240 replies to this topic

[Gremlich Johns]

As a founder, I AM a stakeholder and AM entitled to provide some reasonable and rational input. Which I often have. It is Beta and this is where the problems are found and hopefully remedied as best they can.

[Savroix]

JSparrowist, on 15 January 2013 - 02:20 PM, said:

PGI is murdering this game, not the community. We appear toxic because we are constantly ignored by PGI and they mock us.

Netcode and lag shield along with ECM is an issue? Here, have another mech that suffers from all those problems!

What in the EFF PGI?

This.

[DaisuSaikoro Nagasawa]

UraniumOverdose, on 15 January 2013 - 03:48 PM, said:

4 of those issues are really minor compared to the netcode.

If the netcode is so bad, and it's ruining everyone's day... what keeps everyone out of light mechs?

What allows people to win even when facing a few low damage fast moving mechs?

It's a secret and probably does kill those who believe this game is ultimately an 8v8 matchup with nothing but 1v1s. *blink*

[Livewyr]

BerryChunks, on 15 January 2013 - 03:59 PM, said:

its no different than "the guilty cry 'foul' first".

I'm not the first one to call out the entitled miscreants, I won't be the last.

Let me explain to you what you and I are entitled to in MW:O world..

You and I are entitled to anything we've spent money on.
Any MC you've (voluntarily) spent is yours, and no less.
Any MC I've spent is mine, and no less. (I also get mechs and Prem for spending money on them.)

You're not entitled to anything else.. nobody is, but yet everyone seems to think that PGI is somehow slighting them for not doing things on their schedule..

[The Bad Charlie]

I agree with the OP fully. I wont say more because adding to the flame war is lame.

[Shumabot]

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 03:59 PM, said:

Some of you guys must be new to this whole, game community thing.

A community is here not to ******** the developers, but to act as stakeholders and the harshest critics of the product. If a community is not pointing out what is wrong after playing the game 'in the wild', it's not worth a dime beyond single shot console box sales to nameless COD kiddies.

The fact the community is consistently pointing out problems, providing corrections to what PGI has broke or glazed over this week is a good thing. It shows people are actually interested and are applying brain power to the game through true constructive feedback. No matter how harsh it is, this is a complement for PGI to work harder.
Its when the rabble stops posting smart, value add posts then the inevitable "pro" group and anchor demographic has given up on your game product. This usually ends with belly up, and forums reduced to syncophantic apologists / fanboy posts done to whitewash the games loss of appeal and marketing power.

In short: The more flames, the better. In the real world, we call that activism, and it means people are thinking. Enjoy it, and maybe learn something.

I think you need to cut brain power and constructive criticism from this post. I've seen woefully little of either. I've seen plenty of unintelligible whining though.

[BerryChunks]

I really DO question why they'd add another light, when they haven't solved the netcode first. I know they had a "plan" to add mechs in a rotation style of weight sizes, but sometimes you have to change your plan and vision when the method just isnt working.

[Exoth3rmic]

Well it goes without saying that if we were employed to give feed back on the game a vast majority would have been sacked for unprofessional behaviour and probably advised to seek help via anger management courses.

[Livewyr]

UraniumOverdose, on 15 January 2013 - 04:01 PM, said:

Bad publicity, drives some people away that would otherwise try the game. If they want to make good money, they need to take steps to avoid bad publicity. League of legends and tribes ascend both have their critics, but the average player during open beta would have told you "Yeah, go try it out and see what you think." The average player for MWO is going to say "I wouldn't bother right now, netcode is fubar and they have a lot of bugs and issues plaguing the game"

Tell me.. where does the bad publicity come from?

Seems like negative players-

"Try it out! Looks beautiful, gameplay is fun and it's different from any game out there right now! It's still being developed, so there are bugs and glitches being worked on, patience is suggested."

vs

"Dude, don't bother, Netcode is FUBAR."

Yeah.. where is the bad publicity coming from?

Edited by Livewyr, 15 January 2013 - 04:08 PM.

[Mxxpower]

GroovYChickeN, on 15 January 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

You do realize that they have only been producing code for what a year? If this is what they have done after only one year of work. DAMN FINE JOB PGI! I wish I could make my projects this nice in just a years time.

They programed the game in a year, then went into closed beta.

That's why people are pissed, their expectations are higher. The core of the game was essentially complete, and here we are 5 months into open beta, 7-8 months since closed beta, and not a whole lot in comparison has been accomplished.

Still 8v8 without a decent matchmaker
Still 4 maps
Still netlag
Still essentially only 1 game mode
Still DC's on screen load
Still 4fps, yellow screen
Still still still etc etc

Either it is not the same team, or there is not near the same amount of man hours going into the game from PGI.

[BerryChunks]

Livewyr, on 15 January 2013 - 04:03 PM, said:

I'm not the first one to call out the entitled miscreants, I won't be the last.

Let me explain to you what you and I are entitled to in MW:O world..

You and I are entitled to anything we've spent money on.
Any MC you've (voluntarily) spent is yours, and no less.
Any MC I've spent is mine, and no less. (I also get mechs and Prem for spending money on them.)

You're not entitled to anything else.. nobody is, but yet everyone seems to think that PGI is somehow slighting them for not doing things on their schedule..

Livewyr, on 15 January 2013 - 04:03 PM, said:

I'm not the first one to call out the entitled miscreants, I won't be the last.

Let me explain to you what you and I are entitled to in MW:O world..

You and I are entitled to anything we've spent money on.
Any MC you've (voluntarily) spent is yours, and no less.
Any MC I've spent is mine, and no less. (I also get mechs and Prem for spending money on them.)

You're not entitled to anything else.. nobody is, but yet everyone seems to think that PGI is somehow slighting them for not doing things on their schedule..

Let's assum

Livewyr, on 15 January 2013 - 04:03 PM, said:

I'm not the first one to call out the entitled miscreants, I won't be the last.

Let me explain to you what you and I are entitled to in MW:O world..

You and I are entitled to anything we've spent money on.
Any MC you've (voluntarily) spent is yours, and no less.
Any MC I've spent is mine, and no less. (I also get mechs and Prem for spending money on them.)

You're not entitled to anything else.. nobody is, but yet everyone seems to think that PGI is somehow slighting them for not doing things on their schedule..

Lets assume you bought something that turned out to be so bad it fell apart in your hands. You walk up to the sales clerk and say "this thing sucks". Another person in line says "you got what you paid for, stop being entitled".

That other person in line is you on these forums.

Edited by BerryChunks, 15 January 2013 - 04:07 PM.

[Mikhalio]

Shumabot, on 15 January 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

I think you need to cut brain power and constructive criticism from this post. I've seen woefully little of either. I've seen plenty of unintelligible whining though.

Oh look, an adhomin attack. I think that violates an EULA or something.

Again, Criticism is a form of activism and is strongly rewarded in all other parts of real life. The day when the criticism stops, then you have big problems, because people give no more ***** about whatever you do.

Players who can't cope or deal with other's insight, and strong value contribution have bigger problems in their own ego, than the freemium product they are trying to white knight.

[UraniumOverdose]

Livewyr, on 15 January 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Tell me.. where does the bad publicity come from?

Oh I see, this is where you blame the players?

[Mikhalio]

This game, by and large has problems.
Now what is better ? Ego fluffing the developers or pointing out what could be corrected and providing factual insight on how to fix it ?

What do you think you would appreciate if this was your company ?
If your not in that position, or can't view yourself in this position, this topic is pretty beyond discussion. OP and the white knights really have no concept on why there is such strong criticism about this cash grab *** IP-zombie.

[Livewyr]

BerryChunks, on 15 January 2013 - 04:06 PM, said:

Let's assum

Lets assume you bought something that turned out to be so bad it fell apart in your hands. You walk up to the sales clerk and say "this thing sucks". Another person in line says "you got what you paid for, stop being entitled".

That other person in line is you on these forums.

Big difference, you bought a product in development...

It has not been stated as final, it has been repeatedly stated as "subject to change"
Are you that asshat customer who can't read?

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 04:08 PM, said:

This game, by and large has problems.
Now what is better ? Ego fluffing the developers or pointing out what could be corrected and providing factual insight on how to fix it thrown in between conspiracy theories and developer insults or option C: Objectively Reporting glitches, suggestions, and asking questions?

What do you think you would appreciate if this was your company ?
If your not in that position, or can't view yourself in this position, this topic is pretty beyond discussion. OP and the white knights really have no concept on why there is such strong criticism about this cash grab *** IP-zombie.

Fixed that for you- re-read and pick one..

[Mahws]

I'm legitimately curious. Do people think that the developers are just sitting on a couch playing Call of Duty instead of working? Or is it that they know nothing about game development and think that putting a new mech in game or a decorative cockpit item somehow subtracts from time spent bug fixing? Is there some kind of narrative in people's heads that fixing net code issues (which are inherent in the new version of the cry engine) is super easy and a from the ground rebuild should only take a month?

How is constant circle-jerk complaining on the forums supposed to magically fix the net code?

By all means complain about game balance issues, ECM, PPC, etc, but this constant "PGI are ignoring us and not fixing the net code because they are TEH EVILS!!1!!" Is just making this place look like a tinfoil hat convention.

[Skyfaller]

Countach, on 15 January 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

It's real world logic for real world corporate situations. You think that by complaining more loudly it can increase someone's efficiency? You think work that takes 6 months can magically be done in 1 month through customer complaints?

Here's the thing: I can take the fact that they are 'working on it'.

Problem: They make the existing issue WORSE. Consistently.

Evidence:

Known issue-> 90kph+ mechs are not properly registering hits on their hitboxes due to a very bad glitch in cryengine.

What they have done:

1. Added ECM to 90kph+ mechs knowing full well the effect it would have.

How did they know full well? Because the moment they announced ECM the forums here went into an uproar about the OBVIOUS exploit it would bring. The Jenner's ECM was removed precisely because of such feedback. They applied a band-aid fix by removing the ecm jenner rather than addressing the actual problem: ecm running at 90kph+ speeds.

2. Despite nearly over a month of feedback about how ECM lights exploit and ruin the game they add the Spider with ECM. Another blitz speed mech which can now bunny hop like no other (vertical hit detection is 10 times worse with cryengine...so in essence they have not only added one more ground-level exploiting light ecm mech, they have also added a vertical netcode failure exploiting mech. You think the Streakpults were bad with their bunny hopping? You just wait!).

3. They have not taken any step to fix the very issues which make ECM exploitable by the netcode exploiting mechs: the no-lock bubble effect that removes the ONLY weapon that hits the netcode-exploting lights: SSRMs.

..because here's the funny thing: If the no-lock was removed the ECM lights would not be able to exploit the netcode and ecm... there is a reason why you dont see any other light mech in the game nowadays: they have no ecm and they die quickly to SSRM's.

Quote

Just because you want to rant and rage doesn't mean that you're right and your BS argument that by doing nothing but criticizing will get you progress is sorely misplaced.

After several months of waiting and seeing ZERO progress on the issue there is no need to to expect any. What is left is precisely what it is: criticism. I dont expect them to fix the netcode issue. In fact I seriously doubt they can. I criticize their incompetent decision making which is making the existing issue consistently worse and the fact that they do not take simple steps to ameliorate the cause the of the cryengine glitch: reduce the absolute top speed of mechs to sub-90kph. That alone fixes the entire netcode issue for the players while they figure out WTF is wrong with the cryengine.

...and personally I think it would make the game more enjoyable. The maps are too small to have such ridiculous speeds.

[Livewyr]

Mahws, on 15 January 2013 - 04:12 PM, said:

I'm legitimately curious. Do people think that the developers are just sitting on a couch playing Call of Duty instead of working? Or is it that they know nothing about game development and think that putting a new mech in game or a decorative cockpit item somehow subtracts from time spent bug fixing? Is there some kind of narrative in people's heads that fixing net code issues (which are inherent in the new version of the cry engine) is super easy and a from the ground rebuild should only take a month?

How is constant circle-jerk complaining on the forums supposed to magically fix the net code?

By all means complain about game balance issues, ECM, PPC, etc, but this constant "PGI are ignoring us and not fixing the net code because they are TEH EVILS!!1!!" Is just making this place look like a tinfoil hat convention.

[BerryChunks]

Livewyr, on 15 January 2013 - 04:09 PM, said:

Big difference, you bought a product in development...

It has not been stated as final, it has been repeatedly stated as "subject to change"
Are you that asshat customer who can't read?

Selling a product "in development" with so many core issues, and then ignoring those core issues, is a bad sales technique no matter how much you would like to bear their children.

ECM hasn't been fixed. They've tried to keep ECM as it is, and provide workaround modules and other garbage. They are trying to keep ECM as it is instead of reverting the change they made. Think about that for a moment.



it's like the person on the stock floor who doesn't sell a stock that's doing poorly to avoid a loss. It seems logical, but it's really the worst option you can do.

[Jason1138]

a man rapes your wife and burns your house down. you say "hey man, you ***** my wife and burned my house down!". OP says "come on guys, quit with all the negativity"

PGI refuses to communicate with the customers, refuses to prioritize anything over swag for real dollars, and presents the same broken game for your enjoyment week after week. if we just call it what it is, that doesn't mean we're being negative