419 replies to this topic

[Davers]

PoisonWolf, on 24 February 2013 - 08:54 PM, said:

seriously, dude

has anyone in this thread said they would promote hate speech? do you even know what hate speech is?

Lots of people seem to be defending it as Freedom of Speech and saying that everyone should just ignore it.

[xxREVxx]

Davers, on 24 February 2013 - 08:56 PM, said:

Lots of people seem to be defending it as Freedom of Speech and saying that everyone should just ignore it.

[Ialti]

PoisonWolf, on 24 February 2013 - 09:54 PM, said:
seriously, dude

has anyone in this thread said they would promote hate speech? do you even know what hate speech is?

Davers, on 24 February 2013 - 08:56 PM, said:

Lots of people seem to be defending it as Freedom of Speech and saying that everyone should just ignore it.

...in other words... no.

[Darknight99]

I wanna know why americans are all lumped into one sum. That seems abit closed minded do you think? We are all different nationalities with different back grounds. Just because you experienced one person doesn't mean everyone is the same. I Know and have delt with people that are far more offensive than most. And yes I am an american!

[Thirdstar]

M A L I C E, on 24 February 2013 - 09:00 PM, said:

I think what you're missing is that essentially none of what you'll ever hear in this game is actual, legally defined, "hatespeech," which is a real thing, unlike the bulls*** definition here of "something I don't like to hear."

Hate to agree with MALICE but he's spot on about this.

[Moromillas]

zverofaust, on 24 February 2013 - 08:22 PM, said:

This is stupid. It's not a weakness or a sickness. Everyone dies. You, me, everyone here. We're all going to die. I don't understand this infatuation with people pretending like death is the worst possible thing that could ever possibly happen. There's nothing wrong with it, it is natural, and there's nothing wrong with a person choosing to end their life of their own free will. My grandma is in the hospital right now, 92, she's been on kidney dialysis for years now and she's tired. She doesn't want to slowly waste away. She's ready to die, and has since stopped her treatments, effectively choosing to die now while she still has some pride and control. Should she be locked away in an asylum because you stupidly believe ending your own life is some sort of disease?

Go preach your bleeding-heart self-righteous liberal ******** elsewhere, like the mirror. You might actually find someone receptive to it there.

You are very effective at quote mining.

That or you are very confused. I don't know how you ended up at sending someone to an asylum for kidney failure.

Not talking about death, or euthanasia. Talking about depression, how it is a sickness, of the mind, and should be viewed just as any other sickness. Do you understand now? No, it's not something that just happens naturally.

[xxREVxx]

Thirdstar, on 24 February 2013 - 09:02 PM, said:

Hate to agree with MALICE but he's spot on about this.

Why?!! Cuz he's a Merc???!!! You rascist ****!!

[Bishop Steiner]

M A L I C E, on 24 February 2013 - 09:00 PM, said:

I think what you're missing is that essentially none of what you'll ever hear in this game is actual, legally defined, "hatespeech," which is a real thing, unlike the bulls*** definition here of "something I don't like to hear."

I would call it uncommon, but hardly non-existent MALICE. I have too many screen shots that say otherwise. Many people take the anonymity of the internet as an excuse to say all sorts of things they would never have the ******* to say to any one in person. But then most bigots ARE cowards, so that is little surprise.

I do agree that often, people are TOO thin skinned and take offense to everything, which is almost as ridiculous, in this overly PC society we live in. But I have seen too much verbage used to denigrate Blacks and Jewish people (mostly, I have seen some stuff that is offensive to other cultures, but those seem to get the majority of it) in match to act as though it is not a legit problem.

[shintakie]

Ialti, on 24 February 2013 - 08:52 PM, said:

Yes, because obviously all of us who believe that language is one of the true freedoms of human existence are by definition racist, venom-spewing pigs. Thanks. You know, for not cussing, you've said some really horrible things to quite a few people who don't deserve the labels you give them. Wow, isn't that ironic? You ARE what you HATE!

On a slightly more serious note: I do think we should report the use of hate-speech. I don't think we should set up a stringent speech monitor, because those things restrict free speech. The banhammer can and should be used on those who propagate hatred, but to go so far as to restrict our right to talk to each other without being 'offensive?'

And honestly I hope you're offended by this post, you might listen that way. I don't hate you, I don't seek in any way to demean you or your identity or those of people in minority racial or cultural groups; but kid you are DEAD WRONG.

As I've argued many a times on forums across the internets. Yes, it is perfectly within your right to say the most vile degrading garbage ever. The government can not and should not ever censor you. It'd be a violation of the first ammendment if they did so and I'd be the first to defend it. However it is perfectly within my right to find anyone who says that stuff to be lower than filth.

I was one of the few people who completely and honestly believed that the Westboro Baptist Church had a right to say the absolutely disgustin things they said and do the absolutely disgustin things they did, as long as they didn't cross the line to physical violence. It's their right and they exercised it and it isn't up to me or anyone else to say otherwise. Do you know why I defended them despite the vile garbage they spewed? Because they never target a specific person. They generalized and kept their sick rantin away from a specific individual.

That's the difference here. People who say this garbage in online games use it to attack a specific person. They call people these things in order to degrade that specific person. That's the line that shouldn't be crossed in the name of protectin speech and that's the line I stand at.

Related note. The argument that I'm intolerant because I don't tolerate intolerance is probably the most overused nondefense ever. Please think of a better one.

[Tabrias07]

Deal with it.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Lubalin, on 24 February 2013 - 04:24 PM, said:

I see players using racial slurs and slurs against sexual orientation regularly.

If you do use such words, you're on notice. I screenshot and report it every time.

However, I still see the same players in game later. I'm starting to notice a trend. The policy on this needs to be made more clear to players, and we need better reporting, chat filtering, and blocking tools in-game.

I've voiced concerns about imbalances, and that's one thing. But if the company that manages this game refuses to police this, I will quit. And I will send screenshots to every major gaming site I can find with hopes they'll pick up the story.

I'm not posting them here because I don't want to name and shame.

Something needs to be done about this. We as a community need to band together against this. It's disgusting.

It's good to report people to the Support Staff for Code of Conduct infractions, but Support does not instantly ban people upon receiving a report of illicit behavior. This is a disturbing statement:

Quote

But if the company that manages this game refuses to police this, I will quit. And I will send screenshots to every major gaming site I can find with hopes they'll pick up the story.

The Support Staff and the Developers are working to produce and release this game, but not everything is complete yet. They don't have an in-game reporting tool YET, and they haven't established in-game language filters YET. It's important to have patience and stout resolution instead of threatening the employees at Piranha Games and IGP.

I do appreciate the OP's proactive reporting, as everybody should do the same. I report *anyone* who uses racial/other slurs in-game in a derogatory or insulting context, but Support can't just ban paying players right away. Most often people are given warnings and time, instead of being automatically suspended.

If you have concerns regarding a particular individual, then please just continue reporting them to support@mwomercs.com whenever they commit an illicit act.

[Bishop Steiner]

for those "clamoring" about the 1st Amendment one might actually take the time to familiarize yourself with what the Supreme Court has actually defined it as protecting. While it does indeed allow a broad degree of tolerance, it is by no means construed as all protecting. 99% or more of what is said is probably protected, in and of itself, but any employer has the right to limit what is acceptable in a workplace, and online communities, likewise can have "Codes of Conduct" that indeed do preempt the first Amendment, for a number of reasons.

A very short summary can be found here,
http://www.au.af.mil.../crs/95-815.pdf
with deeper explanations (for those who enjoy reading legalise) following.

[Valore]

Umm... its an online game. How are people using racial slurs in the first place? Unless your username is something like 'iamablackman' or 'asianguyhere', how in the world would they be able to guess what to call you?

[Leimrey]

if you are upset because someone called you a f***** in game, then you have no place on the internet. I'm dead serious, it's not healthy for you.

[Thirdstar]

Valore, on 24 February 2013 - 09:34 PM, said:

Umm... its an online game. How are people using racial slurs in the first place? Unless your username is something like 'iamablackman' or 'asianguyhere', how in the world would they be able to guess what to call you?

What he said.

Also, I should really change my handle to Asianguyhere.

[xxREVxx]

Prosperity Park, on 24 February 2013 - 09:12 PM, said:

It's good to report people to the Support Staff for Code of Conduct infractions, but Support does not instantly ban people upon receiving a report of illicit behavior. This is a disturbing statement: The Support Staff and the Developers are working to produce and release this game, but not everything is complete yet. They don't have an in-game reporting tool YET, and they haven't established in-game language filters YET. It's important to have patience and stout resolution instead of threatening the employees at Piranha Games and IGP.

I do appreciate the OP's proactive reporting, as everybody should do the same. I report *anyone* who uses racial/other slurs in-game in a derogatory or insulting context, but Support can't just ban paying players right away. Most often people are given warnings and time, instead of being automatically suspended.

If you have concerns regarding a particular individual, then please just continue reporting them to support@mwomercs.com whenever they commit an illicit act.

Quote from LubeAllin; "
I've voiced concerns about imbalances, and that's one thing. But if the company that manages this game refuses to police this, I will quit. And I will send screenshots to every major gaming site I can find with hopes they'll pick up the story."


That statement right there is what set it off.
Banhammer is too good....delete this user.

Edited by PoisonWolf, 24 February 2013 - 09:39 PM.

[Zordicron]

shintakie, on 24 February 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

As I've argued many a times on forums across the internets. Yes, it is perfectly within your right to say the most vile degrading garbage ever. The government can not and should not ever censor you. It'd be a violation of the first ammendment if they did so and I'd be the first to defend it. However it is perfectly within my right to find anyone who says that stuff to be lower than filth.

I was one of the few people who completely and honestly believed that the Westboro Baptist Church had a right to say the absolutely disgustin things they said and do the absolutely disgustin things they did, as long as they didn't cross the line to physical violence. It's their right and they exercised it and it isn't up to me or anyone else to say otherwise. Do you know why I defended them despite the vile garbage they spewed? Because they never target a specific person. They generalized and kept their sick rantin away from a specific individual.

That's the difference here. People who say this garbage in online games use it to attack a specific person. They call people these things in order to degrade that specific person. That's the line that shouldn't be crossed in the name of protectin speech and that's the line I stand at.

Related note. The argument that I'm intolerant because I don't tolerate intolerance is probably the most overused nondefense ever. Please think of a better one.

This, but also more to it.
see, this is the bottom line. the idea of hate speech, slurs, blah blah, you know, people can use it.

BUT

if someone in game says "player X isa --------------------------------------------"(fill in with preffered slang) then there is a problem.

NOT a problem with the actual words, BUT a problem of harassment. Calling out a specific player repeatedly, beyond trash talk I mean, is the issue.

I could go on team chat, and say " I dont like homosexual people." Should I get banned? OMG I hope people dont actually think so. now if I pick out one player and lay into them about whatever, repeatedly during the match? Yeah, someone should report me.

It really shouldnt be that hard to know the difference between people just saying ****, and people really harassing other players. Dont get so emotionally involved because someone said a naughty word. make sure if you report someone, it is for actually harassing another player.

[Fitzbattleaxe]

I don't recall seeing any racial slurs (though I don't doubt it happens), but I have noticed a fair amount of sexism from some players. I won't let it ruin my fun, but I'd really like to think that, as a community, we can be better than that. I mean even if you don't care about anything else, just think about the potential players you might be alienating. The more people there are enjoying the game, the better it is for all of us.

[Valore]

Eldagore, on 24 February 2013 - 09:41 PM, said:

This, but also more to it.
see, this is the bottom line. the idea of hate speech, slurs, blah blah, you know, people can use it.

BUT

if someone in game says "player X isa --------------------------------------------"(fill in with preffered slang) then there is a problem.

NOT a problem with the actual words, BUT a problem of harassment. Calling out a specific player repeatedly, beyond trash talk I mean, is the issue.

I could go on team chat, and say " I dont like homosexual people." Should I get banned? OMG I hope people dont actually think so. now if I pick out one player and lay into them about whatever, repeatedly during the match? Yeah, someone should report me.

It really shouldnt be that hard to know the difference between people just saying ****, and people really harassing other players. Dont get so emotionally involved because someone said a naughty word. make sure if you report someone, it is for actually harassing another player.

I like that argument, but its inherently flawed.

So what happens if someone somehow determines another player is for example homosexual. And he begins to continuosly make non-directed anti-homosexual sentiments.

The other player's experience is definitely degraded. As is the experience of all the other non-neanderthal players who are all similarly annoyed and have to suffer through his nonsense. Are you telling me that he should not be banned because he's within the guidelines of 'standard internet douchery', but has avoided crossing into 'unacceptable harrassment'? That's farcical.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Darknight99, on 24 February 2013 - 09:02 PM, said:

I wanna know why americans are all lumped into one sum. That seems abit closed minded do you think? We are all different nationalities with different back grounds. Just because you experienced one person doesn't mean everyone is the same. I Know and have delt with people that are far more offensive than most. And yes I am an american!

Because Americans make themselves easy targets with their white knighting. They should pay more attention to their own problems than (the real ones, not the ones about who Kardashian is ******* this time). And being in a college town, it's a target rich environment.

When college aged Americans pull their head out their ***** and grow some thick skin and realize life sucks then you die, then I'll have more respect for them.

My location, "the landmass between LA and AL" shows how intellectually lacking most Americans are, that the news agencies can't figure out that location is called "Mississippi."

And those are why Americans are lumped into the "full ******" category.