that the Orion is easier to kill, and it's better to kill the Orion, if the opportunities to do so are equal. And this isn't even an apples-to-apples comparison; a Sample Brawler of the same variant might be using as much as 52% of its tonnage. And we're not even looking at Cataphract XL brawlers yet. Granted there will be exceptions to this rule, but in general some mediums, most heavies, and most other assault chassis will be using a greater proportion of their total tonnage as weaponry, making them generally better targets than the Atlas.

Much like solid triangles and focus fire, this is only a starting point in target priority - as you play the game, certain builds will stand out as deserving of your special attention, and you'll also be able to evaluate how much tonnage is devoted to an enemy's weapons via target information. Still, the subject bears thought, even though it's far beyond the scope of this thread.

[Jay Z]

I play a variety of mechs, mostly Jenners and Stalkers. Following the Atlas or at least staying close is a great idea. Multiple Assault/heavy mechs staying together scale better than linearly in terms of combat effectiveness. As a Stalker, staying on the left or right flank of your Atlas buddy is best (not right behind if they suddenly have to reverse) and the effect of both of you turning a corner at once is devastating (not to mention most of the team will be close). As a Jenner, although I don't "follow the Atlas" I usually come back to the core fighting group after doing a recon run/base harass if I don't find another light of lone mech to kill. Basically, my job as a Jenner in the main pack is to pick the flies off of my friendly assaults backs so they can keep their big guns and heavy front armour pointed at the big bad dudes.

I bought the Atlas DDC very recently and have only played a few games in it. I have noticed that the team follows me more often than in my Stalkers or Highlanders. The Atlas really does have that intimidation factor and the staying power to be the core of the team (i.e. 100 ton metal meat shield). Although it takes me longer to get to the fight, by the time I catch up to my team which has stopped at a choke point, I just keep pushing and usually the PUGs follow to great effect. Teamchat is amazing and PUGs can be excellent, never underestimate them. Simply typing the intended direction "up the middle" and a well timed "push" is often enough to swing the match. 4 rear armour with the rest on the front helps too, just make sure you have a quicker friendly nearby to clean your backside.

I highly recommend playing multiple weight classes, as you can understand the roles, strengths and weaknesses of each and learn how to best support your various teammates' mechs. The Atlas is no exception. Thanks for the guide Void Angel and other contributors.

[NRP]

Ugh, I just had a game yesterday where I told my team I was gonna charge and asked them to follow. Get to the Stargate on Tourmaline, and sure enough, each team is lined up on either side taking pot shots/LRMing each other. I roll around their flank in my RS and announce over team chat "Let's push!" I stomp into a group of enemy Assaults and Heavies . . . all by myself. My team of yellow bellied cowards (including two D-DCs) wouldn't leave their little camping spot where they could (futilely) rain LRMs. At least I took two down before I got wrecked.

I though about this very thread as I was going down in flames. I've come to the conclusion that people are just scared. Scared of mixing it up. Scared of getting damaged. Scared of getting killed. Scared their K/D ratio will drop. Just scared. Makes me sick.

[Void Angel]

Aw, people think of me when they suffer!

However, you can't address a problem without understanding its sources. A lot of the timidity you see on the battlefield is new, and I can tell you exactly when it happened - 12 man groups. Remember, when 12-mans came in, we were seeing a round of nerfs to (ER)PPCs and alpha builds, which made the higher-dps, lower-alpha weapons more attractive. Combined with the larger team sizes, the first poor fool who poked his nose around the corner of an unscouted hill tended to get red armor for his trouble - if not a free ride in the cockpit of someone else's mech for the rest of the match. The brief over-buffing of the UAC/5 increased this trend, and kinda cemented it in a lot of player's minds. So it's not just a moral weakness, but an understandable reaction based on game feedback (e.g. dying.)

To rectify this, you have to demonstrate what good tactics and cooperation can do, which means watching your team and communicating with them. I've done the same thing you did; talked to the team, took it in the teeth for them, and ended up being abandoned to die - because I, too, forgot to check my minimap before I took the plunge. A lot of PuG morale is related to non-verbal communication; they'll show you they're not feeling the push long before they tell you (often never.) If they're all making a beeline for Regret Ridge, sometimes the best you can do is stay near them and under cover to counter the inevitable flanking maneuver. Just don't get discouraged, and try to keep showing them the right thing!

Edited by Void Angel, 30 September 2013 - 08:45 PM.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Void Angel, on 30 September 2013 - 08:44 PM, said:

If they're all making a beeline for Regret Ridge, sometimes the best you can do is stay near them and under cover to counter the inevitable flanking maneuver. Just don't get discouraged, and try to keep showing them the right thing!

Some of my best matches lately have come from being able to counter that inevitable flanking maneuver
To bad it has yet to happen when I am actually trying to play my oh-so-slow Atlas but that is life sometimes.

[Tool Of Society]

I'm a newbie driving a hunchback and I LOVE following an atlas or two into a fight. There's been so many times where people get atlas vision so bad I'm able to walk right up behind them without them noticing.

As mentioned earlier by others I can also stop or at least slow down any flanking attempts.

Edited by Tool Of Society, 06 October 2013 - 06:47 PM.

[Void Angel]

Haha! Atlas-vision. I like it.

[meteorol]

Well, even if this thread seems to be more about general rules teamplay i'll drop my 2 cents about following atlas pilots in particular.
As someone who pilots nothing but assault mechs since closed beta (Atlas until highlander got released, mix between highlander/atlas since then) i became very careful when it comes to following another atlas.

Back in the days, when trail mechs gave less money and there was no cadet bonus you could be sure someone who pilots an atlas did play quite a few matches before optaining it. Nowadays you see so many atlas pilots doing godawful stuff, that i check 3 times what the atlas guy is going to do before i follow him.

This is especially common if i play with two of my buddies who are rather new to the game. I think they are dragging me down into lower elo brackets, because whenever i play with them i see atlas pilots doing stuff so bad, it makes you want to shut down the game.

Piloting an atlas is all about knowing that decisions are irreversible. If you make a move, you have to dedicate yourself to it, because you are too slow to reverse it in most cases.

What is the enemy team doing? Where are most of their mechs? Will my team follow a charge? What weapons do they use? Can they even charge with their loadout? How many mechs will focus me if i lead the charge now? Will we catch them offguard or will we walk into a prepared fireline? Do i have enough friendly mechs around me to successfully charge? Does my seismic sensor tell me it is smart to push around that corner (well, obiously you need a seismic for that one)?

When playing with my buddies, i see so many atlas pilots not thinking ahead of their moves, walking into their certain death. I'd rather not follow them. Staying together to focus your fire is smart, wasting your mech is not.
I saw enough atlas pilots spearheading into 6 enemy mechs when it was so obvious that noone would follow them that i generally don't make my decisions based on what an atlas is doing.
If i believe he planned his move and we have a chance to pull it off, i will follow him. If i think he will be dead in 3 seconds, i won't burden my team with 2 dead assault mechs instead of 1.

[Steinar Bergstol]

As primarily a Stalker 3F pilot (at least until I gets my beautiful, beautiful Thunderbolt) I tend to subscribe to the "Follow the Atlas" maxim. For one thing it's just about the only thing slow enough for me to be able to keep up with. For another the Stalker's stock weaponloadout can assist the Atlas all through the approach and up into the brawling. Love having more guns than I can shake a particularly big stick at.

Besides, coming around a corner just after an Atlas is fun when the target suddenly realises he's taken an Atlas broadside, and now he's gonna get four medium lasers and 2 SRM6 flights (and maybe a couple of large laser blasts if I have no heat to speak of yet) added to his troubles.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Void Angel, on 29 September 2013 - 06:56 PM, said:

Although this is a bit off-topic, you generally want to select targets based on their proportion of weaponry to total tonnage -higher being better. <more words and such>

That was the long version of Shoot the biggest thing you can kill in one shot comment I made earlier. It really boils down to reducing their firepower and blowing an Orion's worth of armor off of an Atlas isn't as good as blowing up an Orion.

[Void Angel]

meteorol, on 07 October 2013 - 01:24 AM, said:

If i believe he planned his move and we have a chance to pull it off, i will follow him. If i think he will be dead in 3 seconds, i won't burden my team with 2 dead assault mechs instead of 1.

To a point, I quite agree - but if too many people do that, the playing field degenerates into sort of a MechWarior LARP of "Crouching Snipar, Hidden Capper." Certainly (as I pointed out earlier in the thread) you don't want to throw away good 'mechs after bad - and if it's obvious to you that the team is halfway across the map SniparWarrioring it up, don't go. But if the team as a whole follows the Atlas even when he IS being stupid, you can still get more benefit than if you just let him die. There are a number of reasons for this, including morale and fire superiority, but it really all boils down to whether or not the team will be in a position to get its own licks in while NewPilot the Barbarian charges (slowly, oh so slowly) toward his date with immolation and shame.

Edited by Void Angel, 07 October 2013 - 04:33 PM.