53 replies to this topic

[Terran123rd]

WAITWAITWAITWAIT!!!!!!! At least read before pulling out the flamethrowers.

All good F2P games allow players to earn both their free and their paid currencies, if at such a slow rate that it would take forever for someone relying solely on their allowance to actually purchase something from the micro-store.

This idea was inspired, surprisingly enough, by a little game called Roblox. Roblox players can, at an exchange rate very heavily favoring the paid currency, exchange the free currency for the paid and back again.

MWO should do the same. The exchange rate should so heavily favor MC that it would still be more convenient to just purchase MC, but players should still be able to exchange, say, (and this number's been pulled right out of thin air as an example and it should probably be higher) 100,000 C-Bills to 1 MC.

Someone with enough time and patience can earn and exchange enough C-Bills to MC to buy anything from the micro-store, or they can just straight up buy MC if they prefer to spend their time otherwise.

[Rauchsauger]

Absolutely not!
Companies need money to keep going that is the bottom line.
This suggestion hurts the "game" (like all the other I want for free suggestions)
You get a game for free if you want comfort/vanity/boost you have to pay for it.

Edited by Rauchsauger, 16 February 2013 - 03:23 AM.

[Vizan Thalt]

Gonna have to go with Rauchsauger on this one. Let's say you have this system and you can buy the MC with Cbills...*cringe*
Next let's say you get enough to buy a mech, you don't care what mech it is cause you're gonna sell it and get the cbills for it and then convert those to MC and soon, after five or more exchanges like this, you are flipping the most expensive mechs for Cbills bought with MC converted from Cbills so you can... See where this is going?

This is a system and company cheat and is always exploited, until it is caught, then it changes until someone figures out how to do it again and again until you can't convert Cbills to MC.

[Terran123rd]

Under the, admittedly c-bill friendly, 100,000 to 1 exchange rate, where you can turn 100,000 thousand c-bills into one MC, you would need to raise 68 million to afford a COM-1B with MC earned purely from exchanging from c-bills. Assuming that someone is willing to go through such a monumental grind, that turns into a re-sell value of somewhere under 500,000 c-bills. That's less than 5 MC gained from the use of 680. Selling my cataphract, I could make 10 MC under this exchange rate.

Up the rate to 500,000 to 1, which I would consider to be the minimum viable rate where it's better to simply buy MC. A player now needs to raise 340 million (which at that rate is what's needed to exchange for 680 MC, the MC purchase cost of a COM-1B) to pay for a COM-1B to sell for a payout of 1 MC. Selling my cataphract, I could make 2 MC under this exchange rate.

Up the rate to 1 million to 1, which I consider to be close to an ideal exchange rate. A player now needs to raise 640 million to pay for a COM-1B, which sells for a payout of...nothing. Selling my cataphract, I could make 1 MC under this exchange rate.

Rauchsauger, on 16 February 2013 - 03:23 AM, said:

This suggestion hurts the "game" (like all the other I want for free suggestions)

Given that it's supposed to appear that that's what's happening, your confusion is understandable. The reality is that this is actually meant to encourage spending. I see your confusion, so let me explain:

This suggestion is based on 2 well documented pieces of F2P psychology:

1 - Players consider their time and convenience to be more important than a few dollars (in this case, seven)

2 - Players are more likely to spend if they feel that the decision to spend is theirs, and theirs alone.

The crew at Extra Credits have a video on this. I'll let them explain:
http://www.penny-arc...crotransactions

[Hotthedd]

The conversion rate would have to be excruciatingly low for it to not cost PGI money.

Something like 1,000,000 C-bills to 1 MC.

[Terran123rd]

I agree, 1 million to 1 is probably the sweet spot of being possible to get things for free (if you're willing to grind for forever) but also grindy enough that it's still better and more convenient to just hand over a few bucks.

[Regrets]

I don't like the idea of buying mc with cbills. There isn't currently anything but the hero mechs that one can't grind for in this game. It is a good thing, and this game is better on the paytowin than its competitors.

I do however support MC for Cbills. Currently it can already be done by buying a mech and selling it. Just cut out the buying the mech part, if someone wants to buy an XL engine for their Jenner with MC, I don't have a problem with that.

As long as it doesn't take forever to grind up the first mech and upgrades, I'm ok with PGI's current model, and I think it is something they should be commended on. Try playing Planetside 2 with its 100 grindgrindgrind or paytowin upgrades. World of Battles, World of Tanks, these games are all similar with ridiculous, strictly superior p2w upgrades. No thank you.

[Donas]

I can see both sides to this. One company that has done the grind for cash mechanism well is PWE. They have a number of F2P games that have an entire exchange system set up for earning the cash monetary amount for the game-available currency. Where the 'no lost funds' in their system comes from is that they have an 'Exchange'. Translating to MWO, an MC exchange would work as follows.

You grind up your Cbills, and purchase MC from other players, not from PGI. PWE has this system set up in such a way that players hoping to buy the cash money can post offers, (w2b 20MC, paying 100,000cb/MC) just as MC sellers can post offers to sell. ( XX MC available, accepting offers of 100,000CB) and these offers go into a que, and the transaction is automatic. The players themselves drive the exchange rate based on supply and demand, and the only MC changing hands is MC that has been paid for with Real Cash by the players selling it. PGI loses zero funds in such a system, since the folks that paid cash for it, are waiving their ability to use it. All of the MC has been paid for.

Edited by Donas, 16 February 2013 - 10:15 AM.

[Terran123rd]

Donas, on 16 February 2013 - 10:15 AM, said:

You grind up your Cbills, and purchase MC from other players, not from PGI. PWE has this system set up in such a way that players hoping to buy the cash money can post offers, (w2b 20MC, paying 100,000cb/MC) just as MC sellers can post offers to sell. ( XX MC available, accepting offers of 100,000CB) and these offers go into a que, and the transaction is automatic. The players themselves drive the exchange rate based on supply and demand, and the only MC changing hands is MC that has been paid for with Real Cash by the players selling it. PGI loses zero funds in such a system, since the folks that paid cash for it, are waiving their ability to use it. All of the MC has been paid for.

That's actually much better than a straight exchange like I proposed. +1 good sir.

[Rauchsauger]

Terran123rd, on 16 February 2013 - 06:21 AM, said:

Under the, admittedly c-bill friendly, 100,000 to 1 exchange rate, where you can turn 100,000 thousand c-bills into one MC, you would need to raise 68 million to afford a COM-1B with MC earned purely from exchanging from c-bills. Assuming that someone is willing to go through such a monumental grind, that turns into a re-sell value of somewhere under 500,000 c-bills. That's less than 5 MC gained from the use of 680. Selling my cataphract, I could make 10 MC under this exchange rate.

Up the rate to 500,000 to 1, which I would consider to be the minimum viable rate where it's better to simply buy MC. A player now needs to raise 340 million (which at that rate is what's needed to exchange for 680 MC, the MC purchase cost of a COM-1B) to pay for a COM-1B to sell for a payout of 1 MC. Selling my cataphract, I could make 2 MC under this exchange rate.

Up the rate to 1 million to 1, which I consider to be close to an ideal exchange rate. A player now needs to raise 640 million to pay for a COM-1B, which sells for a payout of...nothing. Selling my cataphract, I could make 1 MC under this exchange rate.



Given that it's supposed to appear that that's what's happening, your confusion is understandable. The reality is that this is actually meant to encourage spending. I see your confusion, so let me explain:

This suggestion is based on 2 well documented pieces of F2P psychology:

1 - Players consider their time and convenience to be more important than a few dollars (in this case, seven)

2 - Players are more likely to spend if they feel that the decision to spend is theirs, and theirs alone.

The crew at Extra Credits have a video on this. I'll let them explain:
http://www.penny-arc...crotransactions

First of all the decision is yours - you can play thsi game with getting MC.
You do not have to lecture me about gaming I'm an avid gamer since 25+ years.
Other F2P games cannot apply here since they had a game to speak of when they started.
MWO is such a long way from what PGI envisioned [so far that I doubt they'll make it anyways] that they really do need all the money they can get. That is why I am absolutely against any way to get MC other than money.
The "Chinafarmers" would get to it and sell the MC under the price PGI sells...

If the game comes together and has a stable and significant userbase this can be thought over again - right now I still strongly disagree.

Even in LoL certain items are only available through RP

[Hotthedd]

Rauchsauger, on 16 February 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

First of all the decision is yours - you can play thsi game with getting MC.
You do not have to lecture me about gaming I'm an avid gamer since 25+ years.
Other F2P games cannot apply here since they had a game to speak of when they started.
MWO is such a long way from what PGI envisioned [so far that I doubt they'll make it anyways] that they really do need all the money they can get. That is why I am absolutely against any way to get MC other than money.
The "Chinafarmers" would get to it and sell the MC under the price PGI sells...

If the game comes together and has a stable and significant userbase this can be thought over again - right now I still strongly disagree.

Even in LoL certain items are only available through RP

I re-read this thouroghly.

Since the conversion happens between the player and PGI, how, exactly would "chinafarmers" be able to sell MC or C-bills to other players?

[buttmonkey]

+1 to this idea. it will actually create more money for pgi and make the game a whole lot better for f2p players, i know this because it worked wonders on star trek online.
people with money and no time can buy mc and sell them to players for cbills, and people with tme and no money can grind cbills to buy mc from players that are selling them in an auction setting.
its win win for players and pgi, i really hope this gets implemented

[Rauchsauger]

Hotthedd, on 16 February 2013 - 12:10 PM, said:

I re-read this thouroghly.

Since the conversion happens between the player and PGI, how, exactly would "chinafarmers" be able to sell MC or C-bills to other players?

They sell a account set up with x Cbills and y MC

[Hotthedd]

Rauchsauger, on 17 February 2013 - 11:13 AM, said:

They sell a account set up with x Cbills and y MC

They can do that NOW.

[DeadlyNerd]

Understand this OP, by suggesting this you're encouraging botting. Now that's not a very pleasant thought for the devs and admins of this forum.

[Arcaist]

No way!

The very moment, at which you can earn MC by grinding (and being able to sell them), there will be farming bots, chinafarmers and so on...

[Rauchsauger]

Hotthedd, on 17 February 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

They can do that NOW.

Ya sure they can do that... they BUY MC and then SELL that account for less what they paid for MC... I do not think you understand what this is about.


As soon as they are able to convert Cbills to MC there will be bots / farmers

[Elder Thorn]

some people will be pissed off because they can't exchange enough to MC and will rabble about how this was pay 2 win like they did with RnR, so... no, wasted developing time to implement this.

[Lightfoot]

Nah, that's for subscription MMO's. In a completely free to play MMO you need to sell something to players because no game is free to make. Right now you can play MWO very competitively and never spend a dime so MC's become what you pay for.

[sC4r]

no

as it was said such thing results in loads of bots, farming and **** like that