49 replies to this topic

[sp4m]

My piloting skills may not be great, but I tried my hand at the "commander" role today, and I had more fun than I've ever had before.

We won 2/3 conquest matches, and with a land slide.

The tools I was given are simple... too simple to be great, but they were better than nothing.
the commands I was able to give were limited of course by the intel I have, both due to my position on the battle field and my soldiers. I LOVE that. Basically, I was able to direct individuals to capture unguarded CPs, call out to mechs that were wandering too far away from "the pack," and request flanking maneuvers into particular grids.

The tool I used most commonly was the chat window. In those cases, it is very nice to have "Commander" next to my name.

Putting marks on the battle grid is handy, but the diversity is low, and it is not intuitive.
I have no idea how to issue orders to individuals, or to make groups for example.

Some things I'd like to be able to do, is see a roster of names and mechs. I want to be able to filter my view by class, so I can know who out there is in a light, and who is in an assault before I ask for a flanking maneuver. -right now I need a note paper, and a few moments after the counter starts to physically look around and write down who is in what.

I'd like to be able to draw on the map, as an optional overlay that other players can turn off. It will be helpful to indicate a line of skirmish and areas that are hostile or safe.

It goes without saying, but I'd LOVE to be able to put HUD viewable way points on the battle field. a lot of players don't have time to go to the battlegrid during a skirmish.

I'd also like to get recognition for taking (and not abusing) a commander role. Maybe a credits bonus if and only if 50% of your team votes that you were a good commander.
... this is iffy, but what we DON'T want is greedy players taking the commander role just to get the creds bonus.

What are some other ideas that aspiring commanders want to see?

[Hunt ER]

The commander role has one problem - You cant force rest of team to obey your orders.

[Celestial]

Yeah its a wonderful concept but it isn't used much at all sadly. Glad you enjoyed using it though.

[Johnny Reb]

What the hell is a commander? I assume he means the Commando. Either way who cares.

[Denno]

Attempting to bring order to the chaos that is PUG is a worthy goal.

[Abulafia]

I've got to comment just because it's exciting to see a constructive post in the General Discussion forum.

I think those are all great ideas. Nobody has to follow the commander's orders, but I've noticed in PUGs that most players will go along with any plan that's offered to them, because it's almost always better than wandering off alone and dying. Individual goals and HUD-viewable objectives would make the commander role a lot more effective, although I think it might be tough to balance a more capable commander interface with the need to actually, you know, fight.

Also, even though I don't usually take command, I would love to be able to see a roster of names + mechs just to know what's on my team (and what's left on my team).

[Thomas Dziegielewski]

To put simply...

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for following orders

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for giving successful orders

Commanders will have more options to play with like
-Aristrike, Artillery, UAVs etc
-More Complex orders (Waypoints, formations, draw lines that show a front etc

Commanders will be given Commander points which will let them 'gain rank' and be able to take control of a team over someone with fewer Commander points

This will be a small incentive and I doubt that people will listen to what the commander says unless they know them. But maybe after a few hundred successful games people will recognize a commader that is doing a good job.

Design for this is not ready yet and there are more important things to do first sadly.
Design subject to change and I don't have a release date for it yet. My guess, by Summer.

[Starburster]

I can only speculate at the levels of QQ that some of these implementations will inspire...much of it needed for the long haul in a "tactics" based medium.

[Hawkwings]

Commanding, especially in pugs, will be massively helped if the tab-overlay of mechs showed you the type of mech that each of your teammates is piloting. As of right now you have to look around to figure that out, which is absurd. No lance commander would drop into battle not knowing what the rest of the mechs in his lance were.

And showing the enemy mechs on the end of battle screen would be helpful as well!

[RawheadRex]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 13 January 2013 - 08:52 AM, said:

To put simply...

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for following orders

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for giving successful orders

Commanders will have more options to play with like
-Aristrike, Artillery, UAVs etc
-More Complex orders (Waypoints, formations, draw lines that show a front etc

Commanders will be given Commander points which will let them 'gain rank' and be able to take control of a team over someone with fewer Commander points

This will be a small incentive and I doubt that people will listen to what the commander says unless they know them. But maybe after a few hundred successful games people will recognize a commader that is doing a good job.

Design for this is not ready yet and there are more important things to do first sadly.
Design subject to change and I don't have a release date for it yet. My guess, by Summer.

You would hope so

[Glo Worm]

Had this happen in a match today - a player was very effective calling for the first 1/3 of the match or so in conquest. My PUG team won 8:1.

Also, I don't know why more players don't take this role after they are dead. While you cannot access the command chair, it is very effective to call grid coordinates and mech types for teammates if you are the first one killed. Several PUG's will respond to grid coordinates and can swiftly overwhelm an unorganized PUG team on the other side.

[IIIuminaughty]

My Lasers usually take command when its all said and done

[Xigunder Blue]

Our unit (Legion of Phobos) uses Teamspeak. We have a few ranks for officers etc...but not particularly implemented by rank for field command. We are, of course, waiting for the full 8v8 and 12v12 combat but the 4 man teams are what we are using both for individual training with simple co-op actions with pugs and sometimes one of our better field commanders will use the chat to give suggestions to pug players on a team.

I have noticed that virtually every game with a solid field commander directing operations and tactics is a winner. Also a couple of our best field commanders have no rank at all in our unit right now but will absolutely be tagged as Commanders after we start acting as a full mech company. One of the best way a commander can learn is when we lose! We always discuss a loss (after we all make our excuses individually) and assess why we lost. The Commander module will boost this training and team performance very well I think.

Community Warfare will get here eventually. But patience is hard so now we just practice, get to know each other and play with our toys.

[sp4m]

I am happy to hear about planned expansion on the Commander role.

It's true that you cannot *make* anyone follow orders, but the PUG can be used like an anvil, and if you can get a few good men, they can be the hammer.

for the mean time, here are some ideas I have about how to use the current tool set.

a) make a paper list of mechs and pilots next to you. This must be done in the beginning of the match while pilots are all clustered together.

keep a screen cap of the battle grid up on your second screen (or paper map, prepared ahead of time)

c)Ask for volunteers to be part of "Bravo" this should be 2-3 mechs.

That's your pre-battle planning, which would be NICE to do in the first 10 seconds, but currently we're locked out of all intel and communications for.

After that, issue general orders, like first CP to take.

Standing Orders
Watch the motion of the PUG. You cannot control it, but you can use it.
Look for signs of where the enemy PUG is. You may not always want to engage it but you should know where it is.
Look for enemies that have left their lance. Kill them if possible.
Give general commands to the PUG, specific commands to Bravo.
Call Soldier names when time permits, to keep individuals from getting too close to the enemy PUG.

Stay out of the battle. The commander cannot command if he is worried about staying alive.
I like to move into high ground at the edge of the map, to get good visibility and expanded intel.
By mid-game, you should know where things are going. If things get tight in the end-game, jump in before you're on your own.
Do not die a coward's death.

[Eddrick]

Hunt ER, on 13 January 2013 - 01:17 AM, said:

The commander role has one problem - You cant force rest of team to obey your orders.

A good leader doesn't force people to do anything. They will fallow if the idea makes sence. Also, many people fallow by nature, and fallowing a leader is much safer then just doing your own thing.

[warner2]

Johnny Reb, on 13 January 2013 - 02:31 AM, said:

What the hell is a commander? I assume he means the Commando. Either way who cares.

Um.......

Hunt ER, on 13 January 2013 - 01:17 AM, said:

The commander role has one problem - You cant force rest of team to obey your orders.

Doesn't matter. My experience in the chaos of a pug match is that if someone sensible decides to issue a few command and try to get some cohesion going you'd be surprised how many people follow along. You can't give up creating a game that has tools to encourage cohesive play just because some players have blinders and don't read or listen.

[warner2]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 13 January 2013 - 08:52 AM, said:

To put simply...

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for following orders

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for giving successful orders

Commanders will have more options to play with like
-Aristrike, Artillery, UAVs etc
-More Complex orders (Waypoints, formations, draw lines that show a front etc

Commanders will be given Commander points which will let them 'gain rank' and be able to take control of a team over someone with fewer Commander points

This will be a small incentive and I doubt that people will listen to what the commander says unless they know them. But maybe after a few hundred successful games people will recognize a commader that is doing a good job.

Design for this is not ready yet and there are more important things to do first sadly.
Design subject to change and I don't have a release date for it yet. My guess, by Summer.

Could you prioritize simple stuff first. Like being able to ctrl-click an enemy mech as in WOT to indicate your intended target, and a hot-key to call out your current target. These small things go a long way to helping a pug focus fire. Extensions to the commander role sound cool enough but there are many simple things that can be done first. Better text chat is another example (why does it disappear so quick, and why isn't there an option to keep it open?). Why aren't the enemy mechs designated Alpha/Bravo/Charlie in pug games when they are, apparently, designated like that when you are in a group?

[FrostPaw]

Hunt ER, on 13 January 2013 - 01:17 AM, said:

The commander role has one problem - You cant force rest of team to obey your orders.

You could provide a random assigned reward to players who carry out orders.

"Go to F5!" First player arrives gets a reward
"Defend E7" First player to kill an enemy mech within 9 squares of E7 gets a reward

etc... you just have to manage it carefully, so players don't end up farming it with their friends. Perhaps intermittent or round robin, you only get it after minimum number of people follow the order.

What worries me more is that any random nub can take command, and that those orders I try and follow take me away from where I'm needed and screw me over.

[mekabuser]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 13 January 2013 - 08:52 AM, said:

To put simply...

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for following orders

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for giving successful orders

Commanders will have more options to play with like
-Aristrike, Artillery, UAVs etc
-More Complex orders (Waypoints, formations, draw lines that show a front etc

Commanders will be given Commander points which will let them 'gain rank' and be able to take control of a team over someone with fewer Commander points

This will be a small incentive and I doubt that people will listen to what the commander says unless they know them. But maybe after a few hundred successful games people will recognize a commader that is doing a good job.

Design for this is not ready yet and there are more important things to do first sadly.
Design subject to change and I don't have a release date for it yet. My guess, by Summer.

actually, you are mistaken about the importance of command interface.

Lack of viable command interface is one of the primary reasons for the pug/pre debacle.

If we had something resembeling a command interface that could convey a small percentage of the information those on comms can relay, pugs would have a better chance of defending themselves.
So, to say its relegated to the back burner means we will continue to have the pug/pre debacle.
We will see what phase three brings, but irregardless, those on comms have a huge advantage even against those with equal skill because those who are not dont have the infrastructure to communicate in game.

AT least have coms stay on screen.. THAT would help immensely.

[Vassago Rain]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 13 January 2013 - 08:52 AM, said:

To put simply...

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for following orders

We will be giving XP/CBILLS for giving successful orders

Commanders will have more options to play with like
-Aristrike, Artillery, UAVs etc
-More Complex orders (Waypoints, formations, draw lines that show a front etc

Commanders will be given Commander points which will let them 'gain rank' and be able to take control of a team over someone with fewer Commander points

This will be a small incentive and I doubt that people will listen to what the commander says unless they know them. But maybe after a few hundred successful games people will recognize a commader that is doing a good job.

Design for this is not ready yet and there are more important things to do first sadly.
Design subject to change and I don't have a release date for it yet. My guess, by Summer.

I like all this fun stuff you seem to be bringing to the fore.