473 replies to this topic

[Wispsy]

I try to keep a maximum of 2 fire groups if I can. Seems pretty sensible, I have a £5 mouse/keyboard so no extra fancy buttons....also rarely is there a need, high alpha vs continuous dps and all that, I prefer to have fast moving mechs that I can fire freely and often, if my mechs are overweaponed so I am permanently not firing something because I am too hot well... Seems like a waste of tonnage to me.
Ironically my only build that requires more weapon groups is my lrm atlas, and that is the most faceroll of them all! Lol

[Agent of Change]

Wispsy, on 08 January 2013 - 05:43 AM, said:

I try to keep a maximum of 2 fire groups if I can. Seems pretty sensible, I have a £5 mouse/keyboard so no extra fancy buttons....also rarely is there a need, high alpha vs continuous dps and all that, I prefer to have fast moving mechs that I can fire freely and often, if my mechs are overweaponed so I am permanently not firing something because I am too hot well... Seems like a waste of tonnage to me.
Ironically my only build that requires more weapon groups is my lrm atlas, and that is the most faceroll of them all! Lol

Whelp that clinches it... using 2 or less fire groups is CLEARLY cheating and noobish and bad and you are goign to hell... or something.

I mean The man with the most votes for "best pilot I've seen" says he uses 2 weapon groups clearly that's the reason, couldn't possibly have anything at all to do with the fact that he make his jenner fly like a frikken dog fighter or is a ghost half the time without using ecm... It's definitely weapons groups.

Ok everyone remember if you want to be considered a "good" pilot you have to use at least, AT LEAST, 7 weapons groups.

[Rippthrough]

Steiner must enjoy getting facerolled whilst desperately searching for some more buttons to press in order to fire off weapons that work at random ranges.

Enjoy your wasted tonnage.

[Mr 144]

Rippthrough, on 08 January 2013 - 07:58 AM, said:

Steiner must enjoy getting facerolled whilst desperately searching for some more buttons to press in order to fire off weapons that work at random ranges.

Enjoy your wasted tonnage.

While he was very over-zealous in his criteria, thoughts like these is what really makes me laugh. Has no one ever played a true flight SIM ? Or at least a MMORPG as a spellcaster? They make (and sell) multi-button gaming mice for what reason? Oh noes! the complexity of more than 2 groups! Wow..claiming more than 2 buttons is too much for someone to handle, and insulting them for thinking otherwise? Funny stuff

Wasted Tonnage? So not firing those 2 MLs while using your 2 LLs at 500m is wrong? Not just too complicated mind you if they have anything other than energy weapons...but a waste of tonnage as well? Huh...who'd a thunk it

Funny stuff...

Mr 144

[Agent of Change]

Mr 144, on 08 January 2013 - 08:19 AM, said:

While he was very over-zealous in his criteria, thoughts like these is what really makes me laugh. Has no one ever played a true flight SIM ? Or at least a MMORPG as a spellcaster? They make (and sell) multi-button gaming mice for what reason? Oh noes! the complexity of more than 2 groups! Wow..claiming more than 2 buttons is too much for someone to handle, and insulting them for thinking otherwise? Funny stuff

Wasted Tonnage? So not firing those 2 MLs while using your 2 LLs at 500m is wrong? Not just too complicated mind you if they have anything other than energy weapons...but a waste of tonnage as well? Huh...who'd a thunk it

Funny stuff...

Mr 144

I'm inclined to agree with you, hell I have mechs with 5 weapon groups that only have 4 weapons because i have the buttons to use. But it's not required nor necessarily indicative of what a good player has to use. i mean my groupings are often more about convenience than anything else like two groups than then two identical groups only set to chain fire, and then an alpha strike group. I could do all of that with just two groups and the occasional whack of the backspace button.

The larger point here is I think that the steiner in question was objecting to optimized builds... which i mean go **** in the wind you'll get the same result.

It would be freaking awesome if stock build like mechs were viable (multiple ranges, truly mixed role), but the fact of the matter is specialized mechs are very effective, it turns the game a bit into a stupid paper/rock/scissors game but it is the meta game. until the 'mixed role mech' is viable because the 'optimized mech' is mechanically prevented 'optimized mechs' will rule the roost, and those mechs rarely need more than 2 actual weapon groupings.

[Rippthrough]

Mr 144, on 08 January 2013 - 08:19 AM, said:

Wow..claiming more than 2 buttons is too much for someone to handle, and insulting them for thinking otherwise? Funny stuff

Ah, as opposed to someone claiming anyone who only uses 2-3 weapon groups is unskilled you mean?

I'll keep to optimising my damage on a single spot thanks.

[Mr 144]

Just as an example...the 'optimized' HBK-4SP...Everyone should be able to agree that 4xML + 2xSRM6 is the way to go. Flavor is MPLs instead, addition of Artemis, and either TAG (for team play) or an additional head laser (too hot IMHO). The point remains, in this fully optimized build, there are 2xMLs in each arm, and 1xSRM6 in each torso.

Now, I've seen a lot of players use 2 groups on this build...one lasers (including head sometimes) and another for the pair of SRMs. I have an older(er) Dell Precsion Pro 7 button mouse...nothing fancy...about $10 on e-bay new. I use left-click = 2xML (left arm) and right click 2xML (right arm). I use one of my thumb buttons for the torso's 2xSRMs. I personally, run TAG in the head, but use my throttle's button to map that (an entirely different discussion, oh noes! more buttons). The point is, seperating the 4SP's MLs into seperate arm groups adds a lot of versatility without complexity or brain-pain. Hug terrain and not burn heat shooting at walls/rocks. Use that atlas buddy as close cover and shoot around him with the correct arm. Cycling 2 at a time (rather than 4x chained) is superior for light hunting...etc...etc..

By far, the simplest example...but coordinated folks (especially flight SIM vets) like every single piece of control at there finger tips at all times. I have plenty of builds that only require 2 weapon groups, but that is just the nature of the builds. Nothing whatsoever to due with complexity. Heck, aside from SIMs, I started CAD when autoCAD still ran best with a 16 button digitizer and tablet overlay...confusing button layouts do not exist for some people.

Rippthrough, on 08 January 2013 - 08:56 AM, said:

Ah, as opposed to someone claiming anyone who only uses 2-3 weapon groups is unskilled you mean?

I'll keep to optimising my damage on a single spot thanks.

Yes...precisely as ludicrous...I see you got my point Still sticking to that 'to hard for my brain' theory to click more than 2 buttons on a single point, huh?

Mr 144

Edited by Mr 144, 08 January 2013 - 09:06 AM.

[Glory in the Highest]

Am I the only person who alpha-strikes with laser mechs? O_o

[Rippthrough]

No, just that there's no point, if you're aiming all your weapons at a single point and hence trying to fire them at the same time, why use multiple buttons to do it? Nothing to do with brainpower, just common sense.
This is nothing to do with how good you are at using multiple buttons/controls, that's no issue for me at all, it's just strange to me that people would builds that require it.

The most I seperate weapons into are left arm/right arm to fire around buildings + TAG/torso on another group.

Edited by Rippthrough, 08 January 2013 - 09:13 AM.

[Mr 144]

Glory, on 08 January 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

Am I the only person who alpha-strikes with laser mechs? O_o

Nope...some people just do it by pressing more than a single button

Mr 144

[Mr 144]

Rippthrough, on 08 January 2013 - 09:11 AM, said:

No, just that there's no point, if you're aiming all your weapons at a single point and hence trying to fire them at the same time, why use multiple buttons to do it? Nothing to do with brainpower, just common sense.

The most I seperate weapons into are left arm/right arm to fire around buildings + TAG/torso on another group.

I gave examples...but this should clear it up some...

Fast City Brawling: shooting around corners chasing fast(er) mechs.

Cover fire: Using only exposed weapons

More than two types of weapons: Overlapping ranges (LL+ML+Missle/Ballistic is the perfect example)

Convergence: Arm Based vs Torso Based

Heck, there's some builds that I don't understand how you'd run without more than 2 groups without purposely neglecting the advantages. And unless you have zero torso weapons, your example lists 4 groups right there...huh.

Mr 144

Edited by Mr 144, 08 January 2013 - 09:18 AM.

[Mycrus]

i use all six weapon groups - i has elite?

/sarcasm...

Edited by Mycrus, 08 January 2013 - 09:19 AM.

[Rippthrough]

1. Can be done with 2 groups.
2. Can be done with 2 groups.
3. Can be done with 2 groups. Plus one of your weapons is no good at the range of the other two.
4. See 1,2 and 3.

[Glory in the Highest]

Mr 144, on 08 January 2013 - 09:11 AM, said:

Nope...some people just do it by pressing more than a single button

Mr 144

I guess I look at it from a perspective of saving myself milliseconds of time. The more groups I'm dealing with, the more I'm trying to remember which button goes to what thing, the slower my reactions will be - especially since I run different 'Mechs as needed by my team. I work my groups down to the tiniest detail for heat management but I always have an alpha group for my lasers. On laser-heavy 'Mechs I tend to have an alpha group, a heat management group if necessary (rarely used), and an 'other' group for missiles or gauss or what-have-you.

The most groups I have on any 'Mech currently is 4. The vast majority of them, I run 2.

Edited by Glory, 08 January 2013 - 09:29 AM.

[Tasorin]

MavRCK, on 07 January 2013 - 04:43 PM, said:

I'm unstoppable in my speedo:

2nd best post I have seen. No one beats "Reasons Why I Am Better Than You..."

Cartman would be proud of you if he could find a Com Star link that he wasn't blocked from using.

[fil5000]

Glory, on 08 January 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:

I guess I look at it from a perspective of saving myself milliseconds of time. The more groups I'm dealing with, the more I'm trying to remember which button goes to what thing, the slower my reactions will be - especially since I run different 'Mechs as needed by my team. I work my groups down to the tiniest detail for heat management but I always have an alpha group for my lasers. On laser-heavy 'Mechs I tend to have an alpha group, a heat management group if necessary (rarely used), and an 'other' group for missiles or gauss or what-have-you.

The most groups I have on any 'Mech currently is 4. The vast majority of them, I run 2.

Sorry Glory, all those kills you got were not due to skill, as it turns out. Please hand in your neurohelmet and startup passcode.

[DragonsFire]

fil5000, on 08 January 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

Sorry Glory, all those kills you got were not due to skill, as it turns out. Please hand in your neurohelmet and startup passcode.

So does having 2 groups set up, with a 3rd set as a chainfire only group, count as no skill since the chainfire group isn't often used, or great skill because a 3rd group is configured? I'm so confused. Perhaps Mr. Steiner can come back and enlighten us.

[Rippthrough]

1000 damage, 8 kills, 2 weapons groups = n00b.
89 damage, no kills, 6 weapons groups = elite.

Simple.

[fil5000]

DragonsFire, on 08 January 2013 - 10:45 AM, said:

So does having 2 groups set up, with a 3rd set as a chainfire only group, count as no skill since the chainfire group isn't often used, or great skill because a 3rd group is configured? I'm so confused. Perhaps Mr. Steiner can come back and enlighten us.

No, you noob, can't you read? He specifically said he was going to spurt his opinion into the void and then go away again because us plebs don't appreciate it.

I think it's pretty clear though, as long as you bind each weapon to its own group you're fine. If you have more than six weapons you're probably a noob. And none of the weapons can be SRMs. Although he makes no mention of streaks so streakapults are probably fine.

[Cartman726]

My name is Cartman, and I approve of this thread.