163 replies to this topic

[Oy of MidWorld]

Tarman, on 14 March 2013 - 03:03 AM, said:

When TDM is an actual game mode then you can have a point. Until that game mode exists within the actual game then actually you are doing it wrong if you ignore or bemoan cap-based gameplay. I am sure most of the flak gets kicked up because some people who want TDM, try to play TDM right now; and then complain about the other modes and the players who are actually playing those modes instead of realizing that their favoured game mode does not yet exist.

Wait for Solaris.

Solaris is exactly NOT what i'm talking about. On small maps TDM would actually really suck.

But i think you're right about that flak thing. You said i'm doing it wrong, but bottom line is that you can't really do much about me doing it wrong. It's kind of sad for both of us. If i can't be bothered to play an objective i feel is silly, and think: "Meh, this is weak ****, i'm just gonna let em cap and jump into another match which might be more fun," you have every right to be pissed if you're on my team, but i still don't care. And sometimes my buddies and i do just that. We don't care about losing a match, we still win more than we lose, but it's no good for the enjoyment of either you or us.

So the flak is basically generated by people who want to play the assault mechanic and those who don't, getting on each others nerves, and then getting vocal about it in chat. This is why i'd love to have TDM, so everyone can play what he likes most.

Mercules, on 13 March 2013 - 07:16 PM, said:

Can you please explain what strategic options it opens?

My mates and i try out alternative tactics constantly, and i believe many of them would still work, even if the enemy team was not glued to a failsafe location by a capping mechanism. I don't mean to be rude if i say that i don't have the time to explain everything. It is actually true. So i'll try to "make you see" what i mean by linking to this video of a MechWarrior Living Legends TDM match, which i believe is very awesome. I know that it would be a very different game mechanic, and you probably wouldn't like it, but i know that i (and many others) would. It is full of tension and most entertaining.



Now i like MWO a lot better than MW:LL, but i really believe a gamemode like this one would improve it. There's really no debating about it, or making calculations like "X - Y = anything", it just comes down to "different people = different likings".

Edited by Oy of MidWorld, 14 March 2013 - 09:05 AM.

[Greyfyl]

Jasen, on 13 March 2013 - 10:47 AM, said:

In other news: Understanding objective based game-modes and playing defense is on the decline.

So why even have mechs? I thought people played mechwarrior to .........kill big stompy robots, not stand in a little square. I think everyone understands the concept of standing in the little square, most of us however are more interested in shooting at mechs than standing there watching the lights on the tower blink.

[Bilbo]

Greyfyl, on 14 March 2013 - 09:22 AM, said:

So why even have mechs? I thought people played mechwarrior to .........kill big stompy robots, not stand in a little square. I think everyone understands the concept of standing in the little square, most of us however are more interested in shooting at mechs than standing there watching the lights on the tower blink.

So go shoot the mechs that are standing on your square or, better yet, shoot them before they get there. I'm all about shooting big stompy robots but I'm under no obligation to make it easy for you to do the same.

[Ngamok]

Rylant, on 13 March 2013 - 10:58 AM, said:

Honestly, I don't see fast capping too often as being a problem; it happens sometimes, but most of the time the matches are filled with standard fights which most people play the game for. River City is a map which is particularly bad for fast caps because of the layout. If one team goes upper and the other team goes lower, a lot of times there is nothing you can do about a fast cap game because by the time you realize that the other team went the other way, it's too late.

OMG Scouts !! Besides, if you are at the top base, you can see the entire team at lower and see exactly where they are headed just by standing at the edge with thermal on. Just need 1 person to see them and say RTB or go lower or upper.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

This is what I think of every time a TDM, or at least, the TDM we should have had, ends with a cap instead of a team being wiped out.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0fsqKJzf64

I put on my mario kart OST when I play my 140k Commando. They need music for this game? Just get Nintendo's permission to use the 1992 Snes Mario Kart tracks. It rocks and they turned this into MechWarrior Kart anyway with base cap racing.

Here's me in my hanger deciding between the Commando and the Raven.

Edited by Bluten, 14 March 2013 - 01:17 PM.

[Culler]

This is why I only play Conquest now. As long as you don't let them 4-cap you there will be plenty of time for mech on mech goodness. I didn't like Conquest at first but it really is the best mode for team deathmatch. Even if your foe is focused on capping while you're focused on killing that isn't a losing strategy for either side, it comes down to who pulls it off better. I've had plenty of matches where we're badly behind in points but have 6 kills to their 2 and we get control of the points in a mad scramble and win it or sometimes we'll have killed almost their whole team and they manage to eke out a points victory with one collector they managed to hold in their last stand. I've been on the other side too of each scenario. That's good times.

[MaddMaxx]

The new bonuses aren't in until next Tuesday. Then you will be good to "Abandon Base" without the added worries of someone taking advantage of your abundant kind warmheartedness.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 14 March 2013 - 11:03 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

Translation: Base defending is waning.......

[Esplodin]

Oy of MidWorld, on 13 March 2013 - 02:48 PM, said:

Team DeathMatch haters, please understand that TDM is just something some (a lot) of us want to play. Please don't insult us by proclaiming that we are too stupid to defend a glowing square. Some of us just don't want to.

I don't think anyone here would begrudge you your love for TDM. I really hope that becomes an option soon for you and those that want it. However, the fact that you are attempting to make an entirely different game mode TDM is where the trouble lies. There is no TDM game mode yet - please stop trying to pretend the limited game modes we have is a pseudo TDM and everything is harmonious again. There is no TDM, although the devs say they are working on one.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

They need to either yank the bases out of Assault entirely or make a new mode called... oh... what's it called... oh right, TEAM DEATH MATCH?

[OneManWar]

TDM lovers, have fun chasing that lone Spider running around the map for 15 min at 150 clicks, and get ready for lots of draws!

[Esplodin]

Bluten, on 14 March 2013 - 11:33 AM, said:

They need to either yank the bases out of Assault entirely or make a new mode called... oh... what's it called... oh right, TEAM DEATH MATCH?

They already said they are working on it.

OneManWar, on 14 March 2013 - 11:36 AM, said:

TDM lovers, have fun chasing that lone Spider running around the map for 15 min at 150 clicks, and get ready for lots of draws!

Why run when you can jump to somewhere out of the way and power down?

[Tice Daurus]

For the love of all that's holy, will you guys just give it an f'n rest already!

Capping is a part of Assault!

DEAL WITH IT!

GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!

Geesh!

Edited by Tice Daurus, 14 March 2013 - 12:01 PM.

[Kain]

What a whining...,and a unoriginal thread...

Capping is a valid tactic in assault, and there is no team deathmatch so you have to deal with it...
Because people just want to win the match, and a lot of people have already enough C-bills so that is no motivation for them..

It is sometimes lame, but it is how the game mode works, you have to defend your base, it is not only pewpew,
But nevertheless, less qq more pewpew!!

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

OneManWar, on 14 March 2013 - 11:36 AM, said:

TDM lovers, have fun chasing that lone Spider running around the map for 15 min at 150 clicks, and get ready for lots of draws!

Rather that than losing to a cap timer from someone that is equally unwilling to fight. Fyi, most fights take around 10 minutes just to wipe the other out. You're not going to lose much time to fleeing cowards, especially if the timer is shortened some as well. If it was slashed to 10mins on the small maps, you'd have no issues at all.

Kain, on 14 March 2013 - 12:10 PM, said:

What a whining...,and a unoriginal thread...

Capping is a valid tactic in assault, and there is no team deathmatch so you have to deal with it...
Because people just want to win the match, and a lot of people have already enough C-bills so that is no motivation for them..

It is sometimes lame, but it is how the game mode works, you have to defend your base, it is not only pewpew,
But nevertheless, less qq more pewpew!!

We're dealing with by telling Piranha to hurry up and release a TDM mode. Then if you don't like it, you could "deal with it" by not queuing for it.

[Mercules]

Oy of MidWorld, on 14 March 2013 - 08:56 AM, said:

My mates and i try out alternative tactics constantly, and i believe many of them would still work, even if the enemy team was not glued to a failsafe location by a capping mechanism. I don't mean to be rude if i say that i don't have the time to explain everything. It is actually true. So i'll try to "make you see" what i mean by linking to this video of a MechWarrior Living Legends TDM match, which i believe is very awesome. I know that it would be a very different game mechanic, and you probably wouldn't like it, but i know that i (and many others) would. It is full of tension and most entertaining.

Okay, not to insult anyone but I saw:

1. Stick together
2. This is good ground lets stand here and hope they come to us
3. Lets move right and stick together
4. Get eyes on them and stick together
5. Wait up for the Awesome(AKA, Stick Together).

This really is what I want to try to avoid as "tactics". Which boiled down to "move as a group, find enemy, fight them". I notice the opposing force did the exact same thing as you, in that they stuck together in a clump and focus fired.

MWO with the base is the same thing except the find enemy portion of that becomes even more important and it adds in things like feints. The feint is where you have 4 members of your team behind the ridge popping shots off at those that come over it while several others are flanking and either taking their base or firing upon them.

In the video I watched, letting one slip past you would have meant someone shooting at you from a different vector. In MWO letting someone slip past you could very well cost you the game. It becomes important to out maneuver the enemy while still being sure you know where all the enemy is as you don't want a Jenner slipping off to your base while you are focus firing on that Catapult.

I saw exactly the tactics, or lack there of, I have experienced from TDM Mechwarrior in the past. MWO having two main objectives really does add more options. Options lead to more choices. Choices are what make up tactics.

[Oy of MidWorld]

Esplodin, on 14 March 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

I don't think anyone here would begrudge you your love for TDM. I really hope that becomes an option soon for you and those that want it. However, the fact that you are attempting to make an entirely different game mode TDM is where the trouble lies. There is no TDM game mode yet - please stop trying to pretend the limited game modes we have is a pseudo TDM and everything is harmonious again. There is no TDM, although the devs say they are working on one.

Totally with you on this one, no there sure as hell is nothing even close to TDM so far. Don't think anything about this community will ever be harmonious though. They did say they're working on one? Where? I must have missed it.

Mercules, on 14 March 2013 - 01:05 PM, said:

Okay, not to insult anyone but I saw:

1. Stick together
2. This is good ground lets stand here and hope they come to us
3. Lets move right and stick together
4. Get eyes on them and stick together
5. Wait up for the Awesome(AKA, Stick Together).

This really is what I want to try to avoid as "tactics". Which boiled down to "move as a group, find enemy, fight them". I notice the opposing force did the exact same thing as you, in that they stuck together in a clump and focus fired.

MWO with the base is the same thing except the find enemy portion of that becomes even more important and it adds in things like feints. The feint is where you have 4 members of your team behind the ridge popping shots off at those that come over it while several others are flanking and either taking their base or firing upon them.

In the video I watched, letting one slip past you would have meant someone shooting at you from a different vector. In MWO letting someone slip past you could very well cost you the game. It becomes important to out maneuver the enemy while still being sure you know where all the enemy is as you don't want a Jenner slipping off to your base while you are focus firing on that Catapult.

I saw exactly the tactics, or lack there of, I have experienced from TDM Mechwarrior in the past. MWO having two main objectives really does add more options. Options lead to more choices. Choices are what make up tactics.

Don't worry, no insults whatsoever in your post. You start to get as predictable as those cheese mechanics you, for some reason, refer to as tactics though. I knew that you'd try to analyze and dismiss the tactics in the video and you didn't fail me. Your stubbornness is amazing, attempts to explain therefore useless. Again, no offense intended.

Both of us just have to know that there's people out there whose opinions differ from our own. Both of us are just going to have to accept it. And, as i stated in the post before this one, i believe MWO would be a better game if both of us could play the gamemode we like better, without having to deal with each other. You wouldn't get on my nerves capping, and i wouldn't get on yours by not caring, or calling it lame.

At least you'll be safe from me in conquest mode.

Edited by Oy of MidWorld, 14 March 2013 - 03:26 PM.

[Nonsense]

GalaxyBluestar, on 14 March 2013 - 02:21 AM, said:

*misused meme picture*

capping's legit you have a base to keep and you just lost it. move on.

Yeah. See...the game mode is a placeholder. They would've done TDM but they added the base capping so people couldn't go shut down in a corner and waste peoples' time. It's not well designed and it will probably be replaced because it's boring compared to what could be.

The point is you're "winning" but it's winning in a stupid way. People talk about "nerd rage tears" or whatever...you're being idiotic...nobody's sad because they lost, they're sad because they lost in a way that doesn't involve combat in a game based on combat.

You can "win" at a game and the game might be stupid. It's like winning at tic tac toe or something. Most children can take the game to a cat's game every time...there's nothing engaging about it once you figure it out. Same goes for cap wins in assault. Sure it might be enjoyable in an organized team environment where you can prepare for it, but that isn't the case with pugs.

In a pug it's mostly hopeless to try and organize people via chat, so you have to either hope it doesn't happen or try and do it yourself. Sure I could (and have) gotten a group of 4 people together to just get cap win after win, but it's incredibly mind numbing and you get a LOT fewer cbills.

Furthermore, comments such as "just go play TDM if they implement it" are similarly silly. This game has a relatively small community...why split it further when assault could just be changed to have a better design that promotes fun gameplay for all styles?

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Me and this other Commando were racing towards a cap. Then he threw a red turtle shell at me and zoomed past. I lost that game to points. Sad day.

And those god.damn moles leaping up from out of the holes to make me wreck. I hate that. Get out of my way moles. This is a race track!

[Glythe]

Spheroid, on 13 March 2013 - 10:42 AM, said:

XP farming is stupid, don't people want the money more? I know I sure do.

Some people grind from one mech to the next until they unlock everything for every mech. If that's how they want to do it there's not much you will do to stop them. Quick base cap was always the best way to farm XP. Before they changed the rewards (not to mention RnR) it was the best way to get money for quick wins too.

Besides..... capping really foils those stupid poptarts and other cheese builds.

Edited by Glythe, 14 March 2013 - 03:33 PM.