286 replies to this topic

[Lonestar1771]

warp103, on 02 January 2013 - 05:59 PM, said:

all should play but dev should listen to community not here own personal preferrance

Please form actual sentences or stop posting.

[warp103]

Lonestar1771, on 02 January 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

Please form actual sentences or stop posting.

hmm.Let me be sic. kiss my biracial butt-ox. Is that a actual sentence that you can understand.

Before you correct others check your own.

I only posted one sentence not sentences.

[Homeless Bill]

Lonestar1771, on 02 January 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

Please form actual sentences or stop posting.

The views and opinions expressed herein are those of warp103 (to the best of my translating ability) and do not necessarily reflect the views of Homeless Bill, LLC, its affiliates, or its employees.

warp103, on 02 January 2013 - 05:59 PM, said:

all should play but dev should listen to community not here own personal preferrance

Translation: Everyone including the developers should be playing the game in its current state - that's not the issue. The developers need to do a better job listening and responding to what the community wants, rather than discarding questions as a consequence of their own personal biases.

Edited by Homeless Bill, 02 January 2013 - 10:00 PM.

[Lonestar1771]

warp103, on 02 January 2013 - 06:46 PM, said:

hmm.Let me be sic. kiss my biracial butt-ox. Is that a actual sentence that you can understand.

Before you correct others check your own.

I only posted one sentence not sentences.

Your intelligence (or lack thereof) seeps through on your posts. I was referring to both the post I quoted and your previous one (the long one that had multiple sentences, if you want to call them that). Don't get ********* because you are either too lazy to type things out in proper English (because of course this IS an English forum) like a normal human being or just too stupid. Doesn't matter either way. If I have to get my super duper wonder decoder ring to decipher your da Vinci code-esque nonsense than you really have no business being on a forum of any kind.

[StalaggtIKE]

Centagon, on 02 January 2013 - 04:01 PM, said:

Easy. Like this.

Next question.

You just answered...

FAIL.

[Homeless Bill]

Thontor, on 02 January 2013 - 08:40 PM, said:

except the community doesn't even agree on what the community wants. No matter what PGI does, part of the community isn't going to be happy.

That was me trying to translate his words. I personally think they're doing a fine job considering how much **** they have to deal with already without having to **** around with updating us every two seconds.

That said, I also think ECM is a clearly important issue that needed to be addressed in some way, be it a single sentence or something more.

Edited by Homeless Bill, 02 January 2013 - 09:01 PM.

[DragonsFire]

Thontor, on 02 January 2013 - 08:40 PM, said:

except the community doesn't even agree on what the community wants. No matter what PGI does, part of the community isn't going to be happy.

Therein lies one of the main issues. One of the others is that I would wager a large number of players either don't visit the forums or are generally silent, leading us to a vocal minority/silent majority. The few times they do post or contribute, they are often shouted down or completely unheard due to said vocal minority.

[ICEFANG13]

I don't much care for picture answers, but this is how I felt this time.

[valkyrie]

arden, on 02 January 2013 - 05:09 PM, said:

I understand why the devs dance around the ECM and Lag issues, Just saw Garth in a ECM Cicada. If they fixed ECM he would only have a lag shield, and thats not OP enough on its own. When The DEVs play the meta game you know something is wrong.

The fact that the CataPault is still the most potent chassis in the game didn't tip you off?

[Vassago Rain]

I detect an immense concentration of ******** in this thread.

[Mordin Ashe]

Disappointing indeed. Most questions have basically the same answer, which isn't bad by itself, but since I expect the devs want to make money on the game they will polish it to max, thus in time include most of imaginable features. Not a bad thing to say, but bad if this is all we got in three weeks because one can easily figure that out on his own.
Also, the most liked question in QaA wasn't answered and no further info was released. That means that either devs themselves don't know yet or that they don't care - and again, I can figure that out on my own. That is not what QaA are for, they are for some information. So please, next time try to give us more relevant info or pick better questions.
+1 for the effort anyway and looking forward to next QaA.

Edited by Mordin Ashe, 03 January 2013 - 01:03 AM.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

StalaggtIKE, on 02 January 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

How was this question just ignored?

They ignore ECM balance related questions every week. They have since they released it. You surprised?

[Arcturious]

Regarding the ECM question, as has been stated already in this thread it was full of factual errors and just because people gave it a like does not mean it deserves to be answered. As has also been posted, the Devs have provided information on ECM repeatedly However as many of you don't like the answers you choose to ignore the data. Please admit to yourselves that the answer you are really looking for is "Remove ECM" and that nothing else will satisfy you. The fact that post received so many likes is actually kind of depressing, as it affirms the lack of understanding around the actual game mechanics that are already in effect.

The Devs are working on ECM. They have already buffed TAG range. In this very Q&A they admit that they are looking at making TAG have a toggle for always on.

Data mining has shown that there are modules in the works that will also effect ECM, probably under testing right now. It's unverified, but from the MWO Mechlab program it is indicated the following modules that may effect ECM:

Orbital Scan(?)
Seismic Sensor(?)
Magnetometer(?)
Advanced Seismic Sensor(?)

I imagine even more are planned and on the way. Also, to the man who raised his son as an example. I apologise, but you have picked one of the only mechs in the game to which ECM has absolutely ZERO effect. The Ilya does not even have a missile hardpoint. ECM does not stop any of the Ballistic or Energy weapons it can mount. It is in fact one of the mechs that is capable of countering ECM by itself by mounting TAG to spot which is the ECM mech in a crowd, then take it out with targeted Ballistic support fire. What is worse though is that you have had people commiserating without obviously even checking their facts. Thus proving the point that the ECM arguments are driven by emotion rather than reason.

If your son is having problems with the Ilya, I suggest actually trying to teach him ways of better using its capabilities and explaining how heat vision works. Train him to be an anti ECM nightmare and watch as he gets congratulated by his team mates. Both his and your enjoyment of the game will likely increase as a result. Taking the negative approach is easy but if you truly want a return on your investment you need to look for the real reason behind the poor performance in this specific chassis and adjust. Perhaps in the D-DC he uses SRM more, which means he might benefit from mounting LB10X as his AC weapons. There are many possible solutions, however ECM is not and can not be the problem.

Finally to the people unhappy with the answers provided. I think this is a great Q&A process and I'm more than happy the devs take the time to respond. In this one Q&A alone we have confirmed (and I'm talking hard facts here not the conjecture answers like an online mech lab):

1) In game voice chat is being worked on. Before this, for all we knew it had been abandoned.
2) TAG is being tested for a toggled option.
3) Light mechs take the same damage as all others. (This was a no brainer but hey the question was asked)
4) More game modes are on the way that include objectives.
5) Quick communication is being looked at, not just in game voice chat.
6) Mechs are being upgraded over time to have their visuals accurately reflect their weapon loadouts.
7) 12v12 games are in internal testing and waiting only on client stability to be implemented.
8) Engine size only effects Torso twist, run speed and heat sinks.
9) UI 2.0 is coming, which will allow us to reorganise our mech labs and give full screen to the starting window.
10) Reconnect options are being worked on. (Seriously, this would be awesome if they can pull it off without douche's exploiting it)
11) Conquest mode will receive tweaks to capture rate and rewards to bring it more in line with assault.

Given all that, I find it insulting for people to blindly come in here and comment that the Devs never provide hard answers, ignore the community and are generally "Bad persons ™". Now like any human beings mistakes can be made or the answers to these questions may simply change over time. However you must surely realise that if they provided dates by which these will be implemented, they would receive for more flak for missing the dates than by simply confirming the existence of the features. You can't expect them to commit to deadlines based on one line, out of context answers provided as community service and not board meeting presentations.

Now I know this wall of text is going to be ignored by the vast majority (evident by the fact that for any dedicated player most of these questions were already known to be answered throughout other threads on these forums - very little is new news to me but I appreciate the effort involved), however I thought I'd try.

Edited by Arcturious, 03 January 2013 - 02:42 AM.

[Rumrunner2]

Disappointing.

A lot "bla-bla", not much concret things. ECM theme complete spared out, im sorry about he wasted time for reading this.

[phanteh]

Good post, Arcturious.

As a long time World of Tanks player, I very much appreciate the fact that the Developers take time to answer questions from the community. It's just a shame that the most vocal members also appear to be the most obnoxious.


I'm not much of an LRM / SSRM man, but the mini-map disruption and the like can be countered by smart play and some team work. I would much rather they added some additional equipment that can counter ECM than remove it from the game, which is what most people seem to be clamouring for. Having played a bit in an ECM equipped Raven, I can tell you that it's not a 'win button'.

Also, maybe they didn't answer the ECM question(s) because they're sick-to-death of people whinging about it like it's the end of the world.

Go play something else if it's that intolerable!

[LionZoo]

Just to huge amount of responses about ECM seems to suggest that a lot, maybe the majority, read the answers to try to get a response about ECM...

I have to say the lack of any answers to ECM questions disappointed me as well. We didn't even get a "I can't talk about ECM" answer that would at least acknowledge that there is concern among the community about ECM. Right now, I know they're working on all the other big issues with the game (netcode, weapon balance, game mode balance, maps, Mechs, community warfare, etc.) so the complete lack of response about ECM is disconcerting. Sadly I'm actually waiting to see where they take ECM before I make my decision whether to put some money into the game.

(At the current moment, it really feels like ECM is some devs' pet idea. The lack of communication from PGI about a HUGE concern in the community seems to suggest that they know it's an issue, but someone with pull really thinks his ECM idea is the greatest thing ever and not allowing any tweaks to be done to it. This is blatant speculation, but complete and utter silence leads to blatant speculation. Just look at the rumor mill that springs up around China's government: no information and suddenly everyone is speculating.)

Edited by LionZoo, 03 January 2013 - 04:07 AM.

[Hoshi Toranaga]

Garth like ECM as he drives laser boats only this makes sense, so we all have to suffer FPS and could play Hawken instead as it is the better FPS game, now actually with more tactics than MWO since ECM removed tactics.
TAG as a counter is a joke, I can dance with my ECM raven around any TAG party and take you apart. I am sure the devs can look at my game statistics in the raven and then might go cry.... this is how easy mode ECM is.

[Marcus Tanner]

Arcturious, on 03 January 2013 - 02:32 AM, said:

Please admit to yourselves that the answer you are really looking for is "Remove ECM" and that nothing else will satisfy you.

A lot of people would rather it just counter Beagle, Artemis, Narc and C3 the way it does in the minis game, with the understanding that countering Narc should be worth something.

Others think that the sensor range reduction should be more like 1/2 than 1/4.

I tend to think that ECM should make it more difficult (not impossible) to spot enemies non-visually if the attacker is within 180m, like it does in tabletop double-blind rules.

Arcturious, on 03 January 2013 - 02:32 AM, said:

I apologise, but you have picked one of the only mechs in the game to which ECM has absolutely ZERO effect. The Ilya does not even have a missile hardpoint. ECM does not stop any of the Ballistic or Energy weapons it can mount.

Saying that ballistic/energy mechs are unaffected is nonsense. You know as well as everyone else that being able to communicate where the enemy is and what you're shooting at is *critical* in this game, and PUGs can only do that in a firefight by electronically targeting things. This is in addition to the benefits while sneaking.

Even if there were no LRMs or streaks in this game, I would mount ECM every time. The targeting disruption is far better than what Beagle does, and I ran Beagle in some of my mechs before.

phanteh, on 03 January 2013 - 03:23 AM, said:

Go play something else if it's that intolerable!

Good idea. I haven't played in about two weeks now. I've been playing other stuff while waiting for PGI to come to their senses.

I have no doubt that they will eventually, because any fool can see that the ECM-flooding in 8v8 demonstrates the problem.

Edited by Marcus Tanner, 03 January 2013 - 05:33 AM.

[Jakob Knight]

I think the reason the questions on ECM remain unanswered are quite simple. The Devs don't want to talk about it, and prefer it to remain a lock-out against LRM usage.

The continued emphasis on TAG as a 'counter' is rather proof of this, as it is clear that TAG is not a counter to ECM. If you had a firefighting agent that would only work as long as it didn't come into contact with fire, would you call it a counter? That TAG is nullified by the very thing it is claimed -it- counters is the best proof that any changes that leave this fact intact are not going to allow TAG to be the counter the Devs claim.

The Devs knew what they were putting in the game (it is inconceivable that anyone with a shred of common sense could not know what a lock-on prohibition outside of 200m and inside of 180m would mean), so we can deduce that this was the intent of the Dev team, and that they have interest in only cosmetic changes to make it appear they are 'concerned'.

Their silence on the issue was probably the last proof we needed on just how 'serious' they are about the issue. In truth, they are very likely taking the 'if we wait, they'll go away' attitude, knowing players like myself are fed up trying to get an answer out of them, and beyond fustrated when our reasoned proposals, questions, and conclusions are either ignored or shot down with 'learn to play' idiotic tripe.

That they won't even answer what their concept of what ECM is supposed to be in their game is is also telling.

Edited by Jakob Knight, 03 January 2013 - 05:54 AM.

[Morang]

I just don't pay and take it easy. I haven't paid a cent yet since I refunded my Founders in september. They can do whatever mad and stupid things they want and avoid questions on it. If the game will survive and become mature, I will be glad and will start buying things. If not - I'll at least save my money. I still play though, played from time to time till the end of december, now switched to WoT because of great New Year bonus program there (and I spent some money on new prem tank and a week of prem time). I'll be back to MWO at January 15 to meet Spider, but I'll keep my vallet shut for PGI until balance will settle down, new features will be introduced and I will get some answers to be able to consider the strategy of my account development.