208 replies to this topic

[grayson marik]

DV McKenna, on 15 January 2013 - 03:25 AM, said:

The DDC,3L thing really is in the minority, whenever we 8 man, you maybe see 1/2 of those teams, the rest are usually well mixed and the other night we even came across several teams LRM boating.
Other than that, i really don't understand the mental block teams have when coming up against ECM equipped mechs, as a team on a voice com server you should have no problem unless you yourself are trying to streak boat things.

If you can't beat Raven/DDC teams the fundamental issue is your team.

The mental block is that you cannot do clan trainings or organise your team drops in any way!

What is the point if I go with my team?

Is it just that i can drop with my team?

No it is not! It is the same every pug wants: challenging, fun matches with even chances!

But this is not an option right now, because you never know if you will face nice fair ppl over there or if it will be just an other "win by every glitch or exploit we can find" mob.

Also we simply cannot organize 4v4 or 6v6 drops because of the mandatory random MM forced on us as well as on the pugs.

And last but not least: There are teams we dont want to play for different reasons ranging from lousy pings to oh now, not them again!

What I complain about has nothing to do with lack of skills, We know how to counter massive ECM teams.

What Iam complaining is that pugs and premades throw dirt at each other up and down the forums for month's now, while the solution would be neither very hard to implement nor would it empty the gameservers!

If anything it would be a big step in favor of MWO and would also do a LOT for the social aspect of online gaming in a comunity.

Right now, all you meet in the matches are AI oponents: some better some worse, some unfair, some simply lame, some are bithing at you through chat... but in the end... all bots. There is no difference if i join a game vs waves of AI oponents in MW4 or if i join a match in MWO.

Without any social features like selectable group drops.... and so on... there is simply no difference if i fight a human opponent or a bot ^^

[Horned Bull]

Not every time when you get stopmed you get stomped by a premade - take a closer look to the points screen. If you see people who dealt under 100 points of damage and you weren't facing 3x missleboat +tag/narc scout then it isn't probably premade work. You just got teamed up with newbs/bads. In other words bad luck.

The premade problem DO exist but blaming a premade for all of your failures is pretty much this: http://en.wikipedia....tive_dissonance

Okay I think I will just edit my post for the people who don't want to read the wiki article:

1. you think you're a decent pilot
2. you have red k/d ratio and you lose more than you win
3. cognitive dissonance!
4. you need an explanation that will remove cognitive dissonance, therefore you are more likely to blame something else.
5. you decided blame a premade, mostly because you heard from others that the premades ruining their fun.
6. it can't be your fault, you're a good pilot after all, it's their fault....

Edited by Korm, 15 January 2013 - 03:55 AM.

[Taizan]

grayson marik, on 15 January 2013 - 03:37 AM, said:

Also we simply cannot organize 4v4 or 6v6 drops because of the mandatory random MM forced on us as well as on the pugs.

Which up till now still is in its second phase, possibly this will be amended with the final phase of MM in place. What I would wish for is:

Solo (random team) queue (4 vs 4) (Looking for group queue basically on current sized maps)
Lance sized queue (4+4 vs 4+4) (On current sized maps)
Current 8vs8 (on current & larger maps)
Company sized queue (only on larger maps)

[Grand Ayatollah Kerensky]

SlXSlXSlX, on 14 January 2013 - 11:37 PM, said:

Premade teams winning almost all their games, is griefing this community to death. I saw more repeat players tonight than I ever had to date, and I hope it was just bad luck.

PGI address this, patch away this (one organized group can comprise 50% of a public team) nonsense.

The pub farmers flame/ignore arguments/fail to address points/ and generally do or say whatever they can to keep the lie going. Farming premades, has become by and large a huge part of MWO and the mwo community.

There are alot of gamers out there, alot of bucks to be made. Some will be willing to integrate into the ts3 world, and like the game.... but a great many will not. Widen the net, catch more players. I dont want to "randomly" run into the same people frequently.

Pubs want a fair game.

.....

and don't even tell me to come on some random ts to meet a bunch of random pubs, to find ones i can stand, then teach them to play, then organize a time we can all be on... etc......... etc...... etc.

Aint nobody got time for that.

What's your win/loss ratio?

[Joseph Mallan]

SlXSlXSlX, on 14 January 2013 - 11:37 PM, said:

Premade teams winning almost all their games, is griefing this community to death. I saw more repeat players tonight than I ever had to date, and I hope it was just bad luck.

PGI address this, patch away this (one organized group can comprise 50% of a public team) nonsense.

The pub farmers flame/ignore arguments/fail to address points/ and generally do or say whatever they can to keep the lie going. Farming premades, has become by and large a huge part of MWO and the mwo community.

There are alot of gamers out there, alot of bucks to be made. Some will be willing to integrate into the ts3 world, and like the game.... but a great many will not. Widen the net, catch more players. I dont want to "randomly" run into the same people frequently.

Pubs want a fair game.

.....

and don't even tell me to come on some random ts to meet a bunch of random pubs, to find ones i can stand, then teach them to play, then organize a time we can all be on... etc......... etc...... etc.

Aint nobody got time for that.

Odd 6cubed. I played for five hours last night and didn't see you at all. We won maybe 70% of our matches.

[Moonsavage]

Korm, on 15 January 2013 - 03:43 AM, said:

2. you have red k/d ratio and you lose more than you win

Ah, you again, Korm.

Anyone who started this game when 8-man premades could drop against pug teams will probably still have a negative K/D ratio. I'll go as far as saying anyone who has got to elite on a light chassis will probably have a negative K/D ratio too.

When I am in a firefight, on the periphery and in an instant the enemy mechs all fire on me, coring me in a couple of seconds, that's a pretty sure indicator of teamwork. Unless I expose myself as a more juicy target than my teammates there is no way a pug team would fire coherently in that way... and it happens every third game or so.

All this game needs is a 4v4 map for premades to go play on, or an opt-out button for us "bad" players.

[Horned Bull]

Moonsavage, on 15 January 2013 - 04:27 AM, said:

Ah, you again, Korm.

Anyone who started this game when 8-man premades could drop against pug teams will probably still have a negative K/D ratio. I'll go as far as saying anyone who has got to elite on a light chassis will probably have a negative K/D ratio too.

When I am in a firefight, on the periphery and in an instant the enemy mechs all fire on me, coring me in a couple of seconds, that's a pretty sure indicator of teamwork. Unless I expose myself as a more juicy target than my teammates there is no way a pug team would fire coherently in that way... and it happens every third game or so.

All this game needs is a 4v4 map for premades to go play on, or an opt-out button for us "bad" players.

Sorry but I'm a pug player, I don't run premades at all. Also I started during the 8man stomps, and yes situation back then was much worse, yet my stats aren't horrible (on top of it my fav chassis is jenner). Maybe I'm just lucky then.

As I mentioned in previous threads I'm paranoid, so I screencap the points screen every time I get stomped just to check the people if I ever meet them again. Few times I was right about suspected premades, but I just can't blame a premade when like 4 people in my team do under 100 points of damage.

Also yes I agree there are some indicators that you might be facing a premade, like focused fire or high concentration of highly efficient builds on the opposite side. Yet I don't see them as often as you.

Moonsavage, on 15 January 2013 - 04:27 AM, said:

All this game needs is a 4v4 map for premades to go play on, or an opt-out button for us "bad" players.

This is actually pretty interesting idea and I fully support it.

Edited by Korm, 15 January 2013 - 04:37 AM.

[Asha Burnett]

Carmaga, on 15 January 2013 - 02:36 AM, said:

Solution would be implementing built in and easy to use voip to the game without resorting to 3rd party clients. Imagine that you could press "launch" and when you drop in with random people you could automatically communicate with your team.

In which language?

[korose]

Regarding 4 mans; the sensible thing would be for the game to attempt to match 4 man vs 4 man then build the rest of the team from PUGs (I just read through the Dev announcement regarding matchmaking phases and it was unclear as to if it does this or not), but if you are a solo player it still comes down to luck to determine if you are on a team with a very skilled 4 man, or 4 guys who met on the community TS and can't hit an AFK atlas.

With or without the inclusion of 4 mans in PUGs, every time you drop solo into a random game you roll the dice as to what team you will get. You may get put into a really good team that all know what they are doing, or you may get put with 7 people who totally suck and do under 50 damage each, in which case it doesn't matter how good you are, you are still screwed.

So long as you drop solo, the random skill level of your team vs the opposition is always an issue you will encounter. To take 4 mans out of the game would remove the ability for people to play with their friends outside of 8 mans, or by putting them into a separate bracket you would fracture the community, and I don't believe it would completely fix your problem.

Fact is that while people who drop solo can come on these forums and tell us that they are amazing players and the only time they ever lose is when there is a 4 man on the other team, the vast majority of really good players are in units and dropping with those 4 mans. This is because they realise that the only way to remove the random nature inherent in any PUG system is to group up with people you know and drop together, and the same has held true for every game with any elements of teamplay. MWO places particular emphasises the importance of teamplay and coordination over individual player skill, more so than any previous mechwarrior title, so the solution to your problem is a simple one: JOIN A TEAM.

Edited by korose, 15 January 2013 - 05:24 AM.

[Taizan]

Asha Burnett, on 15 January 2013 - 05:19 AM, said:

In which language?

The language you speak? Chances are high if you play during your local regions prime time, you will have people from similar reagions playing. So often I've seen German chatting in german going on when playing in the evening GMT + 1

[hammerreborn]

Sounds like OP needs some friends, and probably a hug or two.

God forbid people use teamwork in a team oriented game. OH THE HUGE MANATEE.

AND OH LOOK ITS THIS THREAD AGAIN!

Cause god forbid we wait a day to see if MM3 goes live today.

Edited by hammerreborn, 15 January 2013 - 05:28 AM.

[BerryChunks]

sometimes i yell HAHA YOU"RE GONNA DIE TO A PREMADE, to provide some psychological warfare and demoralize people before we start Mech Brawling Online. Sometimes after a landslide win I yell YOU JUST GOT PREMADE, since people seem to think it's premades, and NOT game balance, that is the problem in the game, so I know this makes people rage. I enjoy their rage.

[Shismar]

I don't see premades winning all the time. Neither when I pug, which I do most of the time or when I join a premade. Yes, premades improve the chance of winning. That is because they actually communicate.

Want to win more? Join one of the multiple TS servers and find group. Too much work? Stop crying please, it is your choice.

Nevertheless, I hope PGI implements ingame lobby and voice comms soon. I am certain it would enhance the game experience for many casual players.

[Congzilla]

I wish they would take it out for a week just to see what the whiners start blaming their problems on next. First 8 mans were OP now 4 mans are OP, next non stock mechs will be OP.

[Joseph Mallan]

Your Ping is OP!

[Armorpiercer M82]

giving premades vs pugs only as it is now, is a griefing/cheating mechnism, that PGI allowed. What a company !

[Ivanzypher]

I don't know if the game does this or not, but doesn't seem like it. Just implement the WoT system. If one team has a premade group, the other team has to aswell. Suddenly all the premade stomping issues are solved. Ofcourse you still might get a crap premade, but thats no different to getting crap teammates anyway.

Also, ingame Voip for pugs is vital.

[FrDrake]

Congzilla, on 15 January 2013 - 05:44 AM, said:

I wish they would take it out for a week just to see what the whiners start blaming their problems on next. First 8 mans were OP now 4 mans are OP, next non stock mechs will be OP.

When I duo partner with just about anyone my win rate gets so high compared to solo pug. My pug winrate is round 45% but my group winrate with even just grouping with 1 other person (out of my friends not just a random person) puts my winrate around 90%. Not sure how you're going to fix that unless you say we just can't play with friends at all.

[Nightfire]

SlXSlXSlX, on 14 January 2013 - 11:37 PM, said:

Premade teams winning almost all their games, is griefing this community to death. I saw more repeat players tonight than I ever had to date, and I hope it was just bad luck.

PGI address this, patch away this (one organized group can comprise 50% of a public team) nonsense.

Troll is troll is troll.
SIxsixsix, all I ever see from you on the forums is this. Over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over ...

[Joseph Mallan]

Armorpiercer M82, on 15 January 2013 - 05:49 AM, said:

giving premades vs pugs only as it is now, is a griefing/cheating mechnism, that PGI allowed. What a company !

Really! Talking with your team is Cheating? Seriously?