183 replies to this topic

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Butane9000, on 13 January 2013 - 10:11 PM, said:

I don't believe the Spider is dead on arrival. We still see Commandos and Jenners even though the 3L is so FOTM at the moment. I know someone will find an excellent use for this mech and we will all rage considerably at it. I mean think about it. Can you imagine trying to fight this thing in River City with it constantly jumping over buildings and using the high ground against you?

the difference being that the commando and jenners dont have three other mechs that (all three) outclass it entirely in pretty much every way

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

TopDawg, on 13 January 2013 - 10:41 PM, said:

The three variants are listed here; the 5D, 5K, and 5V.

Id say yes

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 January 2013 - 10:52 PM, said:

SDR-5D - The -5D Spider is also geared towards anti-infantry work. This is done by removing one of the Medium Lasers and replacing it with a single arm-mounted Flamer. BV (1.0) = 412, BV (2.0) = 524
Wow, THERES a hugely useful build for this non infantry supported game
SDR-5K - The -5K Spider removes one of the Medium Lasers and replaces it with two arm mounted Machine Guns for anti-infantry use. To make room for its Machine Gun ammunition the 'Mech sacrifices 60 meters of its jump capability. ^[5] BV (1.0) = 433, BV (2.0) = 503

what the hell are they expecting infantry in the game then?

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Spider

duh im dumb on the 5v part lol

[Adrienne Vorton]

Spheroid, on 11 January 2013 - 09:57 PM, said:

People do select mechs for reasons other than just pure effectiveness.

and that´s the nice thing about BT/MW... with (hopefully) more and more mechs for each weightclass this will become more clear i guess...

[MustrumRidcully]

It sure looks like that to me.

[King Arthur IV]

WD, DOA yeh pretty much. but im still getting one.

[Culler]

Unless they make an ECM version, it's pretty much outclassed by existing lights in every way. Sure, you can mount ballistics on some variants, but lights don't have enough tonnage to run ballistics (besides machine guns, which are wasted tonnage.) It'd be just like running a Raven 4X with a ballistic weapon, and we all know how well that works out. If you want to make ballistics go fast, try a Cicada. It doesn't work for them either.

Edited by Culler, 14 January 2013 - 03:46 AM.

[M4rtyr]

Funny how many people fail to see the advantages of a Spider. Granted alot of it comes in JJ's and there are sorta quiestionable, from what I hear (not tried them myself).

[Der BruzZzler von Wiesndoof]

"Is the Spider DOA?"

I don't know what "DOA" means, but...

IMO, the Spider isn't bad. A stock SDR-5V with Speedtweak is able to run more than 140 kp/h without using an fragile XL engine. If both energy HP's are in the CT, you can destroy its arms and side torsos and the Spider is still full armed. The standard heat efficiency is 1,36. There are no heat problems and you don't need DH's. Just change the structure and give it more armor. Give it a TAG and support your LRM Boat from unreachable places (Jump Jets) or something.

Jump Jets, Flamer and MG's will be buffed and Streak SRM's will be nerfed. The Spider profits on this. It isn't a wonderweapon, but i'm sure the Spider will find its place. For me personally it will be a challenge to play with it.

[Vassago Rain]

M4rtyr, on 14 January 2013 - 03:53 AM, said:

Funny how many people fail to see the advantages of a Spider. Granted alot of it comes in JJ's and there are sorta quiestionable, from what I hear (not tried them myself).

That's why there are no advantages to the spider. The thing it specializes in isn't that good to begin with, and the mech itself isn't comparable to the striker lights we already have.

So why take it? If jets were so good, lots more people would be in ravens or jenners with them. Those have more firepower, more tonnage, and better everything.

[Biruke]

Sure, the SDR will be next to useless on open terrain maps, but still it will be a lot of fun to play spiderman on the city maps. Of course, if one of the variants has ECM mounting capability.

[Taizan]

For every player that plays a Spider (and ofc Jenner), there is one less 3ML / 2D. The more variety in lights, the better.

[Vassago Rain]

Taizan, on 14 January 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

For every player that plays a Spider (and ofc Jenner), there is one less 3ML / 2D. The more variety in lights, the better.

For every player that plays a spider, my spiderfest 2013 raven will earn a kill.

[M4rtyr]

Vassago Rain, on 14 January 2013 - 04:03 AM, said:

That's why there are no advantages to the spider. The thing it specializes in isn't that good to begin with, and the mech itself isn't comparable to the striker lights we already have.

So why take it? If jets were so good, lots more people would be in ravens or jenners with them. Those have more firepower, more tonnage, and better everything.

The Spiders biggest advantage in a combat role, one it dominates the others in is that it soaks damage while still being 100% capable far better then any other light mech chasis. Well assuming the standard ML CT variant. Yeah its light on the fire pwoer, I admit that, but it will keep all that fire power until its dieing moments. Ravens, Jenners, Commandos, all have arm weapons, ammo, and such. The Spiders arms and side torsos are just pure armor, so in the hands of a skilled pilot they kill you with paper cuts over time because they are so hard to bring down.

Now add those natural abilities to lagshield, and -if- they get an ECM, you'll never kill the thing. But Myself and a number of others like it and have used it very effectively in other BT games, don't see it being any different here.

[SixstringSamurai]

Orzorn, on 13 January 2013 - 10:41 AM, said:

The 5D could potentially mount two PPCs, of course you'd have to cut down on several things to be able to do so (which would pretty much defeat the purpose).

The 5D will pretty much be the most viable (as viable as a 3 hardpoint Spider can be, that is), because of its 3 energy hardpoints and the fact that 2 of those are on an arm, which lets you mount stuff larger than a medium laser.

The 5K will probably see a few gimmick builds with larger ACs, but not likely anything truly worthwhile.

I'm tracking the 5D only has 2 energy hard points. One medium laser has been swapped for a flamer. The 5K is the only 3 hard point variant I know of with 2 Ballistic 1 Energy. However the weight of the spider being only 30 tons factors into what you can do with that. Its engine is a standard variant so you will get some play out running XL and weight saving upgrades. Now I'm not saying they might have changed the loud outs since its pretty dumb to have a 5D and a 5V since they are the same mech with 1 weapon difference and not play with it's hard point allotment.

Otherwise the only difference between a 5D and 5V is that one has 1 arm mounted weapon. The 5K achieves 3 hard points though by sacrificing the number of max jump jets.

Edited by SixStringSamurai, 14 January 2013 - 04:17 AM.

[Vassago Rain]

M4rtyr, on 14 January 2013 - 04:13 AM, said:

The Spiders biggest advantage in a combat role, one it dominates the others in is that it soaks damage while still being 100% capable far better then any other light mech chasis. Well assuming the standard ML CT variant. Yeah its light on the fire pwoer, I admit that, but it will keep all that fire power until its dieing moments. Ravens, Jenners, Commandos, all have arm weapons, ammo, and such. The Spiders arms and side torsos are just pure armor, so in the hands of a skilled pilot they kill you with paper cuts over time because they are so hard to bring down.

Now add those natural abilities to lagshield, and -if- they get an ECM, you'll never kill the thing. But Myself and a number of others like it and have used it very effectively in other BT games, don't see it being any different here.

Haha, okay.

It's not like I can aim for your puny center torso, or anything. Oh, wait - I can.

[Der BruzZzler von Wiesndoof]

Vassago Rain, on 14 January 2013 - 04:09 AM, said:

For every player that plays a spider, my spiderfest 2013 raven will earn a kill.

We will see... Pride comes before a fall! I'm proud of every killed 3L lamer!

[M4rtyr]

Vassago Rain, on 14 January 2013 - 04:15 AM, said:

Haha, okay.

It's not like I can aim for your puny center torso, or anything. Oh, wait - I can.

Heh and you're really going to hit the CT every single time when its moving 129 or more. actually if you were smart you'd try to leg it. But I've noticed maybe 5% of the playerbase ever actively target legs. But if it were that easy to core a light or even hit a light people woulcn't be complaining about Ravens, because Ravens are really not that good stock.

[King Arthur IV]

M4rtyr, on 14 January 2013 - 03:53 AM, said:

Funny how many people fail to see the advantages of a Spider. Granted alot of it comes in JJ's and there are sorta quiestionable, from what I hear (not tried them myself).

just for argument sake, go and pilot something that has speed of +130khm and only carry 10 damage maximum. this may give you a feel of what is to come.

[Vassago Rain]

M4rtyr, on 14 January 2013 - 04:19 AM, said:

Heh and you're really going to hit the CT every single time when its moving 129 or more. actually if you were smart you'd try to leg it. But I've noticed maybe 5% of the playerbase ever actively target legs. But if it were that easy to core a light or even hit a light people woulcn't be complaining about Ravens, because Ravens are really not that good stock.

I don't have a problem taking legs off ravens with my gauss rifle right now, so probably. It's been many thousands of matches to practice that lagshooting.

Except I'll be using homing missiles to farm out the spiders, so won't even need to aim. You enjoy your 10 damage mech.

[M4rtyr]

Vassago Rain, on 14 January 2013 - 04:23 AM, said:

I don't have a problem taking legs off ravens with my gauss rifle right now, so probably. It's been many thousands of matches to practice that lagshooting.

Except I'll be using homing missiles to farm out the spiders, so won't even need to aim. You enjoy your 10 damage mech.

Ahh yes, the "I can't aim so I'll use streaks" type eh. Hope they don't get ECM then. lol